did i put the piston rings in wrong?

[98GSt_4life]

when i in stalled my rings i didnt know that i was suppose to turn the ring gaps 90 degrees from each other. i really didnt pay attenting to which way they were facing when i installed everything. i have 1500 miles on the engine now and it runs great but im only getting 150 compression across. and my friends tell me that it still smells like its burning oil when they drive behind me, although it does not smoke.

is my problem, that my rings just havent set yet or is it because the rings might be in wrong???

they are 2g pistons so i would expect the compression to be higher..

 

[DiamondStarAwd]

How did you break the car in?

 

[rich3389]

They could just be smelling unburned fuel, most dsms, especially with stock AFR have an odor to them.

 

[98GSt_4life]

well when i rebuilt the engine i installed a new clutch, so the first 500 miles on it was real easy going. then after that i still did the motoman method just for the hell of it. and i still do alot of engine breaking to try and get them to set.

and i have an aeromotive FPR so i dont think its that.

oh and im using 10w-30 conventional oil for the break in... if that makes a diference

 

[Jeff_Ciesielski]

I seem to remember you asking a similar question about a month ago. To answer your question, yes it is possible that you installed the rings wrong, if your top 2 rings were facing the same direction, it is entirely possible that you would get less than perfect compression. However, as I stated before, your rings set in the first 100 miles, actually the first 20 miles or so are the most crucial. Taking it easy, while perhaps good for a stock clutch is absolutely NO GOOD for your engine and will result in low compression. I'd rather replace a clutch disk than replace rings. Having said this though, if your car runs fine, screw it. Your compression isn't going to get any higher and as long as its even, the worst you are going to experience is some blow by.

-Jeff

 

[98GSt_4life]

would i have to get new rings or can i just pull the head and reposition the rings the right way

 

[Jeff_Ciesielski]

Well, if they are within spec according to the service manual, then its *possible* if your rings were put in wrong to reposition them. However, I would strongly recommend just putting new rings in. Also, who bored/honed your engine, just out of curiosity?

 

[98GSt_4life]

just to make sure before i start to tear into the motor again if the rings are gaped correctly but the gaps were not lined up a half or quarter turn from each other then i need to redo the rings????

when i installed them i didnt think it would matter ### i thought the rings would shift around after i started the engine..

 

[gsx951]

The rings will rotate and move around on the piston by themselves. As long as the motor is running strong, I wouldn't mess with it.
The only rings that do not move around on the piston are the ones used in two stroke motors. Those pistons have retaining pins to keep the ring in place because you do not want the ring ends snaging a port in the cylinder.

 

[98GSt_4life]

ok thats what i wanted to hear

so i should not worry about pulling the pistons out correct?

and why does the manual say to have each ring gap a 1/4 turn from the other?

 

[gsx951]

and why does the manual say to have each ring gap a 1/4 turn from the other?

Beacuse the gaps ideally should not line up. Keep in mind two things:
1) the ring end gap is set up to all but close when the motor is hot and the ring expands.
2) the second ring really isn't a compression ring but in fact it's an oil scraper. The second ring has a larger gap that allows blow by to pass.....Typically is is five or six thousandths wider.

Did you test your compression with oil?
The lower compression numbers could be cam overlap, what are you running and did you degree your cams?

 

[98GSt_4life]

im running stock cams and my timing is dead on.. but ill get the results of another compression test in the morning

 

[gotlag]

Offering another opinion, just watch your oil consumption. I also agree that the top 2 rings will rotate a bit, but most enigines I have built, and then tore down to refresh have shown no movement of the 2 thin rings that hold the oil scraping bottom ring. If they are both lined up then it is possible to consume a bit of oil and there is the off chance that they are not supporting the tension ring correctly. Really though, at this point, just drive it and watch the first couple oil changes. If all is well, leave it alone.

 

[Savage Talon]

Did you install the rings right sight up? Nobody has mentioned it but the top rings go with the dot or the label facing up.

 

[98GSt_4life]

i did not notice any markings on the rings i had, but i did notice that one of the side had kind of a rounded edge i guess you could say, and i put that facing up.. i think

 

[Savage Talon]

Every compression ring I have seen had some sort of marking on one side of the ring and that went up. So you may have installed the top (compression) ring in upside down.

 

[98GSt_4life]

ok i finaly got back from vacation and got another commpresion test done..

164-165-150-164 this is with about 2000 miles on the rebuild now..

i put a cap full of oil in the 3rd cylender and the compression jumped up to 178

i dident do the other 3 ### i figured i would get the same result...

what im concerned about now is when i sterted the car back up there was alot of white smoke coming from the breather hose but it would go away when i rev it up and come back at idle. it stopped after a few mins, but its ever done that before...

 

[Black_Bullet]

Maybe you have some blow by. Dont just look for your max compression number, also take into account of how many cranks it takes to get full compression. If it takes a while to build full compression def would be some leak down. ( Which is more prone on a older engine ) for yours to do it would be you either broke it in to softly ( which isnt likely on a turbo car unless you werent hitting boost. ) or something wrong with the ring on cylinder 3 which you stated was 150 which would be around service limit for a 2g with a 14psi difference between that an the other cylinders.... On my old gst when i had a rebuild i broke it in as hard as i could with 15psi, but not revving past 5k with a lot of decelleration and that motor had 155 across the board with 1g pistons and only took 3 or 4 cranks to get that full compression.

 

[freshlane]

I thought the ring gaps were supposed to be 180deg from each other, atleast that is what I was taught. Is that correct?

 

[98GSt_4life]

i think that is correct .. but i didn't know that untill i already had everything back together and running