95 GSX / 97 GST Spyder

[spyderdrifter]

If you ever need help dude, let me know. Not far at all.

Definitely, I still got your number.

I remember seeing that add when I was looking for another DSM. Seemed like a pretty decent start with everything it came with. Hopefully the engine ends up being good, and they didnt try and start it with a loose timing belt.

And just so you know, theres a shop in Aurora called Heads by Drew. He only does heads. He's built 2 heads for me and does a great job. I know you were having problems with a machine shop years ago.

Goodluck man, Ill be fallowing this thread.

The car is decently solid so far, and it did come with some quality parts. Since the belt is loose like that, and a few other reasons, I'm pulling the engine out and tearing it down before deciding to use it. Not gonna trust it just because I was told it was good, and definitely not after seeing that.


I'm gonna attempt to tinker with it today after work, depending on how tired I get. I need to get my other dollies out from under the Mighty Max so I can flip the Spyder around.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Got the interior cleared out of parts and junk, and it definitely needs a lot of cleaning.

I gave it a quick first clean and it turned out good, for now. I'll clean everything even more once I pull the interior out. Don't need any hidden filth lingering around.

I will be in the market for a full black interior swap if anyone has or know of someone willing to sell.

Replaced the white center garnish with a black one I still had since I like this look more.

 

[Fyke]

Thanks for giving some motivation to go out in the garage in work on mine a bit today!

 

[spyderdrifter]

Think I'll hit you up to see if you got some spyder parts.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Got the car flipped around a couple nights ago and pulled the eng/trans out.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Beginning Tear-Down:

A couple nights ago I decided to clean out the trunk and found that the spare tire well is dented in pretty good. Hadn't noticed it before, and now wondering if there's more I didn't see. Should be able to knock it back out at least, eventually.

Last night I made some time to pull the trans off, and found a full ACT setup, never ran.

Pulled off the valve cover too. Anyone have an idea of what cams these could be? I assume oem spec, but I've never seen these markings before, so I don't know. They also look new and un-used. Got some ARP head studs in there too.

FP manifold

 

[Fyke]

Those definitely don’t look stock to me. I’d assume they have some other markings somewhere like the cam gear surface of the cam.

https://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/cams-es-4604.494388/

Here’s a thread I found. Most likely BC, HKS, or Crower. Might be worth popping timing off real quick to check.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Timing belt is loose anyway, so perfect time to check it. Thanks for the info. I've never had to ID cams before, so I definitely appreciate that. I'd be amazed if they were HKS. Been wanting those cams for a long time.





*** Went and looked, I got Crowers, not sure which model, but I'm sure I can research that from here.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Little Disappointments:

I started pulling the engine apart a bit to see what all is installed, clean it up, ect...

I've never understood people's desire to build their engines, and cut corners at the same time just to save money. I would never allow crap like this for my cars.

Rusty balancer.

Rusty idler pulley.

Glue holding the gasket on the pump.

I can't stand the cork pan gasket.

Cam gear missing hardware

Looked it all over and wasn't expecting (a little) it to still have oem bottom internals based on the camshafts, and head studs. The turbo setup is just a 16G so some of these parts are over kill for what seems more like a stock build.

I've had this compression bolt for the belt tensioner for years and never used it. Always done 6 bolt builds. It was worth keeping.

I also dug deeper on the Crower Cams. The part numbers stamped in them suggest they're Evo8 race only cams. I looked back at the pics and noticed whoever installed them put the intake cam on the exhaust side, and vice-versa. Is this normal since they are for the Evo variant of the engine?

This cam part number is invalid on Crower's website though. Kinda odd.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Almost, but not quite...

I've been putting things off with this car due to several personal issues I can't control. I finally reached the end of letting it happen, so I am planning to have the spyder running and drivable by my birthday next month. I decided to make that a priority goal since I know I can make it happen, and for my current mental state, it's needed. So here's what I've done the past 2 days...


I'm ditching the 7-bolt in favor for the 6-bolt I've already built. Yes, I prefer the 6-bolt, but that's not why I decided this. The 7-bolt needs to be properly ripped apart and rebuilt the right way. Not with what it has currently. I couldn't let myself just run it. I've been slowly putting parts on the 7-bolt just to make sure I got everything before dropping it in, get water and oil lines sorted out, ect...

...it didn't really work out for me. The engine is too dirty for my liking as well, and really just don't want to clean it right now. Since I have mostly 6-bolt parts, and have built more of them than 7-bolt engines, it just made more sense to do it. Plus my 6-bolt is ready to drop in, so I thought...

Tonight I was on my way to getting the final parts on so I could pull the engine off the stand, throw on the flywheel, clutch, & trans. Then I realized I don't have the proper flywheel bolts. Got them ordered, so I'll have them in a week maybe. Hopefully by next Friday (my weekend) so I can continue and get it in the car. Small oversight, but it's ok.

I installed the Kiggly crank sensor kit I bought for a different engine, but decided to keep for me. Routed the wire harness behind the tensioner and tensioner bracket. I really didn't think that spot would work out, but it did. Was going to throw on the oem 2g cam sensor, but found out the Kelford cams I bought don't have the threaded bolt hole on the sensor side of the cam. So I gotta research that a bit more.

I also got the engine timed, and didn't have the same problem I did last time I tried. Last time, 2 years ago, I couldn't get the timing set at all. Figured it was due to the cam gears. I've done nothing to the gears, and today I got timing set on the first try. No idea why I couldn't before.

I put new fluid caps in that I forgot I still had.

More to come soon....

 

[spyderdrifter]

Electronics Overhaul...

While I'm waiting for my flywheel bolts to ship out, I decided to pull out all the gauges the P/O installed. I got my own that I like more, and wasted money on, so time to use them.

I'm installing the Prosport Evo gauges that I've had for a couple years and never fully used. Gonna have the oil pressure gauge up in the cluster, and my wideband, boost, and temp gauges in the center where the radio used to be. Not much of a fan of the pillar location, it attracts too much nosy attention. The car had a Greddy Profec installed, so I'll retain that unit and install it under the center gauges. It also has a turbo timer installed, but I've never had the need for one, so I'm not sure if I'll keep it or junk it.

Threw an old cluster in that still has my LED mods. Gotta do the same again for the HVAC and all the switches, in time.



Cleaned up A pillar. Not sure why people leave this much wiring under the dash. They could easily splice the wires and make it a cleaner install.

On the same note, I'll never understand why cutting corners is an option for wiring. This is just retarded...

 

[jjw205]

Wow, a blast from the past! Just got mine uncovered for the first time in 6 years, hoping to get it on the road. Hopped on here for some motivation, and got it. Thanks!

 

[spyderdrifter]

I needed the motivation too. Bought this car early this year, and let it sit covered for months. Couldn't bring myself to work on it. Ended up forcing myself because I knew I needed it for my own happiness.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Continuum...

The engine is finally in! Flywheel bolts arrived today, so got the flywheel, clutch, and trans installed and dropped it all in the car. Done for the night. Gonna go help a friend with his car in the morning, so I may not work on mine, not sure yet, but this hurdle is done.

 

[Pjj]

Theres just something about a white 2g

 

[spyderdrifter]

4-Day Weekend Update...

I just got done with a very unplanned 4 day weekend, and managed to spend some time working in the garage. The PO cut the middle support out for the hood latch assembly, likely for the FMIC that came with the car. I don't know why it seemed worth doing to him, but I never would have. I now have the assembly supported with an adjustable rod I bought earlier this year but never used. I'm not too terribly annoyed with this since one day I'd like to build a tubed front end for a few reasons, so this will work for now.

Then I threw the bumper on to see how it fit, and it seems to be good.

Decided to relocate the battery to this location. I haven't done anything to it except move the battery in, but there's plenty of room for it. I do need to drop the top to make sure it will clear for room as well. This area will eventually be made more weather-proof than OEM as I also plan to convert to an electric A/C compressor, and it too will call this area home. This area "should" be weather-proof due to the electrical components already housed in the area, but I know through past experiences to not just accept that as truth.

I replaced the entire shifter assembly with one that I already had that's in much better condition, and threw in the solid bushings I had for it as well. While the center console was out, I started wiring up the gauges and installed the fuse block I bought a couple years ago. Sadly the lugs on the ends for the main wires were sh!t, and broke, so I pulled the block apart and modified it to (hopefully) never fail again.

I only noticed those lugs were crap as I decided to mount the block with the ground side facing forward since the battery will be in the back, and make less work for cable length, and I decided to use a bigger gauge cable as well. I'll be posting more in the next week probably. I start my short vacation in 2 weeks, and plan to get a lot done during my 9 days off.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Running Longer...


Been off vacation for a couple weeks, and didn't get an update posted. Also didn't take as many pics as I thought I would, but that's ok. To start, I didn't get the car running as I had intended, and although that kinda sucks, I'm not really upset about it. I needed the adapter harness for the 6-bolt/2G combo and they were out of stock through ExtremePSi. So I bought the 3 connectors I needed, and decided to build my own harness like I had done the 1st time I used a 6-bolt. However, I made a very important error in doing so. The connector that plugs into the factory cam sensor location, was the wrong side, because the side I needed was the sensor side, which no one makes, that I've seen. So I had to suck it up and buy the adapter harness from STM, which cost $100 vs $75 from ExtremePSi. Whatever, I need it, and it's due to arrive in 2 days. *EDIT* Harness arrived last night.

In the meantime, I've gotten other things done, slowly, but methodically. Just taking my time. I got the various sensors installed that run to my Prosport gauges, and got the gauges finished up and working with the fuse block I installed under the center console. I also swapped out the gauge cluster with an old one that already had my LED mods done and the oil pressure gauge installed in place of the oem one. I'm happy with the outcome so far. Might change things in time, but not sure on that. I'm sure I'll change my mind about something sooner or later.

I do still have the Dodge Avenger center console I bought for the old GSX, but haven't really decided if I'm going to use it or not. For now no, but don't k ow for certain.

I did buy new bolts for the valve cover, the VC gasket set, new spark plug wires, & upstream o2 sensor. Got those all installed and have gotten closer to completion. I did finally receive my shift bushing set and billet reservoir brackets from GSX-DUDE, and installed it all last night. The wait on shipping was horrible as I ordered these parts in May, and just now got them in Oct, but not mad about it, just happy to have my order. The bushing set was well worth the money. All the additional play in the linkage is gone. Shifter feels nice and solid, so I'm happy with it. Got the brackets in as well. Just as nice as the last set I bought from him (and sold unfortunately). Already had a new clutch reservoir, and now need to find a new brake reservoir, but if I recall right, they're now discontinued and out of stock. I cleaned up the one from the car and it at least looks a bit better.

I got the axles in as well and got the underside of the engine work done with the oil drain, the brace for the front roll stop, clutch slave installed, and FINALLY, got the car off the wheel dollies and sitting on its tires.

Since then I've gotten the wire harness hooked up as well. Found out I need another alternator as the one i put in, doesn't use the connector that the harness has. So it's probably from a 2GA model. Small oversight. Aside from that, I need to buy intake parts, coolant parts, the oil cooler, and finish up the SMIC. So things are getting closer, and I'm being patient with taking my time...

 

[Dihtung Glava]

Been off vacation for a couple weeks, and didn't get an update posted. Also didn't take as many pics as I thought I would, but that's ok. To start, I didn't get the car running as I had intended, and although that kinda sucks, I'm not really upset about it. I needed the adapter harness for the 6-bolt/2G combo and they were out of stock through ExtremePSi. So I bought the 3 connectors I needed, and decided to build my own harness like I had done the 1st time I used a 6-bolt. However, I made a very important error in doing so. The connector that plugs into the factory cam sensor location, was the wrong side, because the side I needed was the sensor side, which no one makes, that I've seen. So I had to suck it up and buy the adapter harness from STM, which cost $100 vs $75 from ExtremePSi.

I know I'm too late, but you can get all of these connectors for $2.50 from China in baggies of 5 male and 5 female. They also include the appropriate number of rubber weather seals and the metal terminals.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Almost there...

I got a new alternator, that I haven't mentioned yet. The alternator I had in the car had the square 4-pin plug, but the harness had the rectangular connector. Didn't have any of the proper connectors to put in, so I bought a new alternator. Made it simple. Got it installed, dumped oil into the engine and pulled the connector from the coils and injectors and proceeded to prime the engine. Everything checked out. Reconnected everything and attempted to fire up the engine. Nothing. Cranks, and cranks well, but no start. I'm not really upset or anything, but still want to find out what's preventing it from starting. I'm going to assume it's a fuel issue. Only assuming this because I didn't drain the tank, and have no idea how old the fuel is, and I forgot to swap out the fuel filter. That's on me. So gonna fix those little issues and try again. I also couldn't hear the pump priming either, and I got a new pump to throw in, so I'll be doing that too.



I also had my scanner plugged in during all of this, and it's not connecting to the ECU, so another issue to track down.

Edit...

And the issue is the fuel. Pulled the feed line off the rail, completely dry. Got the pump unplugged and hard wired with the battery, and it sounds like it's frozen up. I get a little tap sound whenever I touch the contacts to the jumper wires, so that solves that issue, for now. I'll probably start this on my next off days (next week), and flush the lines out, install my FuelLab filter, and the Walbro pump. I do still have a GSX fuel tank though, and I'm half tempted to just install the entire tank since I will eventually do AWD on this car. Maybe I'll try the pump in that tank too, and if it works still just use that to get the spyder running for now. Too many decisions...

 

[Dihtung Glava]

I also had my scanner plugged in during all of this, and it's not connecting to the ECU, so another issue to track down.

I could be completely wrong here, but I just can't ignore the similarities between what you wrote and my experience with starting my car 4 months ago. Everything from the wrong connector on the 6 bolt/2G adapter harness to the fuel pump not running and scanner not reading the ECU. And I also had some wiring come off of a 2GA model, so I feel like I should be sharing this.

You wrote you fixed your fuel pump issue, so that's cool. If it gives you any more trouble, check the wiring at the ECU and compare it to a pinout diagram. Mine had the signal wire for the fuel pump switched up with the wire for the AC compressor for some reason.

Same with the OBD II port (assuming you are using the stock ECU and that's where you're plugging in your scanner). On mine, the signal wire got lost on its way from the ECU to the OBD port. I found it, connected to nothing, in the immobiliser box under the steering wheel and jumpered it back to the OBD port.

I wrote about it here and here. I hope at least some of this helps, once again, it could be something completely different for you, but that's how I fixed the same issues you are describing on my car.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Thanks, there's a lot of great info there. I haven't yet fixed the pump issue, just sorta got it narrowed down.

Same with the OBD II port (assuming you are using the stock ECU and that's where you're plugging in your scanner). On mine, the signal wire got lost on its way from the ECU to the OBD port. I found it, connected to nothing, in the immobilizer box under the steering wheel and jumped it back to the OBD port.

It's kinda funny to me that you mentioned this. I disable my clutch safety switch before attempting the startup, and saw that there's a connector above the clutch switch that is disconnected. Been a couple days since looking up there, but i know it was a square, white plug, that might be 4-pin. Thought about connecting it to the only obvious place it could connect, but didn't. Just decided to see how things went first. Guess it's time to plug that one in, I have no idea why it isn't already. Must have been the last owner, who knows. I appreciate the info.

 

[spyderdrifter]

The Puking Sensation...

I got the fuel pump sorted out and threw in the pump that I had in my GSX fuel tank. I don't want to use it long term, but at least to see if the engine will fire up, and to pump all the old fuel out of the Spyder's tank. Sadly it's a full tank too. I had to use a bulkhead fitting and an AN setup to get the pump assembly usable again. Even after disconnecting the oem line from under the car, I still couldn't remove the hanger from the tank without cutting the hard line. I knew I had these parts, and that I was planning the modification anyway for the eventual AWD swap, so I decided just to do it now for the FWD parts as well. Everything works now, as I finally have fuel flow to the injectors, but it still hasn't fired up. In the end that might be good since it puked oil all over the floor. Once I noticed, I found out that I never plugged the port that the OEM oil pressure sensor threads in to, so completely my fault for overlooking it. I've since put the OEM sensor in since I can't find a plug of the right size, and will just order one. I still don't know why the engine didn't fire up though. Gotta dig through it more, I could have missed something simple.

 

[miliman13]

Wow , starting from the beginning I cannot believe you found a 2G auto GSX for 1k ….. I’m crazy for one and just … wow

And since then all the amazing pics and other cars as well .. glad you came back , I recently did too and seeing this thread is so motivating!!

Looking forward to more .

Amazing cars

 

[spyderdrifter]

No Start Continues...

Been out of state the last 2 weeks on vacation to do some "self-help" and de-stress from life. But now I'm back and gotta get this thing running finally.

I put an oem oil pressure sensor into the OFH since I apparently don't have a plug for it. It'll do for now. Refilled the oil, tried starting again, and of course it didn't. With the help of using my phone for video, I checked spark, and all coils are firing. Fuel is good, although I really don't know if the injectors are firing, but fuel is reaching the rail for sure. I rechecked the mechanical timing and it all still lines up with cyl 1 @ TDC. I checked compression dry and wet, and the numbers are off, but since this engine has never fired up, and the piston rings never seating, I'm assuming that's to be expected. Anyone able to verify my thoughts on that? Dry numbers are (from 1 -> 4) 125, 130, 125 & 125; wet numbers are (from 1 -> 4) 130, 140, 140, & 130.

This being a 6-bolt, but a 97 model, I left the spark and fuel signals in the oem configuration, but I did swap the signals to double check, and no change. I'm not sure what else to check other than making sure again that everything under-hood is fully connected. Engine cranks really strong, but seems to make no attempt to fire up, just cranks. Kinda out of ideas.

 

[99dsmer4g63]

After you have tried to start it a couple times pull a plug and see if you smell any gas. Or see if you can check for the injector pulses.

If you say have spark and air and fuel to the rail it’s kinda the only thing left I’d think.

Good luck

-Daniel