Wastegate v-band question

[MMM]

I have a TiAL wastegate with V-Band flanges for the connections between the manifold and the dump tube. The exhaust header is the DNP performance T3/T4. When I put the "valve seat" into the bottom of the wastegate, the V-Bands that came with the TiAL don't fit around the flange of the manifold and the WG, but when I remove the valve seat it fits fine. What is the valve seat for? and do I need it?

Also, along the same topic, when running a v band between WG and dump tube, WG and manifold, and turbo and down pipe, do I need a gasket between any of those connections?

Thanks guys!

 

[daren_p]

How exactly does it not fit, do you mean it doesn't fit tight enoug to slide the clamp over? If that the case what size of WG spring are you running? You need the valve seat to seal against the WG valve, otherwise it will leak. I know the seat will hold the flanges apart abit, this is to ensure you have a good seal once you do have the clamp installed. If you have a large spring in there its probably just hard to compress the two pieces abit to allow the clamp to go over. Mine is a .9 bar clamp & like you said the clamp just won't slip over like the outlet side does, you have to force it abit. Just press on the end of the wastegate abit and you should be able to get the clamp over with a little force. No you don't need any gaskets anywhere on the vband clamps, that the beauty of them!

 

[MMM]

Thanks for the reply. I bought this stuff over a year ago so I don't remember what size spring is in it, but I cannot even push the valve at all with my thumbs. Can I remove the actuator top to relieve the tension, clamp the v-band on and them reassemble? or will that makes this hard to get back together?

 

[oldman]

Sound like you don't have the correct TIAL flange on the manifold.

 

[daren_p]

But he did say it fits without the valve seat. I know with the valve seat installed the flanges were probably 1/16"- 1/8" apart & had to press on the end of the WG to get them to compress enough to slip the clamp on, which was still tight. You can probably dissassemble the top hat, atleast if you do this you will know for sure if you do infact have a fitment issue or just need a little pressure on the WG end. Depending on what spring is installed it may be fairly difficult to get the top hat back on while installed. probably able to do with with two people depending on the spring size but with my .9bar, I took it apart to rotate the bottom portion of the hat & to reasseble there was too much pressure to try & holt it shut with one hand & put the bolts in with the other. I slipped it in a padded vise, which made things much easier.

 

[oldman]

I didn't have to compress anything with my TIAL44 with a 1bar spring, I suspect the flange on the manifold may be missing the groove for the valve seat.

 

[MMM]

Thanks guys. There is a groove on the mani for the seat but the size is off. I don't know if thats normal or not. Darren P is right about the gap, its about 1/16 to 1/8th". I'll give John at SBR a jingle. Thats where I bought the stuff. Thanks guys.

 

[oldman]

Thanks guys. There is a groove on the mani for the seat but the size is off.

Are you saying the valve seat doesn't sit in the groove? Daren, when I took the TAIL apart to clock the side fitting, I remember the valve bottoms out so the size of the spring should not affect how far the valve is extended, unless I mis-understood your previous post.

 

[MMM]

The valve seat fits into the machined groove in the manifold, but it doesn't go all the way in. There is that 1/16th of an inch sticking out that is creating that gap. My concern with forcing the WG to sit flush with the mani flange by compressing the spring is that won't some gas be diverted thru the WG at all times, even under low boost?

 

[daren_p]

Are you saying the valve seat doesn't sit in the groove? Daren, when I took the TAIL apart to clock the side fitting, I remember the valve bottoms out so the size of the spring should not affect how far the valve is extended, unless I mis-understood your previous post.

Have they changed the design maybe? I didn't pay that much attention but how does the valve bottom out on yours? I'm pretty sure once I took the top portion off mine the valve itself would slide right though the bottom of the wastegate to remove it. So there is no part of the WG body that the valve bottoms out on (ie no solid location to bottom out on). The part that it bottoms out on is the removable sleeve/valve seat itself. When you install the sleeve so it touches the valve, it's not pressed in enough to sit flush with the mating flange (on the turbo in my case, or the mani in his) you have to apply abit of pressure on the end of the WG which puts abit of a load on the valve face/valve seat to make sure you have a tight seal. This is what I recall to be correct but I didn't pay much attention to it as everything worked fine for my setup.

 

[oldman]

Have they changed the design maybe? I didn't pay that much attention but how does the valve bottom out on yours? I'm pretty sure once I took the top portion off mine the valve itself would slide right though the bottom of the wastegate to remove it. So there is no part of the WG body that the valve bottoms out on (ie no solid location to bottom out on). The part that it bottoms out on is the removable sleeve/valve seat itself. When you install the sleeve so it touches the valve, it's not pressed in enough to sit flush with the mating flange (on the turbo in my case, or the mani in his) you have to apply abit of pressure on the end of the WG which puts abit of a load on the valve face/valve seat to make sure you have a tight seal. This is what I recall to be correct but I didn't pay much attention to it as everything worked fine for my setup.

Daren, the valve surface doesn't bottom out against the flange, you mis-understood me, the valve stem is what bottoms out inside the wastegate body, if you take apart the wastegate to change the spring, you will know what I'm talking about.

 

[daren_p]

Daren, the valve surface doesn't bottom out against the flange, you mis-understood me, the valve stem is what bottoms out inside the wastegate body, if you take apart the wastegate to change the spring, you will know what I'm talking about.

Hmmm, yes it will bottom out eventually from the stem but is the "stop" up there not further down then the removable valve seat, in that it wouldn't actually bottom on on the stem when the seat was installed properly as it will limit its travel first?

 

[oldman]

Hmmm, yes it will bottom out eventually from the stem but is the "stop" up there not further down then the removable valve seat, in that it wouldn't actually bottom on on the stem when the seat was installed properly as it will limit its travel first?

There should be a little gap but it's probably minimal, at least for me as I didn't have to compress anything when I installed mine. Maybe I should go back and double check, maybe that's why I don't see any real boost until after 4k on my 3065.