turbo for 2.3 and pump gas??

[SHEARER_TSI]

So I was going to buy another 1G (a running car) but I think I would rather buy a roller and just build it myself. I am thinking about having buschur build me a 2.3 rpm motor like he has in his evo. So what I will have is a 2.3 that can rev to 9000+ I want to be able to run it on 93 as there is not a lot of E85 around. I am going to be moving to pittsburgh but there is still only a few places to get E85 there so I would want to tune it on both fuels but I need good performance from 93. I want to keep the stock mitsu housing, i was thinking about a FP DSM HTA76 with the fp recirculated O2 housing. Any other suggestions?

 

[DogWhistle]

As a 2.3L myself, I can say they eat lots of air especially at higher rpm and with CAMS it can take advantage of the extra displacement. I would say that based on your profile, you know what you're doing . I have the FP black and love it and anything that size and larger I would certainly say does the trick. The lower boost levels and higher volume are better for pump gas. With that said, I also would look into a higher A/R and something that spools later with a nice big strong wheel. I don't know the ideal turbo personally but I would point you in that direction. It also depends on what horsepower you are looking for but with stock DSM stuff I love the black. JB is better for the budget and spools plenty quick. I wouldn't stray from FP is my main emphasis. Hopefully someone can chime in with the effects of the O2 housing options. I run open dump and it has never let me down for boost control.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

Awesome, thanks for the input. I was thinking maybe a black. I have never run a stroker myself but I like the idea for a street car. I am looking to make 450-500 if I can on pump, although that may be a stretch. How much boost are you running and at what rpm do you see full boost with the 2.3 and the black?

 

[Archer Fabrications]

3794hta for a 2.3 street car

I'm gonna run it on my 2.0. And make a twin scroll manifold for it and youll be gold.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

I think if I was going to go that big I would just go with an 86hta. I really want to stay misty housing

 

[DogWhistle]

Awesome, thanks for the input. I was thinking maybe a black. I have never run a stroker myself but I like the idea for a street car. I am looking to make 450-500 if I can on pump, although that may be a stretch. How much boost are you running and at what rpm do you see full boost with the 2.3 and the black?

The stroker literally is all engine until 3-3.5K then the turbo takes over and it's a torque monster. I am in the mid to upper 400's with 22lbs of boost on the JB black. I am on e85 but I have not added timing so you can factor that as net 0 since I could run pump on the same levels with the basic timing I'm running. I do have FP2 or 272 cams and a ported head but that plays a role around 5.5K and higher primarily. I see full boost at about 4K if I'm on it at a decent time and the power really comes on from there. The 2.3 is a beautiful option for street as you can roll on it from a mid level RPM and you'll be in boost in no time! I don't run it higher than 7500 on the dyno and never have been about 7000 on the street but it's not exactly needed. Hope this helps!

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

It helps a lot, thank you.

What o2 housing are you using?

 

[DogWhistle]

It helps a lot, thank you.

What o2 housing are you using?

I am using one similar to punishment racing's open dump. I don't know the brand but MAP welded the TiAl flange on for me so 38mm dump tubing.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

ok, thanks for the info. Sounds like a great setup.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

I know you wanna stay mitsu flange (i dunno why, your a great fabricator are you not?) the larger turbos will make more power on pump gas due to the colder blown air. Think bout it

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

No ron shearer is a great fabricator I am just a friend of his. he did a lot of fab work on my last car

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh the name mislead me man.

 

[AK Maniak]

Honestly if you are only looking to make 450ish then why not go with something like an FP Green or Green XL. I think a black would make for a hell of a car but even on straight 93 450 wouldn't be that hard

 

[Archer Fabrications]

He'll want more.... Everyone, wants more power

 

[AK Maniak]

He'll want more.... Everyone, wants more power

I'm sure you're right but even if he wants more the Green XL flows 59lbs/min. If that isn't enough then it seems like the Black would be the next turbo to look at since he wants to stay in a DSM housing

 

[Archer Fabrications]

I still personally think the greens would be too small. And people arent making that 59lb a min on pump gas. I vote dsm86 then. It's a 2.3 man hes past small shit like greens and reds.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

Hey most things are going to be downsized compared to the last set up

 

[1G Eclipse94928]

Hey most things are going to be downsized compared to the last set up

Go with the black then.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

You need more turbine to make good # on pump, granted. I made 400awhp at 22psi on hx40 bolt on 92 oct

Why downsize to dsm flange from a 42r?

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

I no longer have that car, trying to build something that is a bit more street able. Not trying to wait to 6500-7000 rpm to make boost . I had honestly considered a hta68 but I don't think I will be happy with that level of power. I guess my question should be what will make 450+ hp on pump and still spool fairly quickly.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

The black apparently at 4k and the dsm 86 at about 4500-4700 30psi, i asked fp.

 

[JusMX141]

I had honestly considered a hta68 but I don't think I will be happy with that level of power.

The 68HTA is basically a billet 18G. You're never going to get far on pump gas with any turbo using a TD05H turbine.

I guess my question should be what will make 450+ hp on pump and still spool fairly quickly.

Definitely won't be the Black.



Figure you'll need turbo capable of 52-55 lb/min to make 450whp on pump gas without meth in order to keep from melting things down. Unfortunately you can't have a quick-spooling DSM bolt-on pump gas turbo that is capable of 450whp....it just doesn't exist. You have to be able to sacrifice something:

- You can have a 450+hp DSM bolt-on turbo that spools fast, but you're not going to get away with running pump gas. (Example - FP 71HTA)

- You can have a quick-spooling turbo that works great with pump gas, but you're not making 450+whp. (Examples - Evo III 16G, TD05H 20G, FP 68HTA)

- You can have a 450+hp DSM bolt-on pump gas turbo, but it's not going to spool fast. (Examples - Bullseye S256, Holset HX35/HX40, FP DSM 76, Green XL, Red)


^ Pick one.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

I figure a 2.3 should help spool things a bit faster than a 2.0 would.

 

[WFO-TSi]

The 68HTA is basically a billet 18G. You're never going to get far on pump gas with any turbo using a TD05H turbine.

Definitely won't be the Black.



Figure you'll need turbo capable of 52-55 lb/min to make 450whp on pump gas without meth in order to keep from melting things down. Unfortunately you can't have a quick-spooling DSM bolt-on pump gas turbo that is capable of 450whp....it just doesn't exist. You have to be able to sacrifice something:

- You can have a 450+hp DSM bolt-on turbo that spools fast, but you're not going to get away with running pump gas. (Example - FP 71HTA)

- You can have a quick-spooling turbo that works great with pump gas, but you're not making 450+whp. (Examples - Evo III 16G, TD05H 20G, FP 68HTA)

- You can have a 450+hp DSM bolt-on pump gas turbo, but it's not going to spool fast. (Examples - Bullseye S256, Holset HX35/HX40, FP DSM 76, Green XL, Red)


^ Pick one.

I know it’s not on your list BUT, FP can make you a DSM73…I guess you could call it. Anyway it’s a 73HTA (54lbs/min) compressor with all the backpressure benefits of using the 9cm FP30 turbine housing.

I’ve talked to both Michael and Amber about running one of these, and despite not being published its still on the menu.

 

[JusMX141]

I figure a 2.3 should help spool things a bit faster than a 2.0 would.

Sometimes not as much as one would hope....and what you gain in spool you tend to lose in high RPM pull as you won't be revving as high as a 2.0.

Another thing to remember about the larger-displacement is the exhaust has more energy making a small TD05H-based turbo even more-difficult to tune on pump gas before running into a knock wall. Sure a 2.4 with 11:1 pistons would spool an Evo III 16G like a T25, but you'd be stuck running 12psi on pump gas.