Slipped Snapped Broken Timing Belt T-Belt [merged]

[aznerd11]

a few weeks ago, my car started idling poorly so i never started it since. i checked for vacuum leaks, but i then found it to be a problem with the timing belt. When i lifted the top cover, i noticed a rip on the belt and the belt off a few teeth on the exhaust sprocket. So now im in the process of changing it but now im stuck. Please see pictures.

rip
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v387/bboygenius016/tbelt011.jpg

off teeth on exhaust
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v387/bboygenius016/tbelt010.jpg

after 1/4 turn of the crank, the teeth lined up again, which made it skip some more
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v387/bboygenius016/tbelt012.jpg

how do i get the timing to TDC with the teeth off?- i started turning it softly but then i felt a restriction and it moved itself counterclockwise.
also how do i get the crank sprocket off without the tool?
This is on a 90 laser turbo

 

[DSMcrazy3]

There is a very high chance that atleast 2 of your valves are bent. Though you weren't racing or anything, when that belt breaks, the cam gears stop, thus the cams stop. The crank however is so much heavier it has all this energy left over(inertia maybe? not too good w/ phsyics/chemistry Lol). So that has a couple of turns left in it. So some valves may be pushed open due to the position of the camshaft, and a piston has most likely come up and hit some valves...Bending them. You might have gotten away with just that, and no pistons needing to be replaced. But you need to pull the head and check it out, replace everything that needs it(valvetrain wise). While the head is off replace the timing belt tensioner and other accessories, as well as the water pump.

Josh

 

[GRsDSM]

Hi, i am in Calgary, if you need any help give me a call...212.8223 ext 6194

 

[GST with PSI]

here's what happened.

a few days ago i realized a slight vibration in the higher rpm range. i thought my balance shaft belt may have jumped a tooth causing the slight vibration, but i wasn't sure really so i kind of ignored it.

yesterday night i fixed my bogging with boost increase problem see this thread:http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195946

i was running denso iridium spark plugs. don't ever do it. i swapped them out with a set of NGK BPR6ES and it ran perfect. i cranked up the boost to 15 psi and my car was running awesome, except for the very slight vibration in the higher rpm range.

this morning i start my car and this wining screech, sounding like a belt rubbing on a pulley, catches my attention. i stop and listen but it goes away. about half way to work (3 miles) the screech comes back and lasts all the way to work where i pop the hood and listen pinpointing the noise to the lower part of the timing belt cover. i turn off the car and go to work.

i return out to the car on my break to show one of my friends the problem and it's gone. i snap the throttle and the belt is quiet as a mouse.

i start my car to leave for work and it takes a shit. i hear a shredding noise and flopping then i shut the car down immediately. while running the car was idling a bit high, not really rough, but bouncing rpm's at idle a bit.i pull off the top timing belt cover and see chunks of belt. the timing belt has been frayed a bit on the passenger side but is still on the car, and has tension. i don't believe it slipped. i looked like the timing belt had worked as a conveyor and transported some balance shaft belt to the top of the motor. the car drove fine and ran fine until the last incident mentioned above.

my question is this:
do you believe i may have bent some valves?
if i didn't bend valves, why is the car idling abnormal?
what is the easiest way to check for some bent valves?
could my balance shaft belt could have caused that many problems in that short of an amount of time at low rpm's (idle)?
if my timing marks are still in align, shouldn't i be OK?

thanks in advance for the help.

 

[RossY]

Well, check your timing marks on the cams and crankshaft. If they line up then you should be ok.

A quick way to check if you bent valves would be to take the valve cover off and feel all of the rockers. If any are loose, or are laying in your head somewhere then you bent valves.

balance shaft belts are notorious for taking out timing belts when they snap, thats one reason why so many people eliminate their balance shafts. It sounds to me that you may have gotten lucky, as long as there is still tension on the belt and everything lines up.

Do yourself a favor and get rid of those balance shafts, then you won't have to worry about the belt causing this problem in the future

 

[GST with PSI]

thanks for the reply, i hope everyone else is as encouraging.

 

[TUI2I30]

thanks for the reply, i hope everyone else is as encouraging.

I agree with RossY, you got lucky! Dont drive your car until you replace the timing belt! If you can I'd also remove the balance shafts. Also when you do your timing belt check for the two oil pan bolts that can cause the mark in the below picture. Seems to be a common problem see Another notch in my belt on the Buschur Racing Tech Forums. Good Luck!

 

[Wickedeclipse87]

Yeah thats a scary feeling me nad my sister both got lucky with our balance shaft belts..Mine snapped at idle and I got to it right away but then a bolt somehow got loose and fell in my timing cover taking out my t-belt...My sister snapped her b-shaft belt racing and somehow saved the t-belt but somehow spun a bearing WTF...Yeah you got lucky!!!!Get rid of the b-shafts save a motor and free up a little horsepower

 

[GST with PSI]

if my valves are OK, then why did my car kind of start running crappy? could the balance shaft belt have caused the timing belt to jump teeth enough to make it run crappy, but not bend the valves?

 

[Ryan2ill]

My timing belt slipped the last week. I was just leaving the driveway no faster than 10mph. The car will turn over but I am pretty sure I bent some valves. What are the chances my pistons are shot? I can afford a new head but not a new engine.
Thanks again! Luv this site man

 

[dsm_illicious]

How do you know your t-belt slipped? When was it last changed. Did you mean it snapped?

 

[ddavisaf]

Make sure you get a new tensioner when you fix the timing issue.
There is no way for us to tell whether your pistons are scoured or not. You'll have to pull the head to check it out.

 

[blackGSX2g]

When you pull the head, check out the piston tops. You should dremel down the rough edges so you don't create hot spots in your cylinder. Most of they time they shouldn't need to be replaced. If you are still worried, snap a pic of them and post it up for us to look at.

 

[Defiant]

My timing belt slipped the last week. I was just leaving the driveway no faster than 10mph. The car will turn over but I am pretty sure I bent some valves.

Well, if the initial failure didn't (it did), cranking it would have for certain.

What are the chances my pistons are shot?

Slim.

 

[jastermerrel]

Exact same thing happend to me, i had just backed out and was starting out then...WHAM...metal against metal. Timing belt was still intact and "tight". Pulled the head, 4 intake valves were bent, which I now use for paper weights, the pistons were ok. Only a slight mark where the valves collided.

 

[DSMcrazy3]

Anytime a T-belt slips, or breaks. Expect valves to be shot. The number is just based on how much it slipped/jumped, or the rpm you were traveling when it occured.

Mine snapped at idle, luckily only 2 valves were bent, and no piston damage though.

 

[96' Talon ESI]

Ok I was driving down the road then my timing belt/chain broke. This caused my valves to bend and possibly my cams are bad. What should I do? Rebuilt it for 1900 or just find another whole engine?

 

[theghost]

I would look into prices of used motors and see if there is going to be a significant difference. Also decide what you want out of the car in the long haul. Are you doing the work yourself and what kind of time frame are looking at. Just a few q's that should get you going in the right direction

 

[bigblock]

it's a bit harder to do but I would not rebuild a 420a I would swapp in a 6bolt turbo your car is already down and you sould be able to do the swapp for less than $1900

 

[ddavisaf]

Rebuilding a head isn't that hard. I'm assuming 1900 bucks includes labor (it damn well better for that price!!). If you swap a whole new motor, you'll be looking at at least another 500 for labor.

 

[96' Talon ESI]

well how much would it cost for a 6-bolt turbo motor swap? Where can I get a 6-bolt turbo motor?

 

[91eagle_tsi_awd]

jesus why so much money for a head rebuild??? 2 things i would do

1. go to a different mechanic one that is cheaper

2.buy a head thats in good working order.change the valve seats for insurance and have someone slap it on there.

this shouldnt cost you more than 600 dollars ,well not around here

 

[96' Talon ESI]

Well thats the thing, Where can I find a decent Head? I've looked everywhere.

 

[Drift_SM]

driving home from work....cars running perfect, all of a sudden..."thump" (silence)
ME: "oh no way...you did not just.... son of a b*tch!"

i roll into an ocean state parking lot to my left. a mile from my house. I proceed to get out and pop the hood. not even 5 minutes later my sister pulls in "kate, what are you doing here" (she was going to some sort of party,....i didn't care) she asked me what happend and why i was here, " i broke down."

i see nothing major no visable damage, the thought of fowled plugs ran past me, but since my sister was there for the moment i wanted to take my oil cap off and see if the cams were rotating. kate trys to turn it over as i watch the cams not move an inch
she left.

instantly i felt like throwing my car over a cliff. I called AAA. and requested a flat bed to pick up my car and toe it back to my work. they said maybe an hour wait.

20 Min's later guy shows up. my dad had come to meet me in the mean time.

i watch my car for the first time be winched on to the flat bed...i started to laugh thinking about how every one on the forum talks about there experiences and how many times their cars been towed. "1 for me"

long story short..the guy towed it for free, i gave him a tip... and on Monday me and the techs are ganna put a new belt on and check the compression. lucky for me all the labor and belt is free. (perks for working at the mitsu dealer) also they said even if the valves are bent they'll take care of me, no charge.

Well im turning this into a pool,(no money...obv) bet how many valves you think are bent out of the 16, and if you think any of the pistons are damaged.

ill post the numbers after i take it apart monday or tuesday.

 

[wolf20043]

driving home from work....cars running perfect, all of a sudden..."thump" (silence)
ME: "oh no way...you did not just.... son of a b*tch!"

i roll into an ocean state parking lot to my left. a mile from my house. I proceed to get out and pop the hood. not even 5 minutes later my sister pulls in "kate, what are you doing here" (she was going to some sort of party,....i didn't care) she asked me what happend and why i was here, " i broke down."

i see nothing major no visable damage, the thought of fowled plugs ran past me, but since my sister was there for the moment i wanted to take my oil cap off and see if the cams were rotating. kate trys to turn it over as i watch the cams not move an inch
she left.

instantly i felt like throwing my car over a cliff. I called AAA. and requested a flat bed to pick up my car and toe it back to my work. they said maybe an hour wait.

20 Min's later guy shows up. my dad had come to meet me in the mean time.

i watch my car for the first time be winched on to the flat bed...i started to laugh thinking about how every one on the forum talks about there experiences and how many times their cars been towed. "1 for me"

long story short..the guy towed it for free, i gave him a tip... and on Monday me and the techs are ganna put a new belt on and check the compression. lucky for me all the labor and belt is free. (perks for working at the mitsu dealer) also they said even if a valve(s) are bent they'll take care of me, no charge.

but i what are the chances of the valves being bent going 45...good bad, any personal experiences?

Get ready for your first valve job. I would say chances are 100%. Good luck
Mike

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

You're kidding right? You have a .001% chance that you didnt bend more than 15. My rear bs gear sheared off at idle and it bent them all. You're just gonna have to start ripping it apart and see what all you need to replace...but more than likely its going to be more than just a new set of valves. Have a feeling you are in for a set of pistons too.