Will I be running rich?

[rb97GSX]

Will I be running rich if I add a Walbro 190lph fuel pump to a set up consisting of a TBE, Greddy BOV, K&N filter+hard pipe, NGK BPR7ES plugs and a manual boost controller set a 14psi?

 

[nightspeed87]

so basically get the 190 and the logger. Then get the afc it starts running bad? because I was going to say why not skip the 190 and just raise it by like 1 psi but I guess I need it. So like I said. Get the 190 + logger and then worry about the afc is things go bad?

well yea but things wont go bad from a 190 if you only raise the boost a few psi, and def get the logger before you raise boost so if you see knock you can just lower 1 psi..
The afc you wont need with your set up, but it could still be a great thing to have,
because boost is addictive, 4 or 5 months from now your probably going to want to raise boost again and go further and at that point your going to start upgradeing fuel and then will need a afc, but as long as you dont upgrade fuel beyond the fuel pump mod I doubt you will need afc. but since you have a t25 right? Then your not really going to be able to raise boost a lot anyways unless your trying to mess up the turbo quick. Talk to 2g guys about what boost theyd think your safe at in case you ever want to raise it even more in the future

Start off buying the logger, then get the pump despite some guys will say you wont really need it with your setup right now which is true, I still figure wont hurt to have, and you can get the pump for like 90 dollars ill give you a sight where i got mines if you need it and when you dropt the pump u can even do the rewire mod, so at least you know you always got enough fuel with your set up. then go from there.

 

[rb97GSX]

Thanks

 

[nightspeed87]

yea no prob... *

 

[oldman]

well another wiseman told me with the 190 i will not have to worry about fuel over run, and if it is insignificant overrun then its insignificant enough to not even be conscerned about. on a 190... I do believe 255 would cause over run to the point itd be significant but i dont know because i dont own a 255.

Every car is different so the degree of overrun will be different for different cars. Although rare, significcant enough 190 overrun isn't unheard of. I have seen several case on this forum over the years, Ricekiller happens to be one of them.

Now My car is in a full engine build stage and its going to be down untill the build up is done, so yea i dont have a safc2 yet but i will be def getting one, and i never said i wouldnt run rich, it would probably run pig rich without a safc, but since im not driving my car yet then im not worried about it, and by the time my cars done ill probably have one and a logger. And the n/t regulator actually makes the 450s flow a rate of 505 exactly not 550s. To compensate for this I also contemplated on a hacked mass. But at any rate I am def getting safc and a logger before i do to much driving on it when its done.

I've never said it will flow at 550, I was making a point that you might as well put in larger injectors without fuel management. I also wanted to make sure that you know what you were getting yourself into raising the fuel pressure by 10psi, there was absolutely no mention of fuel management in this and others threads where you posted the same thing.

I understand and appreciate your desire to help and be involved, that is what this forum is all about, but many of your posts indicated to me that you're just repeating what you heard and read without fully understanding what you're saying. This is ok when spplying to your own car but not so when you're advising others. Do you know what a fpr does and what it means when it gets overruned?

Back on topic. rb97GSX, like already said, if your max boost is 14psi you will not need a fuel pump upgrade but you should rewire the stock pump. a logger is still a good thing to have so you can keep everything in check, fuel management is only needed with larger injectors. Lastly, fpr overrun can not be tuned out by fuel management.

 

[oldman]

the afc you can do without if your not raising boost too much or adding bigger injectors or anything, but a afc could still help you because tuning is still tuning no matter what boost your running, and you may still get a little out of a afc. The logger I think you should get, more so than the fuel pump because since your not really going to raise boost too much, but I still think you should get a fuel pump because in my opinion wont hurt to have a 190. Just dont go any bigger than that. But def get a logger so you know whats going on.

Again Please explain, not what you heard, what does a safc has to do with turning up the boost? Do you know what a safc does?

 

[rb97GSX]

I heard from countless people though that if you turn your boost up at all with the stock pump you'll run lean, will rewiring it make a difference and let me kit the stock pump and set the boost to 13psi.

 

[nightspeed87]

Every car is different so the degree of overrun will be different for different cars. Although rare, significant enough 190 overrun isn't unheard of. I have seen several case on this forum over the years, Ricekiller happens to be one of them.

--- Ok maybe so but I have plenty of friends with 190s and no problem
and yea I kno every car is different but I was just giving him my opinion
and a opinion is just that.

I've never said it will flow at 550, I was making a point that you might as well put in larger injectors without fuel management. I also wanted to make sure that you know what you were getting yourself into raising the fuel pressure by 10psi, there was absolutely no mention of fuel management in this and others threads where you posted the same thing.

----And ok i understand you were just trying to make a point, but my point was I know I dont have fuel management and what I post is what I have not what Im getting, but I clarified my car isnt being driven either because a rebuild and what not so since im not driving it now Im not worried about it until I get the tuning devices.

I understand and appreciate your desire to help and be involved, that is what this forum is all about, but many of your posts indicated to me that you're just repeating what you heard and read without fully understanding what you're saying. This is ok when spplying to your own car but not so when you're advising others. Do you know what a fpr does and what it means when it gets overruned?

----And if were going back to the over run thing whether I "fully" understand it or not I
have friends with dsms with 190s and 255s and etc and we all mess with out cars together and I was telling him my "opinion" from what Ive seen in my own " experience" with that. Sometimes I ask questions on this thread that I already know the answer to because by asking it someone may tell me something different that I didnt think of or another point of view, and since Im limited to this whole newbie thread i didnt mind posting random questions, and me trying to help and participate because how else would I get rep points to get off of this newbies mess, otherwise whats the point of having all those other forums that I cant even go to.
So maybe my answers will be appreciated by someone whether i just heard it from someone else or not, and maybe that can just save them trouble of looking for the info, or at least point them in the right direction.

Back on topic. rb97GSX, like already said, if your max boost is 14psi you will not need a fuel pump upgrade but you should rewire the stock pump. a logger is still a good thing to have so you can keep everything in check, fuel management is only needed with larger injectors. Lastly, fpr overrun can not be tuned out by fuel management.

---and basically thats everything I said also you just said it different, so whether I read that somewhere or not it wasnt false information, and i should be recognized as "participating" and not just saying stuff since you seem to look at me as Im just telling stuff someone else has said but i really dont know anything.
Besides everything on this entire website already tells everything you need to know, whether it showed up in a thread before or tech quide, and everyone basically reads what they see and post about their own experiences with it, or copy and paste a link, so basically what im sayin is this is all recycled info anyways so who cares as long as its not false info. So maybe youd rather me not to post at all in trying to help someone But thanks for the insight.....

 

[oldman]

I heard from countless people though that if you turn your boost up at all with the stock pump you'll run lean, will rewiring it make a difference and let me kit the stock pump and set the boost to 13psi.

Those people are refering to 16+ psi, not 14psi. Rewiring the pump doesn't give you more fuel, it simply provides the fuel pump with consistant voltage so you don't lean out at higher rpm's, something the stock wiring is known to do.

 

[rb97GSX]

so you think I can run 13psi and then just forget about the fuel pump. BTW: this is a daily driver so I wont be pushing it much if any. o, I'll also get the logger once I get more money.

 

[oldman]

--- Ok maybe so but I have plenty of friends with 190s and no problem
and yea I kno every car is different but I was just giving him my opinion
and a opinion is just that.

In a tech threads like this, facts are needed, not opinions, at least provide opinions backed up by facts.

so basically what im sayin is this is all recycled info anyways so who cares as long as its not false info. So maybe youd rather me not to post at all in trying to help someone But thanks for the insight.....

No, that is not what I want. Like I said before, I appreciate your desired to paricipate. I would like to see you post only in subjects in which you know, provide facts, instead of just blindly repeating what you heard.

No Guessing - if you don't know the answer for sure, don't reply - we don't need you spreading misinformation. If your reply contains phrases like "I think", or "I've heard", or "everyone else does it", or "my brother's uncle's friend did it and had no problems" - it is not useful. Only post a reply if YOU know the answer from YOUR own first-hand experience. Instead of replying with a guess, post a link to a thread where the answer can be found, or the same discussion already took place.

 

[oldman]

so you think I can run 13psi and then just forget about the fuel pump.

Yes, provided that the car is well maintained and your stock fuel system is perperly functioning. With that said, this is where a logger comes in handy.

 

[nightspeed87]

In a tech threads like this, facts are needed, not opinions, at least provide opinions backed up by facts.


No, that is not what I want. Like I said before, I appreciate your desired to paricipate. I would like to see you post only in subjects in which you know, provide facts, instead of just blindly repeating what you heard.

I understand what your saying but it wasnt false info, but maybe nxt time I will just word my thread different and say from my experience on another car if that is the scenario. my fact was i seen it ran on my friends car and I help them with their cars, and they helped me with mines, so my opinion was on the fact of what Ive came in counter with on my friends car, it just didnt happen on my car because my car has been down for a while.

Anyways im glad that you understand that im at least trying to participate and ill
leave it like that and try to post on things that retain to my experience ( which half the time i do, and the times i dont like i said i need rep point... )

 

[rb97GSX]

Thanks old man, the fuel pump money can go towards my logger and yes the car is maintained well, I'll also add an a/f gauge, I only got boost for now.

 

[nightspeed87]

Thanks old man, the fuel pump money can go towards my logger and yes the car is maintained well, I'll also add an a/f gauge, I only got boost for now.

I said get the logger first, and the fuel pump is only optional with your set up like I was saying.
Also I have one of those a/f gauges and they arent accurate, most ppl call it a lightshow
I mean they can give you an idea of your a/f ratio because I was using it when I hacked
my mass a while back and it read fully lean when I did it, then I blocked off the hole completely and it read rich, and then i blocked it halfway and it read ok, but who knows because it sometimes disflunctiates.
You may want to skip the a/f ratio gauge unless you dont mind reading something that is possibly off by enough
to run you lean when it says its in the idle range. Its not consistent.
I mean theres no telling how much its off, or on but you want to be accurate with a/f ration and its not very percise.
I look at mines since thats all I have to go by, but you def could go better, maybe consider a egt gauge
and think about wideband 02 and anything in that area, even though wideband is kind of pricey. I plan on getting
a egt and doing away with the a/f gauge.

 

[oldman]

I'll also add an a/f gauge, I only got boost for now.

Save your money on that as well, it's mostly just blinky light show.....mostly.

 

[jibberishballr]

So what you mean here, don't get the logger, or afc?

I'd get the logger before anything. The SAFC wouldnt hurt, but he said he has no plans for modding so i was thinking of saving money.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

If you must buy a guage get a boost guage. I have an a/f guage and its a light show for sure.

 

[nightspeed87]

i think he said he has a boost gauge. Just save up for your logger then go from there.

 

[DGajre777]

Nightspeed, if you are talking about me on the info about the 190, go back to all my threads. I never said that a 190 doesn't cause fuel overrun, I said that you can get away with a 190 without an AFPR. There ARE people who have had fuel overrun issues with a 190, but not all of them as Oldman said, and the issues don't outweigh buying an AFPR. I wouldn't be arguing with someone with that many chicklets.

Why people bother getting a 255 pump for an evoII turbo in the first place, I will never know. If you don't believe me, PM CanadianTSI and ask him how he went 11s on a 50trim turbo at 24psi with a 190 pump without an AFPR.

An a/f gauge is useless, don't even spend your money on it. If you want an a/f gauge get a wideband one. An EGT gauge in my opinion is useless for tuning, it is a WARNING gauge, that is it, nothing more. If you are concerned about running lean, get a wideband. You need an aftermarket boost gauge (if you don't have one) and a logger before you do any tuning.

 

[Nighthawk01]

deffinitly dont waste any money on an a/f gauge,, just a light show as the others have said,,
pickup a logger there the best tool for our cars period.
i agree 100% with what oldman is saying.