starter harness drawing power

[viridionplague]

so i came out to start my car and she was dead. throw the multi meter on the negitive battery post and its drawing enough amps to overload the meter. unplugged the starter harness and she went right back to acceptable levels.

any ideas on specific causes? maybe the starter relay?

 

[luv2rallye]

You're not wording this properly. I seriously doubt you mean amps because a starter draws between 50-150 amps which is way more than your typical multi-meter can handle which would burn it out. The meter would also have to be in series with the battery terminal to measure amps.
I think you mean voltage which is measured across the battery (plus to minus) and I assume you mean the voltage went to near zero when starter was engaged. This is nearly always due to a weak battery. Have it tested or do it yourself like this: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...reeway-electrical-problems.html#post151165661.

 

[viridionplague]

no i mean amps. when the battery drains overnight you check amp draw with the car off. 30-50 milliamps when the car is off is acceptable. i am getting an amprage draw when the car is off and everything is closed

 

[luv2rallye]

Oh ok - I didn't understand you meant a draw while off (I thought you meant while cranking). When you say "unplugged the starter harness and she went right back to acceptable levels", do you mean only the big negative cable that goes to the starter mounting bolt (on bell housing) but leaving the other negative cable to the firewall (body), or do you mean all cables on battery negative, or do you mean all cables on battery positive, or ???

This may help: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...-partial-short-battery-drain.html#post1496998. Using the in-series incandescent light bulb on battery technique will aid in finding the short (by unplugging things or doing voltage measurements). Example: if you suspect the starter relay as the short source, unplug it and see if light goes out.

 

[viridionplague]

the drain goes away when i disconnect the 4 pin starter harness plug.

 

[luv2rallye]

You mean unplugging the starter relay (relay with black-yellow, black-white, black-red, and green-black wires)?
Also do you have factory theft alarm?

 

[viridionplague]

i think that is correct. as the car will not crank at all without it plugged in. also should have mentioned this earlier, but one of the starter bolts came out and when cranking the starter moved and i had to line it back up. since then ive had the power drain.

just went out and double checked the connectors. the wires comming out of the engine side of the harness are 2 black with yellow stripes. 1 red with black stripe. and 1 either solid red or red with a black stripe again.

 

[luv2rallye]

Do you have 2 separate large cables each coming from the battery negative post - one going to firewall body and the other going to under a starter mounting bolt on the bell housing?

Are you sure it's the starter relay under the dash - the one with black-yellow, black-white, black-red, and green-black wires? I have to know what you unplugged in order to help you.

If it is the starter relay (which I find hard to believe), that relay should not even be getting power until the key is in Start position. With key off make sure there's no power on the black-yellow and black-white wires.

 

[viridionplague]

for grounding i have a 2 cables from the negative post. 1 goes to the fires wall. the other to the starter bolt, the another cable going from the starter bolt to another spot on the firewall.

it does not have a green wire. ill try to grab a picture really quick. gimme 5 minutes.

 

[luv2rallye]

just went out and double checked the connectors. the wires comming out of the engine side of the harness are 2 black with yellow stripes. 1 red with black stripe. and 1 either solid red or red with a black stripe again.

That doesn't sound like the starter relay. Is this on your 91? Where is this relay or is it even a relay?

 

[viridionplague]

this is the connector. 4 pin, 2 wires are black with yellow stripes. 1 sollid red. 1 red with black strip. its bundled in with the big black with yellow for the starter. and plug into the ecu wire harness just before entering the car.

 

[luv2rallye]

This looks like just a harness to harness connector - is that what it is?

And it doesn't even look factory. Do you have anything aftermarket like a theft alarm (most likely), turbo timer, separate power for an amp, etc?

Where does it connect to, the starter perhaps like an aftermarket theft alarm might?

 

[viridionplague]

this is stock wiring. all my 1g's have been this way. there is no anti-theft, no aftermarket amp, or turbo timer.

 

[luv2rallye]

I don't have a 1g so I can't look. But I think I see it in the diagrams, connector A10, 2 wires being black-yellow. Yes it is your starter activation wire (to starter magnetic switch) - the 2 wires are in parellel. So your current draw is either in the starter magnetic switch or a short between this connector and the starter. Perhaps the starter jarring caused this.

But these wires shouldn't even have power without the key in Start position.

Does the starter work with key in Start position?

 

[viridionplague]

is the magnetic switch a part of the starter itself or the solenoid connected to the starter?

 

[luv2rallye]

The solenoid is attached to the starter - it typically comes with the starter although not always. The large battery + cable goes to this solenoid (aka magnetic switch) and from there to the starter. The solenoid connects the two. Often you can buy just the solenoid if that's the problem.

Does the starter work?

 

[viridionplague]

yea the starter works. after the jarring i just lined it back up, put the bolt in. and fired it back up.

after messing with the wires and stuff the drain is suddenly gone. though it was for sure coming from the starter harness.

im going to pull the whole thing out and check all the wires and stuff. maybe end up replacing the solenoid anyways just in case.

 

[luv2rallye]

But those wires shouldn't even have power without the key in Start position which is what you should check. The solenoid may be fine. The real culpret may be your ignition switch providing power when it's in the Off position.

 

[viridionplague]

i did take the ecu side of the connector and grounded each of the connection to check for a signal. none of them showed any voltage.

 

[luv2rallye]

When it's working correctly they wouldn't show any voltage, until the key is in the Start position. I think you have an intermittent ignition key problem - Off sometimes puts power on the black-yellow wires. It probably has enough resistance in the incorrect short inside the switch to not provide enough power to energize the solenoid, but enough to drain your battery overnight. Perhaps you can recreate it by jiggling the key around the Off position. You also could attach an led (using correct led polarity) onto the black-yellow (to ground) to give you an indication when you have a drain in the Off position. An incandescent bulb probably wouldn't glow bright enough to see in the draining case.

!!! Oh it just occurred to me it could be a faulty solenoid partially shorting to ground. In fact that is the more likely case. Forget what I said above and troubleshoot the solenoid or just replace it before doing what I said above

 

[viridionplague]

i dont see why it would have anything to do with the ignition switch. ive never had a draining problem before until the starter was jarr'd. the drain also went away after i pulled the starter harness out from where it was tucked behind the engine.

i also dont use a test light. i use a digital multimeter.

 

[luv2rallye]

You're right. Reread the last part of post 20 - we overlapped posts.

 

[viridionplague]

overlapping posts or me just being lazy and apparently not reading the whole post.

anyways. ill try the key thing later as i tried jumping it and fried my shitty jumper cables.

also stuck my head well into the engine bay and looked at the solenoid. there is a dent in the solenoid housing.

 

[luv2rallye]

I added to my post 20 before I saw your following post. Ya I'm 99% sure it's the solenoid, well now with the dent 100% tee hee - just replace it. Remember to disconnect battery before disconnecting the cables on the solenoid.

 

[viridionplague]

haha. such a post editor. trying to locate one now. as a precaution im pulling this connector when i shut the car off untill i have the solenoid.

thanks for the help.