Mitsubishi Diesel Engine

[ImportWarrior]

2.6 short block had been used as a diesel. also used in fork lifts as well.

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by ImportWarrior
2.6 short block had been used as a diesel. also used in fork lifts as well.

Expand upon. Do you mean you know someone that has converted a 2.6L to a diesel? There are 2 versions, 2.3L and 2.5L. I have yet to find anything on a 2.6L 4cyl.

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by hellotbone
Ok Im a bit of a Diesel Guru I make over 600 RWHP dyno'd on my 5.9L cummins in my Dodge Pickup.

Diesel is a wonderful HP application but there are tradeoff's first will be SMOKE to make HP with a diesel there will always be smoke lots of thick black sooty smoke.

Second is a tranny to handle the torque they put out my truck puts out just shy of 1200 FT lbs which is hard to tame many have not seen a diesel daulie light up all 4 wheels for 3 gears I can.

So the possibilities are limitless really stay away from propane on a diesel though its highly unliked in the diesel world if you look around N2O is much more liked. Also if you are gonna spray it the turbo's take a beating I know this because I exploded an hx 40 holset turbo on the N20 so that is an issue. Head gaskets are as well with high boost levels we run 60 PSI in the trucks and twin turbo guys run over 100 PSI so holding that head on is a chore too. You will be able to make huge HP with that engine it would be best off for you if you can get one with manual injecton rather then ECU controlled as there is probably no chip from them available and the manual pumps can be turned up quite a bit. If you get it I have a very good friend that can extrude hone the injectors to flow more he is located in TX. He also produces EDM injectors for cummins Diesels. Your probably going to end up around 30 PSI in that car if you get it all said and done Diesels also like huge intercoolers so make sure and have FMIC in place. If you need any help shoot me a PM I can gather as much info as possible on it.

Cool!! Very impressive. Dodge rules the roost.

I don't think I'll be making anywhere near that amount of power. As for the tranny handling the increased torque, see my previous post.

I'm not too worried if it smokes!! As long as it's not OIL. I can deal with the added carbon deposits.

All my friends back home running Cummins and Powerstrokes have had bigger gains with propane than they ever did with N20. Trucks tv show even doctored up a Duramax. The increase from te N2O was 1/8 of what they got from the propane. Maybe you can explain why your case is different, or more on your experience there.

Big intercooler? Check. Powerstroke aquired. It's patiently awaiting a home.

I may take you up on the injector service in the future. Until I get a motor, I can't get too far. I've got some friends searching some yards trying to find one right now. Dammed it they all didn't get crushed. At least it seems that way. They aren't exaclty hot ticket items that the yards have held onto.

 

[GPTourer]

Originally posted by chrisAWD
I really think you'll be extremely disapointed with the results of a diesel motor buildup. Diesel's are not designed for high hp. They are designed for low end torque and fuel economy. If you do this you'll end up with a low hp, low revving dog.

First of all check this out.

(They take forever to stage, so skip to halfway. "Bye bye FC")

Yeah, yeah - get you some of 'dat. Absolutely sick.

My suggestion, why don't you look into getting something out of one of the smaller Mitsu-Fuso trucks? You'd have a much newer/larger parts base, and perhaps a more powerful engine to start with.

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by GPTourer
My suggestion, why don't you look into getting something out of one of the smaller Mitsu-Fuso trucks? You'd have a much newer/larger parts base, and perhaps a more powerful engine to start with.

1. I've looked at them. I think they are all 6cyl's, at least those I've looked at. The six is too big, as I want to keep the transverse engine configuration. Now if I found one with a 4cyl........... that be perfect. I'll have to do some more research there.

2. I'd agree to the larger parts base.

3. I'm not sure on the block compatability to the trans. At least the 2.3 or 2.5 will have a wide or narrow block. (the whole D50 trans scenario) Which I don't know yet.

 

[Hooptytalon]

All my friends back home running Cummings and Powerstrokes have had bigger gains with Propane than they ever did with N20. Trucks tv show even doctored up a Duramax. The increase from te N2O was 1/8 of what they got from the propane. Maybe you can explain why your case is different, or more on your experience there.

You have to be "overfueling" to make any gains with N2O on a diesel...from what I understand about propane, your cylinder pressures and EGTs go thru the roof (i know on a B5.9 Cummins it's not wise to go over 1250-1300 *F for very long) shouldn't be a problem with an o ring job or a metal head gasket


BTW: I see alot more PowerJokes running propane to keep up with the Dodges just running on ol #2

 

[hellotbone]

I dyno out at 500 RWHP with #2 with N20 it pushes it over 600 a buddy of mine jambs more N2O into his and goes from 550 to 740 HP on N2O you have to be over fueled. The problem with C3H8(propane) is that you only inject propane not fuel with it like N20 so your EGT's go though the roof where as N20 you inject fuel as well to cool the cylinders. The hone is no big deal my buddy can do it any time EDM is the Chit though! big fuel atomization and less smoke! More HP! My injectors are just over 140 HP on injectors alone! So he can go huge for you but its gonna smoke I would concider something around the size of a holset HX 35 off a 94-2002 dodge Manual trans the auto's have an HY with a non adjustable wastegate in the later years. I can also point you to a turbo master to control the boost to what settings you wish. The HX will flow more then enough for what you will ever need and probably make 25-30 PSI of boost.

Looks like your trans should be fine!

 

[Morphius]

Ok. What I've found thus far:

The block is simliar in bore/stroke to the G54B......... ie. the starion block. However, because is wears the 4D designation, it may have a block/tranny bolt pattern like that of the 4G engines.... ie 4G63 and 4G64. Hopefully soon, I'll locate a block to verify.

The head has 5 studs per cylinder vs the G54B's four. Something I'm looking into is the spacing of the bores. Potential for a DOHC head to fit? Would be nice...... OR, use the 4D55 head with a 4G64 block.

The compression ratio is 21:1. This is due in large part to the flat head. The valves are flush with the bottom of the head. No chamber. SO, if I incorporate a DOHC head, I loose compression. I need to stay above 16:1. Anyone know the chamber volume of a 2.0L DOHC head?

What is the maximum overbore allowed on the 4G64 block? Could you go out to 91mm. (Sounds excesssive, but I've seen 60's sixes that you could do that easily. )

Who sells domed 4G64 pistons? What is C/R with them? How about custom pistons. I'd want to minimize the clearance with the DOHC head. However, how will they burn? That really wouldn't give good geometry for Compression Ingition (CI).

Anyone know of DOHC 4cyl head out that is flat with next to no combustion chamber?

 

[sophat34]

marco up at magnus can get you the pistons he deals with ross. tell him what you are up too mabey he'll get them to you at his cost, if he wont find out if he can get them and I'll get them for you. I have a whosale acct with them. also do you know what year those vehicals were produced, my grand-pa has a junk yard mostly old stuff, we haven't had a crusher in there ever mabey I can find you a block, free of course.
I wish you the best in this I am really interested to see how it comes out.

 

[B00STED4banger]

i've noticed nobody is thinking about the transmissoin, i would like to see a dsm tranny withstand 1000fl lbs of torque.

 

[lost888key]

I think what morphius is talking about is converting a diesel into gas. Take the deisel short block and finding a gas head to fit it. Now, that everyone has had a good laugh, my brother-in-law had a friend that did this to a VW Rabbit. There were problems, all the holes for the head didn't match, (that however didn't affect engine sealing), and about once a week he needed CV axels (gotta love life-time warrentys). For your engine check out www.car-part.com They had the engine I wanted cheap. (It was for a DOHC turbo Impulse that I was going to drop into a Chevy Spectrum, I rolled it exactly 2 weeks before I ordered the engine )

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by B00STED4banger
i've noticed nobody is thinking about the transmissoin, i would like to see a dsm tranny withstand 1000fl lbs of torque.

Well, I'm not out to build up a monsterous engine. Simply, take the stock engine and open it up a bit. For example, if a DOHC head could be adapted, then it would breathe quite a bit better. Header? 1G intake? Bigger injectors? Bigger turbo? Bigger I/C? See where I'm going....... If can get something decent to work that makes 200-300HP then it shouldn't be any worse that a 4G64 motor. Do they make 1000ft lbs of torque? Not quite....

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by lost888key
I think what morphius is talking about is converting a diesel into gas. Take the deisel short block and finding a gas head to fit it. Now, that everyone has had a good laugh, my brother-in-law had a friend that did this to a VW Rabbit. There were problems, all the holes for the head didn't match, (that however didn't affect engine sealing), and about once a week he needed CV axels (gotta love life-time warrentys). For your engine check out www.car-part.com They had the engine I wanted cheap. (It was for a DOHC turbo Impulse that I was going to drop into a Chevy Spectrum, I rolled it exactly 2 weeks before I ordered the engine )

Yes. You'd be correct on the potential conversion. The problem lies with the compression ratio. It needs to be high. And the combustion chamber design. CI engines have a cup in the top of the piston to promote swirling of the fuel. So, haveing a Hemi shaped combustion chamber(vs flat) with domed pistons to bump the CR up, isn't quite the same.

There are a total of 3 listed in the states on that site and they all want WAY too much for this "experiment" to take place. I've also found a couple of FUSO 4cyl's around, but I'm not too sure how much they have in common with the 4D55's. I've got a FUSO service manual on the way so, I should know soon.

BTW, how did the uncles car run?

 

[B00STED4banger]

it sounded like you planned on building some monster diesel engine, with 500+ ft lbs of torque. still a 4g64 and any kind of big turbo will make short work of a stock 1g tranny.

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by B00STED4banger
it sounded like you planned on building some monster diesel engine, with 500+ ft lbs of torque. still a 4g64 and any kind of big turbo will make short work of a stock 1g tranny.

I guess the potential is there to hit that, but who knows at this point. Some more research is in process.....


BTW, anyone in the Detroit Metro area have a 420a head they'd lend me for a week? Simple measurements and pics to be taken of it..... I promise I'd give it back!!

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by lost888key
....... DOHC turbo Impulse.....

IS that engine a diesel? GM flavor, right?

 

[lost888key]

Originally posted by Morphius
IS that engine a diesel? GM flavor, right?

no, Isuzu produced and manufactured it for 2 years before they quit selling cars in this country, block designation 4xe1-wt, the t is for turbo, nitrided crank and rods, factory redline @ 8100rpm, it was Isuzu's answer to the Eclipse. That engine would have put my Spectrum (I-Mark) into the high ten's with a turbo change. Check out www.kipanderson.net for everything you wanted to know about this engine.

As for the other VW rabbit never seen it, but it was supposed to be damn scary, considering it was the early '80, and turbo was still a word you shouldn't say.

 

[Morphius]

Well, I'm still dilligently looking for an engine.

The national search comes up with 2. One is $1100. The other is missing the head, which is essential.

I've searched four yards in Michigan so far and found nothing. More to go, but just haven't had the time.

This weekend, while home for the holdiays, I searched 23 yards within a 200 mile radius and found ONE. My luck, it's in their yard truck and they don't want to give it up. I was hoping the largest yard in the tristate area (which is 100+ acres) would have it. NOPE. Sweet yard, as they have everything sorted and racked. Even front clips.

I've located several JDM engines. But they are too proud of those.

So, I'm back to searching. I'll offer up a $50 finders bounty to anyone with information leading to the purchase of a complete motor that's priced under $500.

 

[pradamike]

what exact motor are u looking for? I could probably find one here in mn for u there are some pretty wicked yards around my house

 

[Morphius]

Originally posted by pradamike
what exact motor are u looking for? I could probably find one here in mn for u there are some pretty wicked yards around my house

Cool, I'd appreciate that.

It's a 4D55 4cyl Diesel. Found in 83-85 Mitsubishi Mighty Max and Dodge D-50 pickups.

I'm looking for a complete motor valve cover to oil pan, including the injection system.

 

[Morphius]

Well, no luck so far. I did find one on EBAY but somebody outbid me in the last 15 secs!!

Anyhow, I've since learned that the 4D55 (2.3L) was also available in 85-87 Ford Rangers!!! This is good news!!! More potential to finding one.

I've also picked up a 2wd 4D55 5spd and flywheel. See the attached pic.


I'll still offer up a $50 finders bounty to anyone with information leading me to the purchase of a complete motor that's priced under $500.

Again, I'm looking for a complete motor, valve cover to pan. Including injection setup.

 

[DSM mechanix]

So now your making it diesel and RWD, have fun...

 

[92awddsm]

I will keep a lookout here in Va for a cheap engine. Im kinda interested in the outcome of this. As for the cylinder head dilemma, you can get the chambers welded up and clover leafed and effectively loose 20-30cc. Just from memory of seeing mine when it was apart, Im guessing a cc volume of 60-70 cc but that is just a guess. Head bolt holes might possibly drilled and sleeved if clearances permit Pistons can always be custom made to your specs and cams can be reground to custom specs also. Anything is possible but what is it worth to you?

 

[Hooptytalon]

http://www.dieselenginetrader.com/index.cfm

 

[Morphius]

For reference, the 4D55/56 was a wide block, like the G54B motor.

Well, due to lack of availability of the 4D55 and 4D56 engines and the wide block design, I've opted to move to a different varient. I'm picking up a 1.8L JDM diesel. 12V SOHC. Currenlty, non-turbo. I've found that the 4D65/68 diesel share similiar block as the 4G series motors, with the narrow block pattern. I'll also be able to bore it out to 2.0L and get OEM pistons for it. See, the 4D65 is 1.8L. The 4D68 is 2.0L. Both came in turbo/non-turbo format. I speculate that the intake and headers on the 4G series motors might work on this head.

My plan is to install this in my 90 TSI (FWD) which spun a bearing and is currenlty without a motor. As you can see from the pics this will be a very easy transplant (note similiar mount locations as the 4G series motors). The motor was available in the Mirage/Lancer plateforms.

Below are some pics. I expect it to arrive next weekend or early the following week.