Stuttering/Misfiring

[tsunari]

Couldn't really find much on my particular problem, so here goes:

Go out at lunch to run some erands (it's freaking cold outside), get in the car,
let her warm up a bit and start to drive off easy. Get about 1/4 mile
down the road and the engine starts to studder as if it's misfiring AND I get a CEL.

So I pull-over, pop the hood (still idling . . .) can't see anything that has disconnected
itself . . . so I shut the engine off and proceed to unplug & re-plug different connectors
(spark plug wires @ the coil pack, MAF plug, coil ignitor plug, etc . . .)

Start her back up and all is well (CEL is still on though . . . no worries, I'll check it when I get home . . .) drive for another 30-60 seconds and the studdering comes back. Pull over, shut off, wait 30 sec, restart. . . everything is fine (for the next 60 seconds or so).

So by this time I'm a bit aggravated and REALLY didn't want to, but decide to pull the negative side to the battery (lost the CEL code . . .), wait 30 seconds, hook everything back up and all is well!

Guess my question is W-T-F ? Any ideas? Wish I had my code reader in the car at the time . . .

 

[ddavisaf]

Your coil pack should be the first thing you check.
Ohm the primary and secondary coils.
After that much your plug wires and spark plugs.

Post back if that doesn't yield any results.
I don't want to overload you with 40 different things to look at right away.

 

[tsunari]

Your coil pack should be the first thing you check.
Ohm the primary and secondary coils.
After that much your plug wires and spark plugs.

Post back if that doesn't yield any results.
I don't want to overload you with 40 different things to look at right away.

Sounds good, will do here in an hour or so. Plugs and wires are both brand new (and yes . . . properly gapped )

My question is, if the coil IS going bad, why would clearing the CEL out of the ECU clean up the problem? I do not think I have ever gotten them before, but would a random misfire detect throw a CEL and send the ECU into this kind of 'limp mode' until it is cleared?

 

[ddavisaf]

Quite possiblity yes. steve would be the ECU guru to talk to about specific functions and whatnot.
Your problem may be as simple as a bad air or fuel filter as well though. Maybe a bad MAF. Could be bad gas....
DSM's are strange creatures.

 

[tsunari]

DSM's are strange creatures.

Indeed they are . . . well I'm packin my code reader around with me now in hopes (?) of it happening again. May sound sadistic, but I'm not a big fan of problems "fixing themselves" without me knowing the cause . . .

 

[tsunari]

Alright just went out and checked out my coilpack. The secondary coil resistance fell within spec (11.3-15.3 kOhm) However, the primary coil resistance for both was ZERO.

Now please correct me if I am wrong, but the proper place to check the primary coil resistance is on the triangle connector that is actually on the coil pack (with three pins), right ?

Just wanna know before I start scouring the local junkyards for a good coilpack.
If I did indeed measure this correctly . . . how long would you say I have until it goes completely kaput!?

Oh yeah . . . and another thing- are the 1g & 2g coil packs different?

 

[ddavisaf]

Alright just went out and checked out my coilpack. The secondary coil resistance fell within spec (11.3-15.3 kOhm) However, the primary coil resistance for both was ZERO.

Now please correct me if I am wrong, but the proper place to check the primary coil resistance is on the triangle connector that is actually on the coil pack (with three pins), right ?

Just wanna know before I start scouring the local junkyards for a good coilpack.
If I did indeed measure this correctly . . . how long would you say I have until it goes completely kaput!?

Oh yeah . . . and another thing- are the 1g & 2g coil packs different?

1G and 2G coils packs are different. I don't have my link at hand on testing the coil pack... and I can't remember either. I'll post a link later on when I find it (I'm at home right now and not at work). So if someone would like to jump it and verify for us...

 

[tsunari]

1G and 2G coils packs are different. I don't have my link at hand on testing the coil pack... and I can't remember either. I'll post a link later on when I find it (I'm at home right now and not at work). So if someone would like to jump it and verify for us...

Sounds good man- thanks. I'm hoping that I just need to test the primary coils with a better multimeter . . . one that can actually measure half an Ohm.

 

[ddavisaf]

Where in Maryland are you?

 

[tsunari]

Where in Maryland are you?

Jessup- SW of BWI airport

 

[tsunari]

Alright . . . bought an analog multimeter over the weekend and re-tested the Primary coils on the coil pack and they once again Ohm-ed out @ ZERO Ohms . . . Guess it's just a matter of time before this thing goes bye-bye ?

Anyone selling a known good 2g coil pack?

 

[ddavisaf]

Stupid coil packs

Check www.diamondstarmotorsport.com and www.mitsubishigraveyard.com

I used to live in Columbia MD.

 

[tsunari]

Stupid coil packs

Check www.diamondstarmotorsport.com and www.mitsubishigraveyard.com

I used to live in Columbia MD.

Sweet- that's just down the road from me . . . wish the J-yards around here had some 2Gs in em . . .

 

[V62GST]

Just Replaced it with new ignition coils from fatory
but same problem exsits,. WHAT IS WRONG WITH OUR CARS!!

 

[ddavisaf]

tsunari's problem may have been different from yours. I don't know anything about your problem.
What is your car doing exactly? What caused you to replace the coil pack?

 

[tsunari]

I bout a 'new' coilpack that was supposed to be about 6months old with little usage . . . Ohmed everything out as I did the one that's in the car and the results were pretty much the same.

Since I haven't had the studdering problem again since that day, I'm going to have to assume that my original pack is fine and perhaps the studdering was something unrelated . . . (man I wish I could've pulled the CEL codes that day . . .)

 

[boosted16g]

you have a six bolt swap ?? correct. Well with the swap u have to use the 93-94 CAS, cam angle sensor. Its often reffered to the black top hall effect sensor. What year is the head u have on it. that will tell me what CAS u have on it. The Cas is on the upper left side of the head. It looks like this ( ). Your computer is not getting enough of an accurate of a signal from the older cas to simulate a crank angle sensor which u dont have any more. So upgrade your cas.

 

[tsunari]

you have a six bolt swap ?? correct. Well with the swap u have to use the 93-94 CAS, cam angle sensor. Its often reffered to the black top hall effect sensor. What year is the head u have on it. that will tell me what CAS u have on it. The Cas is on the upper left side of the head. It looks like this ( ). Your computer is not getting enough of an accurate of a signal from the older cas to simulate a crank angle sensor which u dont have any more. So upgrade your cas.

If you're asking me, yeah . . . I have a 6-bolt block with a 2g head & black-top CAS.
I've seen some threads floating around in different forums of people trying to hook up a 7-bolt crank position sensor (CPS) but haven't seen anything solid yet.

Apparently there are some 6-bolt Hyundai's out there with a front case that has provisions for a CPS. I've actually seen one @ a junk yard before I even knew what I was looking at . . . but apparently you can't get the front case anymore . . . but that's a whole other discussion . . .

 

[ddavisaf]

Possibly a wet crank angle sensor or a wet coil pack may have caused your problem.

 

[tsunari]

Possibly a wet crank angle sensor or a wet coil pack may have caused your problem.

Perhaps. . . except it went away after I pulled the negative terminal off the battery for 30 seconds to clear the CEL code and hasn't reared its ugly head again since

 

[infamousmarcus]

you knoe...whats weird i posted pretty much the same problem not too long ago, and another dude did too.

 

[ddavisaf]

If you're running a stock UICP check and make sure that it is bolted down under the fuse box. That will cause symptoms similar to what you're experiencing. When under heavy load on occassion it will pop off and cause stumbling and and will throw the car into limp mode.

 

[tsunari]

Well it actually happened again last night . . . was pretty damned cold out- snowing . . .
Threw a CEL and promptly went into limp mode (studdering, loss of power, etc . . .) But this time I was prepared!! So I pull-over and whip out my code reader . . . sure enough- Multiple Random Misfire detected.

Cleared it out and she's runnin fine once again . . . so think this is just the typical issue of using the 93-94 CAS on a 2g ECU? If so, I can just use DSMLink to disable the check for misfires . . .but I'd hate to do that if it's something else and I'm really getting misfires

 

[GSXPete]

people on here seem to know alot more about our cars than on this other forum I've been on... I'm having a problem like this alos, I just put on new wires(nology) and plugs. I'f the cars cold, starts up and runs fine, shut it off and start it up hot and it goes into "limp mode" <--- love that line....anyways, is there anyone in Minnesota that really knows these cars that would be able to take a look at mine (1990 GSX) and get me running smooth, I'll buy the beer

 

[ddavisaf]

If you got the nology Hot Wires, or whatever the hell.... make sure you constantly check the resistance of the wires. It seems that after about 6 months or so, they start to go bad.

Yes, it may be a byproduct of your 1G CAS on a 2G ECU... I don't know for sure though, so here is where I take my leave... Send a PM to " steve " as he's an ECU guru