how does my upgrade path sound?

[Alex Bland]

first off im the type to buy something once i dont want to but something that ill end up needing bigger of later.

1.boost gauge
2.MBC
3.Dsmlink/2g maf/02 wideband
4.exhaust (apex-i) and downpipe
5. exhaust manifold / maybe o2 housing?
6.injectors/255 fuelpump/afpr
then ill work on clutch and other parts that dont go with the engine and then rebuild internals to the engine.

thats just a little path that i have going as of now

maybe im jumping too fast too dsmlink lite. but im worried im gunna need my car tuned and i live out in middle of no where with no shop around that can tune it for me i would get it right before the injectors but can a 1g maf run all the stuff with no wideband and 2g maf.. so just the exhaust stuff.

 

[ttetzner]

i'd do dsmlink after the exhaust unless you get a nice used one cheap, and you might need to change the manifold/o2 housing depending on what turbo you swap in,if any

 

[Alex Bland]

can i do that 2g maf and the wideband without tuning car? also i plan on evo3 16g turbo someday. i think? my goal is around 400awhp

 

[jestoy7]

I did the 2g MAF and 550's at the same time and the car ran fine without tuning device. A few weeks later I installed an AFC and fine tuned it.

The very first mod on your car should be maintenance. Then I would do, 1) Exhaust and Downpipe 2) Upgraded intercooler pipes to take the rubber crap out 3) intake 4) MBC and Boost Gauge 5) Re-wire your pump and maybe install a walbro 6) AFPR

I would do the exhaust manifold, turbo swap and o2 housing in one shot to avoid double work.

 

[FLASH1970]

400awhp isn't going to be easy with a 16g turbo. Possible, but not easy. They have "TECH" articles with some good advice on upgrade paths. I'd say start reading through those and post up if you have questions.

 

[kqodprez]

In my opinion you should use an safc/logger combo since you are new to the game and they are WAY easier to tune with. With a E3, 650's and an safc you can put down some pretty impressive numbers. Also I'd push the clutch swap up towards the top. You can make power with the 14b if your clutch and suspension are on point. My question though is A: how are you going to measure this power if there is no shop around and B: what are you main goals for the car as far as what's it's going to be used for?

 

[16G1G4G63Talon]

why would u wanna do a 2g maf when u have the capabilities on dsmlink to do a gm maf and translator...and yes using a safc is alot easier way to go....do some rc 650cc injectors, walbro 255lph fuel pump, and stay away from the 14b....if you are wanting to shoot for 400 it wont be on a 16g...im not saying its impossible, just improboble...get u a holset and a t3 manifod, do all the necessary plumming, and run your piping and be done with it....u can make a good setup man if u put your mind to it and not rush things...that is key...and if you are not a fan of holset, get you a good spooling gt30r or gt35r...if u have the money b4 u worry about your turbo setup i would seriously consider doing the rotating assembly b4 you go through all that trouble and have to worry about compression....and save urself bent valves and do a balance shaft delete...and a good clutch is key if u wanna make the power your shooting for....we aint building hondas here so we dont have to put that much guess work into it...read up and see what fits your budget and your style...be unique

 

[JEFFREYCASTGSX]

DSMlink isnt your only tuning option, theres also...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/320276-ostrich-tuner-pro.html
Ostrich 2.0 : The New Breed [OSTRICH_2] - $175.00 : Moates.Net
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tun...l-free-speed-density-tuning-software-1gs.html
DSMChips.com | DSM ECU Chips Enchanced by Keydiver
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/264625-dsmap-install-thoughts.html

 

[Alex Bland]

Thanks for all the input, i plan on when i have my car all done going too englishracing and having them dyno. Also i was trying to stay away from using money for safc mainly because i didnt want to get it then have to spend the money on a dsmlink later, i did all the maintenance to the car already. i didnt wanna buy new intake pipes because then i would need to buy new ones again when i get the 2g mas, thats why i was gunna do them both at once. and my IC pipeing i was going to do when i get fmic.

i guess my questions now are
Should i consider safc?
i havnt looked into them much so i wasnt too sure about them.
my dumb question if i do bigger injectors what size should i get for my goal and do i need to tune if i get a 255 fuel pump cause if not ill get that before whatever tuning device i get maybe a safc.
also whats a good safc to get?

 

[jestoy7]

I agree not to buy the SAFC because Link will make it obsolete. What I would recommend is to do the mods to the car on the 14b that you can. Then save up and gather the parts to swap in the next turbo. It's not instant gratification, but you will mod it right the first time around.

 

[Alex Bland]

Yeah thats what i was planning on doing. for the fuel pump re-wire. whats the point of it? i looked it up and it doesnt say why just says how =p

 

[jestoy7]

The fuel pump is supposed to get 12V but because its in the back of the car and connected with a small wire, it really doesn't get 12V. The re-wire ensures that the fuel pump gets the right voltage and therefore performs better = more fuel.

 

[endeffect0]

Alex:
Your really using your head on the mod list. Its nice not to see something like 50trim, cat back, walbro 255 and 19inch rims, have a 10s car; as an upgrade path.

If you want you can do everything in the order you specified. your definitely smart enough to know what works and what does not.


SAFC is something to be avoided. For a number of reasons, but mostly because it attempts to trick the computer into thinking there is less airflow to compensate for larger injectors. this leads to odd A/F conditions and often erratic timing. it works for some, but if it can be avoided there are better options.

I like the way you have the first list set up. Everyone will want to do it their own way, but there is nothing wrong with the way you have it. It goes without saying but get your maintenance solid and the free mods done first.

As far as engine management goes, obviously many options available. Many people will tell you that you can wait, and you can. Personally I love my dsmlink, Its value is much much greater than just tuning alone. If you're the type of person who likes to 'set it and forget it' then maybe either hold off or look at other options. But if you like to tinker, and to look and have access to information on what your engine is doing at various points then consider doing it as early as you can afford. Personally I wouldn't write it off as a first mod, it won't make you go any faster on its own, but having the information available to you is worth So much. at least to me.

Rather than tell you what to do ill tell you what I did. all free mods and maintenance, 3inch from the turbo back, intake and filter, boost and oil pressure gauges, re-wire fuel pump. I found that I really liked Autox and good throttle response fit my driving style more than a big turbo so i bought DSM link and a T-28 with a 17psi actuator. Though DSM link i leaned alot about how the car works and what it needs. One of the top issues i noticed with dsm link is I had very very high intake air temps. so i built a custom ram air box and could feel and see the change it made in temps. I with dsmlink i could see that i was knocking at a little throughout the rpm range and determined that my car didnt like 92 octane wawa/sheetz gas and witnessed the return of better ignition timing. and so on. many mods after that but you get the idea. Dont be scared away from tuning your car yourself. pros do it better, but your smart enough to do it just fine until you make crazy power.

I have since based all my mods around the power under the curve, and handling around curves. For all that i have done I have never wanted a bigger turbo than the T28... every person is differnt so dont set a HP goal, just go by what you want more of when you have seat time. Maybe you just want more top end power, maybe you want a Higher trap speed or a lower lap time..

Information is as valuable as gas in the tank when it comes to improving your car.

as always feel free to PM if you ever wana chat.

 

[Alex Bland]

Thank you for all the info, I see that you and me think quite the same with our cars. The main reason i picked to do dsmlink before the exhaust is because (usaly when im bored) i read about people stuff and what may happen. and i see some people get fuel cut from the exhaust, witch requires bigger injectors, witch require a tuning software >.< if i knew it would not be hitting fuel cut that mod would be before. I looked into the re-wire and i understand it more. And i will be doing that when i can. also i didnt see a reason to upgrade my air intake only from what the fact that i dont want to use 60 bucks to get one to fit my 1g mas and then get a 2g and need to spend more to get a new one again =) from the way i look at it almost everything i do somehow turns around to needing link that why i chose to do it so early. feel free to tell me if something i said is wrong like the exhaust maybe or something like that. I made sure to do all the maintenance first english racing even rebuilt my motor and did BSE cause i was way to scared to do my own timing belt i didnt wanna ruin my motor. (trying to find a cheap donor car to practice on) also free mods, i did mostly all them that i could. I just orderd up a boost gauge to see how thats going as well. Ill go ahead and say now sorry for grammer and spelling. even though im a kid i wanna learn how to do this the right way im not the honda kid that wants to put a big turbo on my car run 40 pounds of boost once and blow up my engine. and im the kind that doesnt like to spend money so if theres a way to buy something once ill do it. The path you told me i will look into the one im picking is just from in my head what i think works best so i know all of it might not be right. I do understand mostly how everything works.

 

[endeffect0]

just to be clear, i am not saying that anyone should do it 'my way' or that its better than any other, i was just posting that up to show you one possible option.

Given what you say about yourself, I highly recommend dsmlink whenever you can afford it.
Also in regards to money well spent and your own know how… I think you will find you are more than intelligent enough to do anything your car requires from an oil change to a timing belt to rebuilding a head. If you read enough and are willing to get your hands dirty you can do it all. That brings me right to my next point. There is no reason you cant build the parts you need, intake and intercooler piping are very simple to fabricate. Check out the fabrication section for some examples, but when I wanted new intercooler pipes for my side mount I picked up an upper intercooler pipe from the FS section for 40bucks complete with HKS bov and I made my own lower ic pipe from 5$ worth of exhaust piping and a very cheap Flux core welder, that I literally just picked up (read a few how too’s) and then went to town with.

Us DSMers are a cheap lot, and if you hunt the used parts you can do amazing things with very little money. IMPO DSMs are the Best mod per $ out there. With a mild amount of competence and a little bravery you can do anything to these cars.

 

[Alex Bland]

Hmm tbh i forgot all about making my own parts =) i know u went saying ## way was the best. Im gunna start looking into building my own piping maybe thanks for the good tip.

 

[redrockergsx]

you spending to much on this car for only a e316g i had that and i put out 350 hp on a safc no need for wide bands and dsmlink.