Car potential / Engine Swaps

[skonka]

Hi all, new to the DSM forum. I've searched the forums quite a bit but didn't see any answers to my questions but if I've missed something please don't flame...

With my son nearing driving age and being into street rodding, etc. myself, I'm looking at the potential of an import build. There's DSM down the street that has been sitting for many years. I'm contemplating using it for a father/son build. I've done some creative research without confronting the owner(s). It's a 1990 Eclipse GS 5 speed with 144K. I've heard that the motor is blown. The car is not beat to shreds but it needs work.

Want to clear some questions before I make any possible approach (knowing I'll nearly get it for free or it's not going to happen). I believe being a GS it's a 1.8 instead of the 2.0. Of course, I want to put the 2.0 and possibly a turbo in it (at some point). Here are my questions:
1) Did the 1.8 and 2.0 use the same block? Is it just bore/stroke differences?
2) Can anyone define for me the different engine codes? Possibly a good addition to the newbie forum? It's all greek to me...
3) Did the 1.8 and 2.0 use the same trans and/or will the 2.0 bolt up to the current trans?
Fabrication doesn't scare me but I'd like to know what I am getting into.

Thanks for any help...

Scott

 

[crankbender]

Hi all, new to the DSM forum. I've searched the forums quite a bit but didn't see any answers to my questions but if I've missed something please don't flame...

With my son nearing driving age and being into street rodding, etc. myself, I'm looking at the potential of an import build. There's DSM down the street that has been sitting for many years. I'm contemplating using it for a father/son build. I've done some creative research without confronting the owner(s). It's a 1990 Eclipse GS 5 speed with 144K. I've heard that the motor is blown. The car is not beat to shreds but it needs work.

Want to clear some questions before I make any possible approach (knowing I'll nearly get it for free or it's not going to happen). I believe being a GS it's a 1.8 instead of the 2.0. Of course, I want to put the 2.0 and possibly a turbo in it (at some point). Here are my questions:
1) Did the 1.8 and 2.0 use the same block? Is it just bore/stroke differences?
2) Can anyone define for me the different engine codes? Possibly a good addition to the newbie forum? It's all greek to me...
3) Did the 1.8 and 2.0 use the same trans and/or will the 2.0 bolt up to the current trans?
Fabrication doesn't scare me but I'd like to know what I am getting into.

Thanks for any help...

Scott

If I am not mistaken the GS was available with the 2.0 and the RS had the 1.8 in that year. You will be able to tell if you look at the engine bay at all. The 2.0 has DOHC (dual over head cams) the 1.8 has SOHC (single over head cam).

#1 totally different blocks and heads. About the only thing you may be able to use on both is the ISC (idle speed controller) and that is not 100% sure.

#2 the engines we usually deal with are
4G63 - 2.0 Liters, DOHC, stock turbo motor. Has a thicker cylinder head so it better for extreme boost levels. This engine was available in the 6 and 7 bolt versions. This refers to the number of bolts on the flywheel. The 90-92 had 6 bolt motors, the 92-94 had 1g 7 bolts, the 95-99 had 2g 7 bolts. In general people consider the 6 bolt crank to be more reliable.
4G64 - 2.4 Liters, SOHC (but can use the 4G63 DOHC head). These were found in everything from mighty maxes to some 2g verts (convertibles).
G4CS - 2.4 liters...basically a 4G64 but is a 6 bolt replacement instead of a 7 bolt replacement.

the hybrid engines just switch cranks around
2.3 4G64 crank in a 4G63 block.
2.1 4G63 crank in a 4G64 block. (better stroke to rod length ratio with custom long rods)
2.4 race hybird 4G63 head on a 4G64/G4CS block. More low end torque.

those are the most commonly talked about here....don't even think of modding a 1.8 they suck.

#3 no totally different setups. the change from 1.8 to 2.0/4 should not be taken lightly.

 

[DevilSperm]

this may sound stupid but how close did you get to look at it to see it was a GS? cuz on the 90's (maybe other 1g eclipses) it says GS and underneath it says turbo....just something that came to mind while reading your post.

 

[crankbender]

look at the exhaust tips.
2 = turbo...

 

[dave99gst]

look at the exhaust tips.
2 = turbo...

wrong , my 91 NT has 2 tips stock.
if its a GS its a 2.0 ...if you have plans on turbo'ing it in the future its still a pita.

 

[skonka]

Thanks for the quick replies guys. Sounds like I need to get a better look at it. I don't know these people well and happened to go over there the other day to discuss the car. They weren't home so I snooped around it briefly. I haven't seen under the hood. As I said, the car has been sitting and we live in a wooded area, so you can imagine, it has this layer of nasty. It was unlocked so I opened the door to check the mileage and take a glance around, that was it.

I could be wrong but by the looks of the car, with steel wheels / hubcaps, lack of body effects, etc. I doubt it's a turbo. But hearing that it might be the DOHC 2.0 is reassuring. Was the N/A DOHC 2.0 the same motor as the Turbo DOHC 2.0 with less compression?

Thanks again. I'll be back when I find out more about it...

S

 

[DevilSperm]

the n/t has more compression and lacks the oil squirters in the block.

 

[crankbender]

wrong , my 91 NT has 2 tips stock.
if its a GS its a 2.0 ...if you have plans on turbo'ing it in the future its still a pita.

DOH I believe I was thinking 2g....then again I could just be plumb imagning things.

doing the converstion to turbo is not worth the work IMHO. It is easier to start with a turbo vehicle (all correct ancillary equipment) with a blown motor/tranny and just replace them. It is cheaper this way most of the time too.

Also if you plan on making any reasonable power get hte AWD. You will be very nervous about letting your son drive even a moderate hp FWD with you in the car. Now imagine him out with his buds on a friday night.....

Do yourself a favor and allow yourself to get some sleep. Get a decent tsi-awd and go from there. Do the mods slowly giving yourself and your son time to learn about the oddities of the DSM. Then once you break everything once and have to replace it with the race parts you begin to have a serious car.