Caster Help

[wookieneck]

The alignment shop cant get my caster dialed in. They say the driver's side front wheel is pushed back about an inch, which you can see by looking at the car so I dont doubt it.

So the tire guys said it needed to go to a frame shop. It went to a frame shop and they checked it, they said it was the suspension. Back to the tire shop, they said no way its the frame.
Picked another frame shop and tire shop, same thing....

I wouldnt care cept that they thing pulls so hard to the left that if I look away for a second im in the ditch and on my way into someone's living room. The front tires are starting to chew, and the power steering pump is about burnt out from being in constant use.

Help.
I have seen control arms for the 2g with caster adjustment built in, would that be my best bet?

 

[wret]

Have you already flipped the compression control arm bushing?

 

[wookieneck]

Im not really sure what you mean, so thats probably a no. Upper or lower and which is considered the compression bushing?

The problem never really manifested at stock height, though admittedly it had only been aligned at the local rednect shop that considers adjusting toe to be a 4 wheel alignment.

I never took it to tire discounters until after I put the rims and springs on. I have the ingalls kit all the way around and they got camber dialed in but said the caster could not be adjusted.

I started with the eibach sportlines which where too low, tires rubbed in the rear. So I yanked them and went with the prokit, which I swear to got is maybe about an 1/8" higher than the sportlines where. Still no joy.

 

[Slapnut]

here is a link for some specs, for you

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169442

Also, I for some odd reason, can't remember if the caster is adjustable, i have aligned a few of these on a hunter alignment machine, but i am almost certain that is reads caster is not adjustable. But I could be wrong.

 

[suicidal2af]

Caster is not adjustable on our cars. Sounds like one of your suspension pieces is bent.

 

[wookieneck]

yeah, I know the specs. They are even on the pretty print-out that discounters gives me that shows lots of RED for the caster.

I would expect something to be bent, but all the components on that side have mopar tags on them still. So right before I bought it I suspect all of that was replaced after the wreck.

The one thing that really bothers me is that it didnt pull before I lowered it so I have to wonder something- If you you pulled one side of the upper arm all the way out and pushed the other side all the way in (with the camber kit) wouldnt that throw the caster out a bit?

So rather than spend anymore money for people to look at it and say its someone else's problem I am looking into those upper arms that have camber/caster built-in. Anyone have any experience with those?

 

[Slapnut]

can you place the readings on here, just wanting to see the #'s

 

[wret]

Im not really sure what you mean, so thats probably a no. Upper or lower and which is considered the compression bushing?

From the factory, the drivers side has a couple degress less caster. Here's a thread where flipping the bushing was discussed. http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176057&highlight=caster

The mounting holes for the frame connector are offset so that flipping the bushing (rotating it 180°) will increase your caster a bit. I don't know if it's enough to correct your problem, but it's a start.

 

[wookieneck]

I see grasshopper! Good stuff, thanks. Though jtmcinder mentioned in that thread that it wouldnt work on a 97, so I pinged him for details on that snafu.

Hopefully he can jump in with the skinny.

 

[jtmcinder]

As I just wrote in a PM, it works fine on a 97. It just doesn't work on 95s and some 96s, since Mitsu didn't flip the bushings until halfway through the 96 run.

What I said in that thread was that you can't flip the bushing in SCCA's Stock category, since you aren't allowed to update/backdate. That was a point on the rules of autocrossing, not whether it was possible.

- Jtoby

 

[wookieneck]

Im with you. Just didnt catch that you were talking rules and such.

So the next question is are you flipping end to end or just rolling it 180?

 

[jtmcinder]

You must flip it (not roll it) because only one side will fit against the chassis. Trust me: when you are looking at it closely, it will be obvious.

- Jtoby

 

[wret]

Jtoby, I can't remember having to worry about flipping (like rotating 180° in a photo program) or rolling it 180°. In fact, I'm pretty sure the shop that pressed mine simply rotated it. Now I am examining my old one quite closely and I can't see that it would make any difference at all. The mounting points appear entirely flat on both sides. Could there be a difference between Talon and Eclipse parts?

 

[jtmcinder]

There is no difference between Talon and Eclipse parts, but (as pointed out in a private thread) I did ingest a few things in the 70s and 80s which I probably should not have. It could well be that I am completely mistaken and the crossbar through the bushing is symmetrical.

So I fall back on the key part of what I said: when you have the compression arm in your hand, it will be obvious what you need to do.

To make up for my poor memory, let me add this to what I have posted in the past. If you really want to do this right, first get in a pit under the car (while it is sitting on the wheels) and mark the angle. Then remove both compression arms and reset the bushings so the crossbar will cause no preload on the bushing when sitting still. The idea here is to reduce the influence of the completely non-linear "spring" that is the bonded bushing by having it start at zero. If you don't do this, you start with some twist in the bushing, moving it farther towards the steep part of curve.

- Jtoby

ps. the above idea is probably not worth it