(non-Ebay) Electric Turbocharger (Supercharger?)

[Chumpaumpalumpa]

Colder air is better so yes, or at least offer it as an option or upgrade.

 

[91-GS]

Seems like an entire kit would not really be necessary, although an ice box that an intake pipe runs through would be nice.

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(interesting how when searching for 'ice box intercooler' a 4G63 engine is at the top of image search list)

 

[Chumpaumpalumpa]

Thats actually pretty cool but keep pipes as short as possible so on the intake like that is a good idea

 

[teknicalissue]

Seems like an entire kit would not really be necessary, although an ice box that an intake pipe runs through would be nice.

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(interesting how when searching for 'ice box intercooler' a 4G63 engine is at the top of image search list)

That's why I like em. They match the whole drop and go thing and there will be little to no need for additional intercooling piping. I was actually thinking of this kit:

https://www.frozenboost.com/liquid-....html?osCsid=22a4d51b45ceb89b38268d96883aa748

It's cheap and the ice box is not necessary (water runs through a small radiator that doesn't need to get direct airflow). You could add an ice box. It really doesn't matter what kit I choose; this is one of those things that everyone would be able to choose. If they want an ice box they can have it .

When the prototype passes bench testing.. I'm actually going to build another prototype with the same exact set-up. I will then be putting it in my new audi and getting some Dyno numbers . After that (And after I make sure these things will be safe to run under our hoods) I'll be passing them around to everyone who helped me getting this idea in to fruition. You can put it in your car, tune it, and see if the power is worth the total price (which is tbd).

Sharing is caring right?

Thats actually pretty cool but keep pipes as short as possible so on the intake like that is a good idea

Agreed; That kit I posted above should make things pretty short.. Take a look!

 

[teknicalissue]

Small update!

I got the final dimensions from the Chinese motor company!

Shaft dimensions will change a bit with new dimensions I sent them.

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As promised, the electric motor will come with the shaft to mount the compressor wheel!

Still playing the waiting game but so far so good!

 

[91-GS]

Impressive that something that can produce that much power is small enough to be a part of a fancy cordless drill.

 

[teknicalissue]

Impressive that something that can produce that much power is small enough to be a part of a fancy cordless drill.

Agreed. I read somewhere that we can build all sorts of powerful motors. The limitation isn't the machines we build but what we use to power them. This small motor will deplete 4 car batteries in 6 minutes .

Also.. I've been talking to the CNC guy and we've made a test backplate and learned a couple of lessons. The Lip I made was 0.75mm and it was too thin for the application so I'm making the lip (the part that sits on the O ring) 3.125mm thick. That should be strong enough to be machined and not bow/rip as well as provide a tight seal on top of the O ring. I thought I'd post the pics up for you guys to see how nifty it looks

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[teknicalissue]

Check out the back plate for the 20G!

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[tmoney20g]

Did you see this yet ?

https://www.facebook.com/forgedperf...5575192519458/849412325135742/?type=1&theater

 

[teknicalissue]

Did you see this yet ?

https://www.facebook.com/forgedperf...5575192519458/849412325135742/?type=1&theater

I did read that and I wish there were a more official article out there to explain how 12v could power the electric motor. Those wires are crazy thick so it's 12v with ungodly amounts of amps maybe?

Someone on this thread proposed the idea and I'm playing around with a universal concept (the motor would go in the front of the compressor wheel spinning the shaft) that would fit on any turbo.

Once this prototype is proven to work, I'll begone working on that concept i just mentioned

 

[91-GS]

Amperage is probably the way, judging by those huge power cables.
Not sure if that makes any difference since overall power stays the same, but what about using a smaller motor rated for higher voltage and a voltage booster to go from let's say 12V 100A to 120V 10A?

 

[Chumpaumpalumpa]

Amperage is probably the way, judging by those huge power cables.
Not sure if that makes any difference since overall power stays the same, but what about using a smaller motor rated for higher voltage and a voltage booster to go from let's say 12V 100A to 120V 10A?

A voltage booster? You mean like a transformer? That could potentially be viable, but that would negatively affect spool up time. I don't know, you might have to do some testing To find something the right balance, but remember, a transformer is not 100% efficient so you will lose some power.

 

[91-GS]

Not just a transformer, they are a bit more complicated. Here's an example: http://www.rmvhf.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Low_Voltage_Switcher.jpg
While power losses are indeed present let's think of this as a perfect world example with 100% efficiency.

One may wonder why go through all this trouble instead of just going with a low voltage motor. An answer would be weight. As far as i know a physically smaller high voltage motor would produce same power as physically larger low voltage motor. If that is the case then having a smaller more powerful-per-size motor plus a voltage booster would still get a smaller and lighter over all unit when compared to lower voltage throughout. Plus there won't be a meed for massive cables to carry the high voltage.

 

[teknicalissue]

Amperage is probably the way, judging by those huge power cables.
Not sure if that makes any difference since overall power stays the same, but what about using a smaller motor rated for higher voltage and a voltage booster to go from let's say 12V 100A to 120V 10A?

No matter how we look at it, it's only 1,200 watts. Based on the calculations in our previous post.. That would equate to about 1ish psi. It's hard to determine how much power that bugger makes without information such as how much boost it generates without help of an exhaust. Not saying it's fake, I'm just saying that idk if we have enough details to pick it a part

A voltage booster? You mean like a transformer? That could potentially be viable, but that would negatively affect spool up time. I don't know, you might have to do some testing To find something the right balance, but remember, a transformer is not 100% efficient so you will lose some power.

Not just a transformer, they are a bit more complicated. Here's an example: http://www.rmvhf.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Low_Voltage_Switcher.jpg
While power losses are indeed present let's think of this as a perfect world example with 100% efficiency.

One may wonder why go through all this trouble instead of just going with a low voltage motor. An answer would be weight. As far as i know a physically smaller high voltage motor would produce same power as physically larger low voltage motor. If that is the case then having a smaller more powerful-per-size motor plus a voltage booster would still get a smaller and lighter over all unit when compared to lower voltage throughout. Plus there won't be a meed for massive cables to carry the high voltage.

True. I wish we had more info at this point it's all maybes and what ifs.

I've been thinking About that assist system more and more (where you would mount the motor in front of the comp wheel instead of the chra) and was wondering if charging happens natively on electric motors with ESC's or would something special need to be done

 

[teknicalissue]

While I wait for the motor.. I've been thinking about the front mounted motor in front of a compressor wheel more and more.

Does anyone know how an ESC handles current generated by the electric motor for when the exhaust kicks in?

two.. is there a set distance between the top of the compressor wheel thread and the compressor housing inlet hole?

I'm going to try to come up with drafts of the idea to share. I think this would be another neat idea to get power.. In theory it should work like that F1 system except for the motor being infront of the compressor wheel instead of the CHRA

 

[teknicalissue]

Just wanted to update you guys by saying that I just purchased the water pump and the water cooler! I also had to purchase a cheap ebay grade blow off valve for obvious reasons.

Here are the parts I've purchased for you all to pick it apart!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mini-DC-12V...-Aquarium-Fish-Tank-Water-Pump-/351461332489?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/311018096117?item=311018096117&viewitem=&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/110838328015?item=110838328015&viewitem=&vxp=mtr

Also.. I decided to buy a running salvaged 1994 honda accord ($300.. Thanks copart!) for the sake of testing. I didn't think testing this on cars that I finance or DD would be a good idea. Specially not on a first run of the E-turbo. I'm also going to be doing this at the local dyno to pull good data!

So let's take a look at the shopping list:

Electric motor - Waiting
ESC - Waiting
Batteries - Waiting
Water pump - purchased
Water Radiator - Purchased
Blow off valve - Purchased
Arduino - Purchased
Compressor Housing - Purchased
Compressor Wheel - Purchased
Compressor backplate - Purchased

I don't think I missed anything else!

 

[91-GS]

Are you sure that pump would be enough? Only 1 GPM flow so it would probably take it 30 seconds to a full minute just to circulate water one time.

 

[teknicalissue]

Are you sure that pump would be enough? Only 1 GPM flow so it would probably take it 30 seconds to a full minute just to circulate water one time.

Well I went with the link another member provided! Can you recommend one for the application?

 

[91-GS]

Can't recommend any specific one, but if this setup is for just the motor then why not use existing cooling system and tap into it?
If that is not possible, however, i'd say try to get a pump that would circulate water once every 10 seconds or so (maybe 5 GPM?). Or a simple ice box will do since this motor is only meant to run in short bursts.

Can't help but think that this was discussed already though. If that is the case, apologies for questioning it again.

 

[teknicalissue]

Can't recommend any specific one, but if this setup is for just the motor then why not use existing cooling system and tap into it?

I asked this before and the reason we don't want to do this is because the motor needs to be below engine coolant temps. I think the Max temp for this motor is around 200*F so it needs its own cooling system.

If that is not possible, however, i'd say try to get a pump that would circulate water once every 10 seconds or so (maybe 5 GPM?). Or a simple ice box will do since this motor is only meant to run in short bursts.

I'll go ahead and purchase a motor capable of this just in case! These brushless water pumps are fairly cheap so it shouldn't be a problem.

Can't help but think that this was discussed already though. If that is the case, apologies for questioning it again.

No need for apologies! It's good to rethink things I would hate for the electric motor to overheat and sit idle for another couple of months

 

[teknicalissue]

Another update!

Just purchased for of these little bad boys:

http://www.apexbattery.com/telesys-db1235-battery.html

12 volt @ 35amps should be more than enough for testing and a test run right?

Gotta say I'm excited :0)

 

[babyviper]

are you able to increase the boost as the rpm increases? If not, you need bypass vlave as this will be more like a supercharger.

 

[teknicalissue]

are you able to increase the boost as the rpm increases? If not, you need bypass vlave as this will be more like a supercharger.

That is correct! I have a control unit that will have different levels of power based on rpm.

As a side note... I'll be using an old school fuel management unit that is pressure dependent.

It may not be ideal (will run slightly rich) but it will prevent the honda from running too lean and pinging.

Lol I don't think I have the patience for installing/chipping the car with hondata and paying for a tune

 

[teknicalissue]

I got the bov and cooler in the mail today.

This is what the cooling setup looks like. Pretend the paint brushe is the water pump

You can also see the bov on the top... Slowly but surely it's all coming together

 

[91-GS]

Is the BOV really needed? If power to the motor gets cut via a switch under the clutch pedal i'd think that turbine/motor would slow down quite a bit due to all that pressure in the intake and there will not be as much of a surge as with a conventional turbo. Then again a typical turbo's rotating assembly is not all that heavy either and if this was the case no BOVs would be needed anywhere.

Either way, parts can be removed later after the idea as a whole has proven itself.