Car got stuck in 5th gear, can't yank out...

[WillRaceForBeer]

I'm new to manual dsm's, and today my 1990 GSX got stuck in 5th gear on the highway. I was coming down an exit ramp and simply couldn't shift out of the gear Pulled over, killed the car, attempted to yank it out... no luck, and I yanked hard. It's in a limbo between 5th and neutral now. I can keep the shifter pulled back and there is no engagement, but with it pushed forward (towards 5th) it grinds... I can't move to any other gears, including Reverse, like i said I tried to yank it back.

I've spoke with several knowledgeable people and done some research but saw that no-one had got stuck in 5th before. Typically if it were 1,2,3,4 broken shiftforks are a good posibility, so should I assume the same for 5th? And are there other things I should check that could be locking it in this position?

As far as I could tell the tranny is in good shape with the only issue being a bad 1st syncro (used to grind going into 1st before some adjustment of the clutch)

I've got the car back home now, so let me know what you guys think I should do next..

 

[Auto RS T]

You could start by disconnecting the shift cables from the tranny and manually try to shift the transmission into another gear.

That would eliminate the cables.

Verify that the tranny is mounted securely to the motor also.

 

[compression]

That sounds like a possibility but if i recall correctly when i broke my 3rd gear shift fork i was still able to move the shifter to any gear it was just stuck in 3rd no matter what.

 

[AuntiesTSI]

Sounds like a broken shift fork to me. My friend broke one of his and he couldn't get it to budge at all.

 

[Auto RS T]

That could also be a possibility. I wanted the OP to verify that the problem was internal.

My research has shown me that the nut on the 5th gear assembly could back off and cause this problem also.

 

[WillRaceForBeer]

Well I drained her and pulled the cover off. Here's how things look:

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What i found was some slightly metallic fluid, and some specs of metal here and there. The pin is in position and the "rail" seems to be intact, If I move the lever in the picture below...

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the shifter fork will move back and forth manually, but it just doesn't seem to move as far as it should, just like when i had it hooked up to the shifter inside the car. When i moved it out (away from 5th gear) it pushed this metal ring off picture below...

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What is this? it doesn't look like there is anything there that even holds it on?!

I also notice that the nut on the end of the (i'm guessing input shaft) is loose, i can twist it back and forth about 1/20 turn by hand, it looks like the nut is dimpled to lock it at a certain position, i'm sure with a socket i could turn it more..

Well that's where i'm at now, I guess where i'm at is figureing out why the fork / rail don't move as far as they should.

Could it be that nut Auto RS T? Should I try tightening it? Is there anything I need to move or adjust before I torque it down?

 

[Auto RS T]

The gold colored ring is the 5th gear outer synchro ring. It is held in with the three "locks" and a wavy spring... which I don't see.

Inspect the 3 keys and get a new sychro spring. Look for signs of wear on the 5th gear synchros and sychro hub and slider. Replace all parts accordingly. Torque the nut to 109 ft lbs and re-stake it.

I won't guarantee that this will fix the transmission, but if this is all that I saw wrong I would go for it. Pick up a Factory Service Manual too, it is worth its weight in gold and has a good picture of the synchro spring.

I found this thread to help you understand how to fix this. I used the search terms "5th*, gear". (You have to use the "*" on words less than three letters)

Torque specs on the 36mm nuts are 108-110 ft lbs. Good luck.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154627&highlight=5th*+gear

PS, That missing pic cracked me up.

 

[BrokenTsi]

Same thing happened to me once. I was driving on the highway and my car got stuck in 5th. I had to yank on it with the force of the Incredible Hulk to pull it out. I lost 5th gear. I was able to drive home in 1,2,3, and 4th. 5th was gone. The nut loosened up on 5th gear and pushed it right out of the case. It put a big hole in it. Never fixed it, just replaced the tranny with a spare.

 

[WillRaceForBeer]

The 3 keys and Syncro seem to be in perfect condition, nothing like the one in that guys thread. I noticed the nut on the intermediate shaft is also loose, so I will be unstaking, torqueing, and restaking both of the 36mm nuts on monday and hope for the best! Otherwise i'll have to assume it's something with the shifter levers / rail ends and that I will need to take the whole tranny apart for servicing.

This has been quite a learning experiance for me on how our spastic dsm tranny's work. You guys made it much easier.

Much thanks to you guys for all the ideas and feedback

-Jon

 

[92awddsm]

The 3 keys and Syncro seem to be in perfect condition, nothing like the one in that guys thread. I noticed the nut on the intermediate shaft is also loose, so I will be unstaking, torqueing, and restaking both of the 36mm nuts on monday and hope for the best! Otherwise i'll have to assume it's something with the shifter levers / rail ends and that I will need to take the whole tranny apart for servicing.

This has been quite a learning experiance for me on how our spastic dsm tranny's work. You guys made it much easier.

Much thanks to you guys for all the ideas and feedback

-Jon

If it still doesnt shift afterwards, remove the 3 bolts that are in a line on the front of the tranny. They look as if they screw into the shift rails. Once removed, be careful because eack bolt has a spring and a small steel ball behind it. Remove all 3 springs and balls and see if the tranny will shift. If not, it is damage in the front of the tranny where the linkage attaches to the rails. This would require A fair amount of teardown but can be done with the tranny still in the car.

You can see the 3 bolts Im talking about in this pic.

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[WillRaceForBeer]

It's not looking good... Even with the nuts tightened down, the shifter lever still will not move the rail all the way into neutral, and the intermediate shaft has A LOT of play in it... about 1/4" In-Out, and another 1/4" side to side(up and down too).

It seems like the cause of the "stuck in gear" issue is with the levers themselves. When i move the shifter lever, all three rails try to move, so whatever part selects rails, must be broken or impeeded.

I'm thinking that because of the pieces of trash, and all the metal in the oil, and the loose intermediate shaft that the tranny is probably not even worth salvaging. But I was really hoping for a quick fix so I could get the car back to va.

For now the car will be sitting in Indy for the winter, and I will be hoping to afford a new tranny sometime in the spring.

Thanks for all the help I could never have diagnosed these problems on my own.

-Jon

 

[raped]

The gold colored ring is the 5th gear outer synchro ring. It is held in with the three "locks" and a wavy spring... which I don't see.

That gold ring is the "reverse brake" not the 5th synchro.

Inspect the 3 keys and get a new sychro spring. Look for signs of wear on the 5th gear synchros and sychro hub and slider. Replace all parts accordingly. Torque the nut to 109 ft lbs and re-stake it.

I won't guarantee that this will fix the transmission, but if this is all that I saw wrong I would go for it. Pick up a Factory Service Manual too, it is worth its weight in gold and has a good picture of the synchro spring.

I found this thread to help you understand how to fix this. I used the search terms "5th*, gear". (You have to use the "*" on words less than three letters)

Torque specs on the 36mm nuts are 108-110 ft lbs. Good luck.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154627&highlight=5th*+gear

PS, That missing pic cracked me up.

I dont think your problem has anything to do with the 5th hub/slider, gear, synchro, etc. Your problem is probably something stuck or broken by the rail ends, in which case you will need to pull the trans apart.

 

[WillRaceForBeer]

I dont think your problem has anything to do with the 5th hub/slider, gear, synchro, etc. Your problem is probably something stuck or broken by the rail ends, in which case you will need to pull the trans apart.

Yah i'm pretty sure it is too. I put up a long screwdriver to different spots on the tranny to "listen" to where it's getting stopped, and it deffiantely is underneith the " shift lever" area. Because of all the other issues I discovered while in there, trash, metallic fluid, loose intermediate shaft... This tranny won't be used again without considerable work.