Tial BOV flutter then dump at High Boost, Works perfect below 10psi ???

[BoostedBeaver]

Good afternoon,

For reference I used a dodge modded stock BOV controlled by link up until this point with minor leak issues. This mod was to delete those leaks. I received a Tial Q 50mm Bov with the white spring a few weeks ago. My car idles at -14 to -15 inhg which is why the white spring (8 PSI) was chosen. I installed the BOV on my eagle talon and started the test.

At idle the valve is closed unless the idle goes up a hundred RPMs or so creating more vacuum and cracking the BOV. This is not a large worry and actually reassures me that I have chosen the right spring. When just slightly revved, the valve will open quickly and release pressure. It works perfectly until about 10psi or so. I am running 32lbs of boost at the moment but anything above 10 or so and the valve flutters for a second or so then dumps. It is as if the valve is opening a tad too late.

What could be causing this issue??? I do have the Vac/boost source behind the throttle plate and it is seeing full vacuum. Do you have any suggestions as to a possible solution??? I would love to use this sleek and innovative valve but cannot risk the chance of ruining a turbo due to surge. Please let me know what you think. Feel free to ask for information that I may have left out.

Thanks,
Robert

 

[jpmxrider489]

Does you bov have it's own vacume line?

 

[BoostedBeaver]

The BOV is using the stock port on the intake for the FPS. It was T'd to start with (AFPR), but after I first encountered the problem, I rerouted things so the BOV gets its own independent source.

I looked at it last night and maybe the vacuum port is a little small??? I am using a 5.6mm ID hose and Tial recommends a 6mm hose but the barb on the intake manifold fits loosely inside this 5.6mm hose. This makes me think that maybe not enough vacuum is being seen soon enough??

I have a catch can setup that pulls a vacuum on the valve cover, so I may temporarily pull the PCV valve, plug the valve cover hole and then use that port on the intake manifold as it is larger. This will allow me to use at least a 6mm hose and test the theory of a larger volume vacuum source.

Thanks for your input and any other suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Robert

 

[nitrouskris]

Is it a real or knock off tial ???

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

In my experience with my Tial 50mm if it is fluttering/surging then the spring is too tight. What I found to work perfect on my setup was the Black spring shimmed with 3 large washers. The black spring is significantly smaller the then white and unpainted springs.

Black, White, Unpainted

Is there a reason you aren't using the stock BOV port? It is the middle port here. From left to right (looking at the picture) it is PCV port, BOV port, and FPR port. As you can see the BOV port is quite a bit larger then the little FPR port but also quite a bit smaller the the PCV port.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/269820-tial-bov-spring.html
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/369284-tial-bov-open-idle.html

 

[BoostedBeaver]

It is a real tial purchased from extreme psi.

Robert

 

[BoostedBeaver]

In my experience with my Tial 50mm if it is fluttering/surging then the spring is too tight. What I found to work perfect on my setup was the Black spring shimmed with 3 large washers. The black spring is significantly smaller the then white and unpainted springs.

Black, White, Unpainted

Is there a reason you aren't using the stock BOV port? It is the middle port here. From left to right (looking at the picture) it is PCV port, BOV port, and FPR port. As you can see the BOV port is quite a bit larger then the little FPR port but also quite a bit smaller the the PCV port.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/269820-tial-bov-spring.html
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/369284-tial-bov-open-idle.html

Thanks for your input. I think that if I use a smaller spring the valve will never close??? It opens at idle with the white spring. I may try a black spring with some washers if none of the above solutions work. In case I do end up trying this method is there a certain size washer that works the best????

I should have mentioned this earlier, but I am running SD and the Omni 4 bar is connected to the stock BOV nipple. To test if the size of the nipple is the issue, I am going to pull the PCV and cap it off and use that nipple for the BOV. I have a calan catch can to pull a vacuum on the top end so pulling the PCV should be an alternative if need be. The car is not a daily but we will cross that bridge when we get there.

Again thanks for your input and I would like the size of those washers if you know which ones they where. I will keep this updated after the test tonight.

Robert

 

[jpmxrider489]

I would try switching springs. Did you pick the spring based on your vacume?

 

[BoostedBeaver]

I also just looked at the two links that you posted. The first refers to the normal tial but still reflects people using the softer spring. It also states that tial’s recommendations may be off.

In the second link I found this post made by you.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/152796611-post13.html

You state that low boost is your issue. My problem seems to be totally different. Low boost is absolutely perfect. I mean I could not ask for better. Anything in the higher than 10 or so boost range and I get surge. This is the exact opposite of what I was expecting to get. I thought that if I had a problem with surge it would be the lower boost levels. Anyway I will have to wait on another spring so I will try everything else I can tonight.

Robert

 

[BoostedBeaver]

I would try switching springs. Did you pick the spring based on your vacume?

Yes I did. I am a victim of taking things for granted. I will try that if nothing else works for me. Thanks for the input.

Robert

 

[BoostedBeaver]

So tonight I ran the AFPR with its own line to the stock FPR nipple on the intake manifold (far right in the picture 3 post above). The boost gauge is hooked up to the throttle body nipple that sees vacuum and boost. The Omni 4 bar is hooked up to the stock BOV port (middle in the picture). Finally the Tial is being ran using 1/4" hose going to the PCV port. The PCV is (at this point) disconnected.

The results are a perfect working BOV. I have no flutter what so ever anymore. While reving in neutral the BOV reacts perfectly with no hesitation. While driving around on 30lbs give or take a few the BOV again performs outstanding as far as I can tell. There is no longer a turkey living under my hood.

Thanks for the input,
Robert

 

[jpmxrider489]

Glad to hear.