deciding on an eclipse

[mathew82284]

ok im new to the eclipses and dsms, ive read alot about the engines and how to tune it up and upgradeing it, but i couldnt find anything about how long the engines last and tranny? im looking at a 1998 gsx eclipse with upgraded turbo, header, exhuast, bov, and fuel sytem, and some more. but it has 130,000 miles he wants 7k for it and its kbb is 6500 but i cant find any gsx's other than this one, im ready to purchase it but i just need to know how long this engine could hold up to? do they normaly hit 200000+ easly or do the engines go after 100k? also i read to do a complete tune up, i just dont want to buy this car then 10-50k miles have to put a new engine or rebuild this one, the guy said the engines last about 80k and it should have been rebuilt already but doesnt know cause he's the 3rd owner so its hard to say. i dont know much about these cars so any help would be appreshiated. thanks

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

If it's going to be your first DSM, maybe you should start off with a stock one. The one your looking seems that is is packing heat already, and maybe your just not ready for it and might just end up getting burned. I personally don't have any experience with high mileage DSMs, my 95 GSX only has 75k miles, but it has been modded most of the time. I baby my car though and always do the maintenance. I dont know why he is telling you that they need to be rebuilt at 80k miles.. these aren't rotary RX7s haha. What I do know is I've run into many owners with 100k+ miles with mods and not being rebuilt. In most cases where it needs to be rebuilt/new motor is if it crankwalks or they break something. Also if your really worried about the whole situation and the car in general, I stick to what I said in the beginning, maybe wait when stock lower mileage DSMs come around. I would wait to hear from owners with higher mileage, but that is just my opinion.

 

[ihaterice]

Mine went at 120K(200 miles after i got it). I dont think a dsm could go 200k. Not a turbo one that as been beat on a time or two.

 

[mathew82284]

If it's going to be your first DSM, maybe you should start off with a stock one. The one your looking seems that is is packing heat already, and maybe your just not ready for it and might just end up getting burned. I personally don't have any experience with high mileage DSMs, my 95 GSX only has 75k miles, but it has been modded most of the time. I baby my car though and always do the maintenance. I dont know why he is telling you that they need to be rebuilt at 80k miles.. these aren't rotary RX7s haha. What I do know is I've run into many owners with 100k+ miles with mods and not being rebuilt. In most cases where it needs to be rebuilt/new motor is if it crankwalks or they break something. Also if your really worried about the whole situation and the car in general, I stick to what I said in the beginning, maybe wait when stock lower mileage DSMs come around. I would wait to hear from owners with higher mileage, but that is just my opinion.

well this would be my first dsm, but i actually owned a 03 cobra with 550hp so its not going to be anywhere as fast. that car got stolen and im not into them as much ive always wanted an eclipse, but id like a car to last me at least another 50k before it breaks, what should i check for when checking the car out? how much would a engine rebuild cost? and a tranny rebuild cost?

 

[Primaveria]

I am interested to get people thought on this as well, since my GSX is approaching 130,000, and is losing compression in at least one cylinder.

 

[dsm023]

IMO it all depends on how well the car was taken care of. I have one with 250,000 miles on it and boosting 16 pounds daily with no problems!

 

[MrBoxx]

Maybe the guy who said it should be rebuilt after 80k miles was thinking it was an RX7?

I'm on 160k on the stock 7-bolt and stock tranny with no rebuilds so far. And this motor is one that the dealership has diagnosed with crankwalk, and it's still running strong with no symptoms. I'm pretty sure that it could go 200k with only minor maintenance. Honestly, I haven't done a compression check on my car, but that's something on my to-do list.

If you get it, by a "complete tune-up", most DSM'ers will take to mean the following: spark plugs, plug wires, oil change, and timing belt/water pump change. Doing all that at the dealership could run over $600-700, mostly because of the timing belt and water pump change.

Even IF it dies on you in the next, say 40k miles, that just means you can upgrade to a stronger six-bolt engine or a built stroker engine, or a race engine and be good for another 150-200k miles. Some people have bad luck, some people have good luck.

 

[mathew82284]

Maybe the guy who said it should be rebuilt after 80k miles was thinking it was an RX7?

I'm on 160k on the stock 7-bolt and stock tranny with no rebuilds so far. And this motor is one that the dealership has diagnosed with crankwalk, and it's still running strong with no symptoms. I'm pretty sure that it could go 200k with only minor maintenance. Honestly, I haven't done a compression check on my car, but that's something on my to-do list.

If you get it, by a "complete tune-up", most DSM'ers will take to mean the following: spark plugs, plug wires, oil change, and timing belt/water pump change. Doing all that at the dealership could run over $600-700, mostly because of the timing belt and water pump change.

Even IF it dies on you in the next, say 40k miles, that just means you can upgrade to a stronger six-bolt engine or a built stroker engine, or a race engine and be good for another 150-200k miles. Some people have bad luck, some people have good luck.

ok how can i do a compression test? what can i buy to check the compression before i buy it. also is there anything i can check to see if its been abused? or anything? also im not good with 4cyl engines this is new to me, whats the difference between a 6 bolt and a 7 bolt? also i live in ca is there any way they could tell i swapped the engine?

 

[MrBoxx]

6-bolt engine=1g (1989-92 years only, I believe) engine. It has six bolts that hold the flywheel to the crank. All later years of 4g63 had 7. The 2g 7-bolts are a little infamous for a little problem we like to call "crankwalk." Do a search for that and you'll find more than you ever wanted to know, and it might even scare you away from these cars.

To do a compression test, you need a compression testers. I've seen basic testers for about $15-20 and nicer kits for about $50 if you want to test just about any type of car out there. Basically, you screw the tester hose into the spark plug well and crank the car for a few revolutions. Have a friend read the pressure gauge to see the compression. Here is a vfaq that tells you how to do a compression test, and here is how to do a leak-down test, which is something that you might do after a compression test, though it's a bit more involved and requires special equipment. That's a bit off-topic anyway. Any car owner with nothing to hide about the car they're selling should have no problem with you requesting to do a compression test before you buy their car.

With engine swaps, you may have problems in California. I'm not from there so I don't know the exact laws regarding engines, but what I have heard is that the engine you swap in must be newer than the car (California emissions experts, please verify?) so in the case of a six-bolt swap, you'd be out of luck. I'm sure there's a way, though.

Edit: Regarding previous-owner abuse: Take it for a test drive. Make sure the clutch doesn't feel spongy. Listen to the engine for any unusual noises. All 4g63's will have what is called "lifter tick" which is a rapid ticking just under the valve cover. Sometimes it goes away when the car is warmed up, sometimes not. If it's had good oil all it's life or if the lifters have been replaced with the revised 3rd gen units, it may not even have lifter tick. Take off the intake and check the turbo for shaft play. (Do this with the engine cold and not running, please.) Stick your fingers in the compressor inlet of the turbo and try to wiggle the compressor wheel in and out, up and down, side to side. If there's a little play in it, it may need to be replaced soon. There are plenty of other things to check for, I'm sure, but I can't think of any more. These are just the simple things.

 

[MelloEclipse]

well i'm the weirdo stuck with the RS, but i'd agree with some of the others, you might want to wait til you can find one that's pretty stock. With 3 owners, and those mods, god knows what's been done to it, and what's been halfway done.

Like i said, mine's a RS, and i know another RS that had 225k without ever having a rebuild, but i'm sure turbo changes this greatly.

if you do decide to get it, at least try to talk him down to KBB's 6500

good luck with your decision

 

[Galaxy]

There's so many variables to take into account when asking that question that we cannot give you a good answer.It all depends on how well te car was taken care of before you acquire it.

I would suggest you take it to the dealer or preferably a mechanic you trust for a pre- purchase inspection.

 

[redg1clipse]

My n/t motor went out at 122502 miles. and i was ready to get a new tranny also. from my experiance with me and my friends. i've come to find. cars that have upgrades. have got the crap beat out of them because they have been pushed to the limits. and i found out the hard way. i had to take my 6 bolt out and by a new 7 bolt. just to find out my 6 bolt is fine and sitting in my garage.not trying to be a prick, im just saying. if mines bad. i think a gsx will be burnt out if it has upgrades. But i highly agree with galaxy. you need to take it to a dealer or something to have it checked out, becuase then they will see how it is. hope ya get a good buy man.

cody

 

[ZiggysDSM]

Buy a 1g they look cooler

 

[MelloEclipse]

Buy a 1g they look cooler

 

[Pennywise]

You would not have a header in a turbocharged car, but a turbo manifold instead. 3 owners and 130k, if you mod i give it less then 15k.

 

[mathew82284]

You would not have a header in a turbocharged car, but a turbo manifold instead. 3 owners and 130k, if you mod i give it less then 15k.

Ok i called him back today and everything seems good, he is actually the second owner, i think ill go look at this car and see if i like it and see how it runs and stuff. also should i look arround? i really want a gsx but ive only seen 2 in my area one is a 95 with 160k and alot of mods and this one is newer with less miles. also if i decided to get a gst how much would i cost to make it all wheel drive? do i really need all wheel drive? id like to run low 13's some day thats enough for me. would a gst keep traction enough to handle this with no problem or would i need some really good tires?

 

[Pennywise]

The absolute worst thing you can do is not be patient looking for the right car. you could end up with a peice of crap because you just bought the car on an anxious whim. do not even consider the fact of spending the money on converting it to AWD when you don't even have the car. you do not need AWD though mostly all DSMr's prefer it. If you are looking for a 13 second street car a FWD is fine, plus they are faster from a roll, and best of all there is less shit to break. as far as traction stiff motor mounts, good springs and adj shocks, really nice tires and pratice driving it.

 

[mathew82284]

The absolute worst thing you can do is not be patient looking for the right car. you could end up with a peice of crap because you just bought the car on an anxious whim. do not even consider the fact of spending the money on converting it to AWD when you don't even have the car. you do not need AWD though mostly all DSMr's prefer it. If you are looking for a 13 second street car a FWD is fine, plus they are faster from a roll, and best of all there is less shit to break. as far as traction stiff motor mounts, good springs and adj shocks, really nice tires and pratice driving it.

see the thing is i havnt rushed ive been waiting 2 months and this is the first gsx to pop up other than the 95 160k one. there verry rare here for some reason. i see alot of gst thats why i asked that. well the thing is i se gst's go for about 5k good conditon and a gsx would cost about 8k so i figured converting it, or would convertin it cost more than 3k? i have 8.5k cash to work with here

 

[Pennywise]

damn you could build a HELL of a 1g with that I would wait to find a NICE GSX rather then convert it. I looked for about a year for a nice 1G and never found one. i got into two other cars then out of no where my DSM poped up 4 years later.

 

[mathew82284]

damn you could build a HELL of a 1g with that I would wait to find a NICE GSX rather then convert it. I looked for about a year for a nice 1G and never found one. i got into two other cars then out of no where my DSM poped up 4 years later.

yea i understand that, but i have a rental right now and need to give it back, and i need to purchase a car otherwise ill have trouble getting to work, i need to find on by next weekend, hopefully i can find a nice one, im going to check it out today and see how good of a deal it is. i forgot to ask. how to i check for crank walk? also what causes crankwalk and how can i prevent it? i live in ca so a 6 bolt swap isnt possible

 

[Pennywise]

SEARCH there is so many posts out there for crankwalk.

 

[MrBoxx]

Ordinarily, I'd say search too, but there ARE a lot of threads out there about crankwalk; perhaps too many.

Here's the short and skinny on CW: Basically, for still-unknown reasons (all DSM'ers have their theories, and Mitsu doesn't even say for sure, unless things have changed) the crank thrust bearing and the crank shaft stop fitting together like they should and the crank begins to move back and forth longitudinally. Not a big deal; a little movement is okay, same with turbocharger shafts. BUT, there's this thing called a Crank Angle Sensor that keeps track of... you guessed it, the angle of the crank. Eventually, the crank begins to chip away at this sensor and make a "ticking" noise, which some people new to DSM's automatically assume is the cause of the sound of lifters ticking, which is actually quite normal by contrast. In time, the crank will "walk" far enough to break the whole sensor off, and the car will of course, shut down.

The fix: Replace the short block, simply. Mitsubishi wanted to sell me a $4000 short block + labor to install it. For that price, I get all stock pistons, rods, and stock 7-BOLT CRANK. Of course, they say that they have a company "rework" the block to make it "stronger" so that it won't crankwalk again. Uh huh... riiiight. For that money, I could buy a built 6-bolt engine and not worry about anything and STILL have a better engine. Some people have gotten away with replacing the crank and bearings, I believe.

Prevention: Regular oil changes, proper oil pressure and level, and disconnecting the federally-mandated clutch safety switch are supposed to all help keep CW away. Not upgrading to a heavy clutch like an ACT 2600 also helps, supposedly. But of course, every case seems to be different. Some stock 2g's cranwalked after 40k from the dealership driven by a 40 year old secretary, and some see the drag strip every weekend and never walk.

If you want AWD, wait and find a GSX. With $8.5k to play with, I'm sure you can find one within a week. I found three for that price for a guy in Boston, so I'm sure you can find one that you'll like. If you plan on getting a GST and converting it to AWD, you're setting yourself up for a lot of stress and exhaustion that you really didn't need to go through.

Good luck.

 

[mathew82284]

Ordinarily, I'd say search too, but there ARE a lot of threads out there about crankwalk; perhaps too many.

Here's the short and skinny on CW: Basically, for still-unknown reasons (all DSM'ers have their theories, and Mitsu doesn't even say for sure, unless things have changed) the crank thrust bearing and the crank shaft stop fitting together like they should and the crank begins to move back and forth longitudinally. Not a big deal; a little movement is okay, same with turbocharger shafts. BUT, there's this thing called a Crank Angle Sensor that keeps track of... you guessed it, the angle of the crank. Eventually, the crank begins to chip away at this sensor and make a "ticking" noise, which some people new to DSM's automatically assume is the cause of the sound of lifters ticking, which is actually quite normal by contrast. In time, the crank will "walk" far enough to break the whole sensor off, and the car will of course, shut down.

The fix: Replace the short block, simply. Mitsubishi wanted to sell me a $4000 short block + labor to install it. For that price, I get all stock pistons, rods, and stock 7-BOLT CRANK. Of course, they say that they have a company "rework" the block to make it "stronger" so that it won't crankwalk again. Uh huh... riiiight. For that money, I could buy a built 6-bolt engine and not worry about anything and STILL have a better engine. Some people have gotten away with replacing the crank and bearings, I believe.

Prevention: Regular oil changes, proper oil pressure and level, and disconnecting the federally-mandated clutch safety switch are supposed to all help keep CW away. Not upgrading to a heavy clutch like an ACT 2600 also helps, supposedly. But of course, every case seems to be different. Some stock 2g's cranwalked after 40k from the dealership driven by a 40 year old secretary, and some see the drag strip every weekend and never walk.

If you want AWD, wait and find a GSX. With $8.5k to play with, I'm sure you can find one within a week. I found three for that price for a guy in Boston, so I'm sure you can find one that you'll like. If you plan on getting a GST and converting it to AWD, you're setting yourself up for a lot of stress and exhaustion that you really didn't need to go through.

Good luck.

ok thanks for all that information, today i looked at the car and everything is good, the car had no leaks that i could see, the oil was brown, no sludge under cap, either he know what to clean or he takes care of it, also i didnt hear any ticking sound from the engine but i heard a ticking sound comming from the back seat some where. is this where you would hear the crank walk? it should be ticking in the engine bay right? also, he is the 3rd owner but the second owner was his brother, it has upgraded fuel rails too, it pulls pretty good i liked it, he has the stock intercooler though, i guess thats a good thing? but yeah this friday on my day off im going to take that car to mitsubishi first before giving him any money, im going to have them do a multipoint inspection and a compression test, how much would that cost? also he just replaced all smog equipment and it passed with a pretty much 7's or below. also what compression is good for a 130k motor?

 

[MrBoxx]

Compression standard for a 2g 4g63 is about 178 psi. Service limit is 133 psi. Anything around 150-160 is pretty good, I'd say, and you want to try to have all 4 cylinders within 14-15 psi of each other.

As for how much a dealership would charge for a multi-point inspection, I have no clue. It's really up to the dealership and how much they charge per diagnosis, what you have them do, and how much of a break they might give you since you're going to be their future customer. If you make friends with the guys in the parts dept. they sometimes give you good deals on stuff.

No ticking in the engine bay is a good thing. Ticking in the back seat? Could possibly be the fuel pump making noise or a speaker rattle, which is pretty common. DSM's are quirky cars, to say the least, especially when it comes to weird noises. You get used to it after a while.

 

[4BangR-x]

170,000 on my 95 GSX and counting, not one problem