Trouble getting into first and second

[MikeL18]

I was driving around the other day, and all of a sudden it just didn't want to go into first or second without some patience. I've always had a little trouble getting into first, and have only recently had trouble downshifting into second but otherwise it's been fine.

I'm thinking it could have a problem with the engine or transmission mounts. The clutch feels good, no signs of slipping. Sycros don't just go out like that so I don't think it's those. I haven't checked out the linkage or fluid yet.

Reason I think it is the transmission mounts is because whenever I'm cruising in first gear and then press the clutch in, I hear a chattering noise and sometimes can even feel it. This also happens at higher RPMs sometimes. I haven't visually inspected the mounts, but I don't really know what to look for anyway, besides for if they are obviously falling apart.


So what do you guys think?

 

[rlacasse1]

Sounds kind of like your throw out bearing is wasted. Thats why you can hear it when you push in the clutch. Motor mounds wouldn't cause your problem.

 

[MikeL18]

I started the car up this morning and now it won't seem to go into any gear. When I try to put it into gear, it's like I'm not using the clutch pedal at all. If I pump the petal a few times, then I can put it into gear.

Is that a symptom of a throwout bearing that's wasted?

 

[falcon8r]

If the clutch fork is moving in and out as normal, likely you spit a spring out of the clutch disc. It is very common .The spring will rattle around until it jams the pressure plate and it will not disengage. It is possible the T/O bearing went but you will have to take out the tranny to find out anyhow. Happy New Year kinda Tres....

 

[LD25Delta9]

It would not be your throwout bearing, cause you'd hear the rattleing while the clutch is disengaged. Not while it's engaged because it'll be pressed up against the pressure plate, not bouncing around on the driveshaft. It sounds to me as though your slave or master cylinder is shot. If you had to pump the clutch pedal a couple of times, you had no pressure built up in your lines. And the rattling around when you shift into first or at high rpm could very well be a bad motor mount, seeing as how our engine has 3 of them attached to the transmission. Look for the rubber being seperated from the casing on the mounts. If you see any big cracks or if the rubber is more like a hard plastic, they need replaced.
An easy way to test your synchros is while the car is running, leave the clutch disengaged and try to put it into any of the gears. If it grinds, the synchro for that gear is shot. If it trys to push the vehicle forward, your synchros are fine. There really is no in between. I'd say your rattling would be more likely caused by a bad mount than a bad synchro. I had all sorts of chatering and knocking going on before I replaced mine. I had a fried trans side mount and a friend rear trans mount. Hope it helps for what it's worth.

 

[NeMiZiS]

Synchros on our transmissions are paper thin.
Might have finally gone out if you have been having minor problems with 1st gear anyway.

 

[LD25Delta9]

Synchros on our transmissions are paper thin.
Might have finally gone out if you have been having minor problems with 1st gear anyway.

+1

 

[MikeL18]

*snip*

First of all, thanks for taking the time to write all that.

Second, I think the syncros are fine. This morning while I messing with the car, I did try to put it into all gears without the clutch. I had the brake on so the car didn't move at all, but the rpm's did drop a little bit and there was no grinding.

I'll check out the master and slave cylinders. It seems like those would be causing the problem.


For the motor/trans mounts, I don't have an engine lift or anything so I don't think I could do those. Would it be worth it to have a shop do it?

 

[LD25Delta9]

Yeah it's always worth having good motor mounts, but you don't need a lift to do them. Just a good jack with a good piece of wood. Jack up the engine under the oil pan(obviously with the wood underneath) and give it a couple of cranks. That should raise the engine enough to relieve the tension on the mounts and make them easy to replace. The rear and right side (from the front of the engine bay) might give you al little trouble, but so long as you do them one at a time you don't have to worry about your engine falling on your chest while replacing the rear one. I reccomend unbolting the whole mounting plate from the back of the transmission. After removing your battery, intake pipe, and Wiper Fluid resevoir, a good extension and a 15MM socket should do the trick. Unbolt the 3 bolts ontop of the back of the tranny, then unbolt the main bolt that goes through the rubber mount itself. Unbolt the mount from the rear firewall, reverse the steps for the install. Just make sure you don't tighten the main bolt down all the way, so you have some play to install the bracket back onto the transmission. Torque it all back down and VOILA!
If you don't already know, your slave is on the front of the tranny right underneath the crossmember, and your master is the attached to the tiny little resevoir you add brake fluid to next to your Brake master cylinder. Again, for what it's worth man, I hope this helps. Good Luck!

 

[MikeL18]

Thanks a lot for the help. I finally looked inside the cabin and there's fluid leaking from the MC inside.

My problem now is that no place near me has a rebuild kit or even a new cylinder available so I'm going to have to order one. I'm just going to bleed the system and hope it works for a few more days till a new one comes in.

Also another thing - while I was under the car looking at the slave cylinder.. there's a rectangular rubber boot that's on the side of the transmission where the slave cylinder goes into. Well... that's leaking clear green/red fluid. Looks like anti-freeze. Is that supposed to happen?

I'll post pictures if needed.

 

[LD25Delta9]

No that's bad, too. Sounds like you have a driveshaft seal gone bad if you're leaking from inside the bell housing. If I can picture where you're talking about, it's leaking out from the boot that goes around your Clutch Fork, right? There's no fluid inside that bell housing, but if your driveshaft seal is shot, then you definitely would. Sorry if I ruined your day.

 

[MikeL18]

Well I rebuilt the MC and it was shifting pretty good for a little bit. The problem still seems to be there though. I guess what's leaking out of there is my transmission fluid.

So, my next question. If I can get the transmission dropped, am I able to replace all the seals easily? I should probably replace the clutch and everything else while I'm down there too. What kills me though is that the engine was rebuilt and the clutch was supposedly replaced about 40k or 50k miles ago. All of this should have already been replaced. The fluid that came out of the clutch line was pure black. Does it get that dirty so quick?

If I bought a clutch and seals and everything, would the shop change all of that and charge the same as a normal clutch job? I've done most of the work to my car thus far, but I don't know if I should attempt a transmission removal in my parent's garage...

 

[LD25Delta9]

It's not that bad to do in a garage. I suggest pulling the whole motor and not just the transmission. Personally, I think the trans. is a little easier to pull off and put on when the engine is out. With the way our motor fits in the engine bay, there's about 2 inches of clearance to work with if you pull the tranny by itself. If you get the seals, a shop will be able to do it for you, but I don't know if they would charge you extra or not. If the fluid you are leaking is black I would check to see if you have a rear main seal shot while the tranny is off. With the funny colors of fluid you described as leaking, you could have either a driveshaft seal leaking or a rear main or possibly both. Either way, there is no way to tell for sure, until you pull your tranny off the engine. Pulling our motor is ALOT easier than it looks. The biggest pain for you will be the PS pump, and AC compressor getting in the way. Shoot me a PM if you feel up to it, but need some advice. I've had it in and out of my car AT LEAST 5 times by myself. It's kinda second nature nowadays.

 

[MikeL18]

When I last posted I hadn't driven my car more than around the block. But I've been driving it for the last few days and it shifts pretty smooth. When I first start the car it sometimes doesn't want to go into any gears, but after I get it in and start driving, it works fine. I still have problems downshifting in second occasionally though.

I also wiped some of the fluid from where it was leaking out of that boot, and the fluid is actually black/brown and looked like motor oil. Judging from how dirty the bottom of the transmission is, it's been leaking for awhile.

I'll probably just drive it around like this till I sell it in the Spring.


Edit: I also forgot to mention that I have to rebuild the MC on my brother's car now, too.
He drives a 95 RS, and I guess our cars just don't like this cold weather.

 

[LD25Delta9]

Yeah it sounds like you have a rear main seal gone bad. Oh well, shoot me a PM when you want to get rid of your ride, if it still runs halfway decent. I'm always looking for another ride...

 

[MikeL18]

Bump.

Ok so I've been driving the car around and it does somewhat decent. When it's cold it shifts like shit but what it warms up (60+ degrees) it shifts smooth as butter most of the time. Odd?

Back to the motor mounts thing, when I'm taking a semi-hard right and I'm trying to shift, I can literally feel the shifter lock up and it won't move until I come out of the turn. It's like the transmission is leaning and won't let the car into gear. Anyone ever had that problem before?

Yeah it sounds like you have a rear main seal gone bad. Oh well, shoot me a PM when you want to get rid of your ride, if it still runs halfway decent. I'm always looking for another ride...

I wiped the area down and it hasn't leaked since. If you still want this car, let me know. I'm getting ready to sell it in a month or so when I have enough money saved.