420A Turbo won't start after build

[PCD_RS]

I have a 96 Eclipse RS (turbo). I just rebuilt the bottom end and installed a lightweight underdrive pulley and new t-belt. My problem is:
I set the crank to TDC; I lined up my timing marks on the cam sprockets. It cranked over and started acouple of days ago for like 10 secs then it just died on me. I started her up again she turned on then died again after about 30secs. I tried to start her yesterday and now she won't even start. The engine continues to turn and spin or whatever, but I don't hear it sparking/combusting or whatever.
I checked my coil pack and it produces a spark. I checked my fuel pressure and I have fuel pressure. I checked my fuel injector connector that connects to the injectors and they are working just fine. I checked for compression in my cylinders and I have compression. SO I know that my fuel system is working. Ignition is working. WHY is she not wanting to start????
Another problem: When you turn off your car fuel pressure is supposed to go to zero, correct? My fuel pressure stays up there around 40psi and VERY SLOWLY goes down. Does anyone know what could be the cause of this???

Guys I've done my research, and I haven't found any answers to my problem. Please help me out, I miss drivin my car

I am accepting everyone's advice; especially the DSM Wisemen on this one. Thanks in advance for anyone that replies.

 

[glowryder]

you have to be very very sure you timing is correct.. ive found these engines are bitches to time, and they need to be dead on.. i had the same problem...and uve done the right steps so far:
Spark
Fuel
compression.

i think u have a slight timing issue. but, you may want to make sure all yor connectors are secure, mainly the ones controlling start up.. the CAS and crank sensor..if those are loose/broken, it will do just what you said..
when you turn it over do you smell fuel? just to verify its actually spitting fuel thru the injector... and do you hear your fuel pump relay when u turn the key?

 

[TalonESIT]

you check for any vacuum leaks?, mainly the pcv?

 

[PCD_RS]

Yea the fuel pump i can hear go when i turn the key to the on position. And fuel is definitely being put through to the injectors. Ok, stupid question, what is CAS? Crank Angle Sensor?? I was told to check those too by a friend here. So I'll do that. Vac lines are secure I have my BOV running to the intake (the nipple that is facing out towards me when i'm looking at the engine from the front bumper). and breather filters for the valve cover nipples. Thanks bunches guys. I will check my CAS and crank sensor and see from there. I won't be able to get workin' on the car agian til tomorrow though so I'll keep you guys updated on my status.

 

[glowryder]

kool, yea, its the cam angle sensor. yea check those bad boys out, but if its spitting fuel and fire then i think its timing. if those sensors were bad it wouldnt spit fuel or fire. and a VAC leak would just cause a terrible idle, i never heard of a vac leak no causing the car to start.. but since u claim it spits fuel and fire, im guessing your timing is off, probably on the intake side, just b/c that gear (for me any way) always slips while your timing, even tho the lines were aligned, when tension goes across the belt it can sometimes move the intake cam out of sync..and probably enuf to cause a no start. it doesn't take much... after u did the t belt, did u hand crank it 2 or 3 revs to make sure the timing was still good? id go back and put it at TDC and verify that the marks are aligned..

 

[PCD_RS]

Ahhh the cam angle sensor. Kool beans. Now that you mention it... My CAS does have a crack on it... Would a crack on it effect it to the point of no firing?

I worked on it today some before I came to check on the thread. You were right about the intake cam. It was off sync and I fixed that today and did hand crank it a few times to make sure. Everything is good on timing... So my conclusion is that one of those sensors have gone bad.

 

[glowryder]

sweet, so u redid timing, and verified it, so i take it it still diDnt start? if not, the reset the ECU( un-hook battery for a bit) then hook it back up and try again. if it still doesn't then check the sensors. the crack in the sensor, it could cause problems, especially as shit vibrates around...so try the ECU reset, and if it still doesn't start, replace that sensor. GL!

 

[rstare]

CAS is your Crank Angle Sensor.
CPS is your Camshaft Position Sensor.
If either isn't sending a signal to the ecu (or the wrong signal) spark would fire at the wrong time (or not at all) and it would either be missing badly or not start, depending on how much the ignition advanced is off.
If the engine timing is off the ecu will try to compensate and your ingintion advanced will be all screwy.

It sounds like you checked your engine timing; check it agian, and then one more time to be 100% positive. Take your time, it took me a few times to get timing perfect. Once your 110% sure your timing is correct check your CAS and CPS and make sure there sending signal to the ecu.

 

[PCD_RS]

Looks like the CPS I got has flat pins rather than round pins... I got a connector for it and it has the pigtails which means I have to splice and solder. My battery went dead on me so I have to charge it back up. In that time the ECU should reset itself. Random question; How long does it usually take our ECU's to reset by the way?

And I'll check my timing again as well. Just to be 110% like you said rstare.

 

[glowryder]

good find! if u un-hook, and then pump the brakes for a few mins, + like half an hr of sitting that should do it. were u putting a 95 engine in a 96+ or vice versa? another pin issue is the coil mpack, theres flat and round pin ones just FYI, if u wanted to verify they were the right 1s too.

 

[PCD_RS]

Nah, it's the 96 engine; I just built the bottom-end. Autozone didn't have the round pins so I had to get a connector for it. The CPS and the connector combined was like $30 cheaper than what the Mitsu dealer was offering me for just the CPS. I'll keep the updates coming.

Thanks again for all the advice!!

 

[VelocitàPaola]

CAS is your Crank Angle Sensor.
CPS is your Camshaft Position Sensor.
If either isn't sending a signal to the ecu (or the wrong signal) spark would fire at the wrong time (or not at all) and it would either be missing badly or not start, depending on how much the ignition advanced is off.
If the engine timing is off the ecu will try to compensate and your ingintion advanced will be all screwy.

Actually, a 420A will run just fine without the CPS; it will not misfire . It takes a few seconds for it to start, but it will run fine. A 420A will not run at all without the CAS, though.

 

[PCD_RS]

Ok so I don't know what the heck is wrong with my car. It will crank still, but there is no firing/combustion. There is fuel being delivered, there is spark because one of my injectors was loose and it popped out and the fuel caught on fire for a second... Only thing I can think of is a bad Crank Angle Sensor now... Well I hope that is just it.

VelocitàPaola (or anyone else that knows this), would the engine not fire/combust at all if the CAS went bad?

 

[rstare]

Actually, a 420A will run just fine without the CPS; it will not misfire . It takes a few seconds for it to start, but it will run fine. A 420A will not run at all without the CAS, though.

Really? So what is the role of the CPS? I thought it contributed to ignition timing.
Thanks for the correction Paul.

 

[rstare]

would the engine not fire/combust at all if the CAS went bad?

A 420A will not run at all without the CAS, though.

No it won't run at all.

 

[glowryder]

, thats why we told you to REPLACE the sensor in question ...i thoughT u got a new CAS?

also paul, i was under the impression as well that the CAS and Crank sensor worked together as well, and would not start if ECU did not receive a signal from both to adjust timing (if needed).could this be a 95 thing only?

 

[PCD_RS]

Nah, I got a new CPS, but not a new CAS. I'll get on that and see if that is what is causing my engine not to fire.

 

[rstare]

, thats why we told you to REPLACE the sensor in question ...i thoughT u got a new CAS?

also paul, i was under the impression as well that the CAS and Crank sensor worked together as well, and would not start if ECU did not receive a signal from both to adjust timing (if needed).could this be a 95 thing only?

The CAS is the Crank Angle Sensor.
I realize our referring to the CPS.
I wanted just to clear that up for future references.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Yeah, it's a little confusing because in 4G63-land the CAS refers to the cam angle sensor. For 420A's, however, the CAS is the crank angle sensor.

The PCM uses the CAS for making all ignition calculations. It does compare the data from the CAS with that of the CPS to check for synchronization and help correct for bad timing.

 

[rstare]

Yeah, it's a little confusing because in 4G63-land the CAS refers to the crank angle sensor. For 420A's, however, the CAS is the crank angle sensor.
The PCM uses the CAS for making all ignition calculations. It does compare the data from the CAS with that of the CPS to check for synchronization and help correct for bad timing.

Lol, it's getting more confusing by the minute. I'm guessing you meant in 4G63-land the CAS refers to the cam angle sensor?

So the CPS is more of *make sure engine timing is correct* and if it's not then the ecu compensates.
Thanks for the insight Paul

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Post corrected...

 

[PCD_RS]

Ok I have an electrical bug now in my car. No clue what is causing it. I would turn the key to accessories and all the lights in the gauge cluster would turn off. Thought my battery died on me so I checked my battery and it holds a 12.39 or something voltage. So I know my battery is fine, but something is eating up all the power... Any ideas what it could be? I'm so lost when it comes to electrical stuff.

How would I chase down an electrical ghost?

 

[Locke]

Begin by inspecting for obvious visual signs of damage to the wiring.

The primary purpose of the cam sensor is to let the ECU know what stroke it is sitting at, so that the ECU can start the engine in as little as half-revolution of cranking.

 

[PCD_RS]

Ok I was talking to a friend who owns a 2nd gen RX-7... He said that if something was off on the timing on his rotary (I have very little knowledge about rotary engines); that it won't even start. It'll turn over, but it won't start. Sorry I know you guys said, check timing over and over again... Which I am going to do AGAIN!! Tomorrow because I'm a low paid college student that has homework to do... ANYWAYS!! Enough rambling... My Question is: Does the 420A have a thing(sensor or whatever) that doesn't make it start at all when timing is off? I just wanted confirmation. TIA.

 

[rstare]

Your car will run with the timing off. It won't run good, but it will run.