BFG vs Hoosier DR's on fwd?

[mnetwork]

Wow, I'm defently impressed with that kind of time on a drag radial in a fwd. Is he on this forum, I'd be interested to hear more about his setup & how he runs his hooisers? (tire pressure, amount of burn out, launch, etc)

Same here...

 

[rhamlinii]

Wow, I'm defently impressed with that kind of time on a drag radial in a fwd. Is he on this forum, I'd be interested to hear more about his setup & how he runs his hooisers? (tire pressure, amount of burn out, launch, etc)

HE'S NOT ON THIS BOARD, but he's on Honda-tech .com. He actually drives a 92 Civic Hatch-back with an Ls-vtec and a gt-4067 turbo. The car runs 10.00 at 148 on slicks, all done @ 2400 pounds. He dialed the car in and tunes it himself. With with a 85mm LS block and non v-tec an 15 psi on pump-gas, on the same turbo he went 11.0's @ 126 mph. He cuts 1.74 60's on the drag radials and 1.61's 60's on slicks.

 

[mnetwork]

I am looking into buying slicks and rims for the front VERY soon. Within the next two weeks. I just have no idea what sizes I'd have to buy...

 

[daren_p]

I am looking into buying slicks and rims for the front VERY soon. Within the next two weeks. I just have no idea what sizes I'd have to buy...

If you do a quick search through the forums here for slicks you will find what your looking for. Slicks & fwd's have been discussed numerous times. Basically on stock drivetrain & unless your making atleast 400+ whp, you'll want to stick to a 24.5" tall tire. This will be your best height & look around at the different slick manufacturers to see what kind of widths they offer, depending on what rim diameter you choose.

 

[talont3t4]

Did you ever run those tires? How are they?

 

[10_seconds_2luv]

I have the same Hoosier Drag radials on my '90 AWD Talon. I have 624 WHP and 559 torque on a Mustang Dyno. I will be hitting the dragstrip on April the 5th and will report back on these tires as they are brand new

 

[LaserAWD]

I'm looking into a set of the Hoosier drag radials for my AWD, any reports from the track yet?

 

[10_seconds_2luv]

I will be going to Milan for the first time on May the 28th

 

[daren_p]

Haven't updated this thread in awhile. So I was able to get to the track back about a month ago. Now it was extremely hot/humid that day, the car was running too rich (was breaking up on some runs) & was having issues keeping the boost constant. I took the GF & it was his first time at a track so, didn't really play with the tune, etc, just went to have abit of fun, so no records set that day .

So my first impression is that the Hoosiers are night & day difference compared to my street tires. Normally on street tires I launch at 4000 & slip the clutch, which I would say on average nets 2.45-2.55 60's on the track I usually run, that the car hooks better at (much better track prep but actually have slower 60's all the time vs another track I run, where the traction is much worse). Even with about 50% throttle, the car breaks in 1st. In second I run reduced boost, about 18-19psi (least I can run with Tial spring I run) & most of the time the car still breaks & hops most of the time. Switched to the Hoosiers, pressure set 17-18psi, did a short burn out in 1st. Launched like normal, no spin in 1st, go WOT in second & no spin. Great, so over the next 3 or 4 runs I get on the gas earlier each time in 1st & actually hit WOT without spin. Also increase boost each time in 2nd, till I hit the 25psi I was running & still zero spin in second (car felt completely different & the difference in pull was night & day). After about 6 runs I descided to warm the tires abit more, still only in 1st maybe 4-5 seconds, just enough to barely make smoke & when I launched like normal the car must have had zero spin as it almost stalled off the line. So I bumped up the launch control to 4250 & it seemed to work better.

The car still has alot left in the 60's as I was being really easy off the line, slipping the clutch as I wasn't sure how much the stock axles would take. Also after looking at my logs, the car is still bogging too much (~2000rpms) on the launch, so may need to slip the clutch abit more & think raising the launch rpm to the 4500-5000 range should work better. Best 60 of the day was a 2.31 but had a bunch in this area & they were consistantly getting lower each run. With the street tires best I have run was a 13.6 @ 110-113mph. With the DR's I ran 13.2 @114.6 but this is still on a 2.3 60's.

 

[1qkfwd]

You should be able to get those 60' times sub 2.0. It suck i wish they had that size a couple years ago when I had my fwd in prime condition. I ended up with the 225-45-17 BFG drag radials. They worked but I bet those hoosiers would be the key. Keep us updated on how well these tires do. I have a car in the works that these tires would go perfect on.

 

[Boostid94]

I was wondering how the tires were as well, when I had my sr20det sentra I used the Hoosiers and like them alot wanted to see how others got along wtih them. I like both tire brands.

 

[daren_p]

My summery so far would be the Hoosier are awsome, my driving.... not so much

Hopefully will get out again in the next coming weeks & start to work on getting that 60 down

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

How are they on the street, if you've driven with them. From the research I've done, in terms of grip, it goes QTP, Hoosier DR, MT DR, BFG, Nitto. And then reverse for streetability.

I need tires for my AWD, and with the new S374 setup, I'll need all the grip I can get on the street. But im not about to run bias plys or else I would have QTPs already

 

[daren_p]

I have never driven them on the street but from what I've experienced so far I would say their probably about the best your going to get, out of a "street tire". I have noticed they take very minimal heat to get nice & sticky. Direct from Hoosier, the DR's use the same compound as the QTP's. Obviously not a tire for any rain or standing water as they will be usless but I'm sure this isn't an issue in your case. I'm not sure how true this is but I heard they use some sort of nylon belts, instead of your typical steel belts. What I do know is the sidewalls are nice & soft, thinner then your typical street radial & they are pretty light. I was running a tire pressure of 17-18psi & did notice some "float" in the tires, especially in 2nd but I'm sure its alot less then a Bias Ply would have.

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

I guess I should have been a bit more specific. I know they will grip, rather I'd like to hear anyone's experience with say commuting or taking it on the highway for a bit. My buddy has an evo and in a straight line, the QTP are fine, but even freeway entrances and exits are worrisome as the sidewalls roll over.

You are correct, the Hoosier DR do use nylon cords instead of steel. I'm really curious as these are the only real competition for the MT DR, which as heavy like all street tires. But if you say the Hoosier DR are the same compound as the QTP, then they won't last for shizzle. The MT have decent life considering it is a great DR, so I may just have to stick with those.

If I didn't have a 200 mile drive to get the car to school and 80-90 miles to the track, and owned a tow rig, QTPs wouldn't be a problem, but college kid with no tow rig leaves me with DR....

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

I guess I'll also give a quick background of my setup to justify the need for this...haha. Or else I sound like a noob.

S374 turbo
Dogbox & QM Twin Plate
16x7.5 Kosei KI
GC/Koni
RRE Camber Plates
Brakeman Brakes
CNC Staging Brake

Looking for: TRACTION

 

[daren_p]

For that kind of info, I probably can't be much help. Cops are a big enough hassle already around here & with all the "street racing" laws they have here now, going out on the street with a set of slick looking tires on a different rim then the rears is just asking for trouble

Your defently right about the tread life, they are a really soft compound so using them as a street tire wouldn't last long. Hoosier said they were rated as a 40 or 50 for tread life but I think that may be "over rated" when you compare it to some other drag radials. Like I had mentioned, I did notice some "float" but that was running 17-18 psi. So probably running more tire pressure like you would with a normal street tire would help out here. The one other thing to consider is I wonder how they would hold up to the continuous heat of DD'ing or driving on the highway, etc? Sure they can take a good heat up & a 1/4 blast but can they hold up to doing this half an hour or hours at a time? Even though they are a DOT radial, they do specifically said "Not for Highway Use" on the tire (though I'm sure the QTP's say the same & people still do).

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

Yeah, it seems as if the general consensus is to stick with the MT if I want to street drive. I'm at the edge of taking the car off the streets and going more wild with the setup. But I don't like the thought of not driving my car whenever I like. MT it is!

Thanks for the info

 

[daren_p]

Update time Went back to the track for a second time with the Hoosier & have to say I'm defently impressed with them & would recommend 100%. I only took 4 passes (clutch didn't like the third run) but there is no comparison in how these hook compared to my street tires. I wanted to run the most pressure I could (better trap speed) & still hook properly, so I started at 20 psi & was going to work my way down. First run was just a warm up & bogged the car like normal, nothing great there. Next run said to myself, I'm keeping my foot in it off the line. Launched at 4500 with more throttle then my usual ~25% & pulled a 2.17 60 (previous best was 2.32). Next run bumped it up to 4750, & hit a 2.069 (running around 19psi in the tires) but the tires did break slightly near the top of first but I had a very minimal burn out (ie probably no smoke), so this was probably partly to blame. Next run dropped the pressure to 18.5 & did a better burn out. You could see small clouds but nothing like the big slicked muscle cars do, the car didn't slip at all & netted a 2.030 60. I'm sure with a higher lauch, more practice these tires defently have more in them but I was happy with the results today (also knocked .7 off my ET)

 

[doggo]

ANy of you guys ever consider the M&H street/strip tires here?


http://www.mandhtires.com/store.php?crn=73&action=show&show_products_mode=cat_click

I'm planning on getting 15" Rota slips 15 x 7, and using the M&H 235/60/15 tires. Supposedly have more hold and sticker even then the Hoosiers. Just thought it was odd no one else in this thread has mentioned them as a possible FWD tire for our crowd. If there is a reason, what is it?

 

[Pj97GST]

A few questions regarding the Hoosiers;

How much sidewall flex do these tires seem to have? (i.e. are they designed to wrinkle at all similar to the QTP's?) What I'm getting at is, will lowering the pressure a bit more cause the center of the tire to lose contact, or will it allow the sidewall to flex some more and put more of a contact patch on the ground? I can't seem to find anything tech related on the Hoosier website in regards to optimal use for FWD app's, and I'm pretty curious as to how similar or dissimilar these tires are in regards to the slicks. (heat vs. traction, tire psi. increase/decrease vs. traction, etc.) The types of things that I'd like to see there would be the optimal tire pressures, or recommended burn time.

Whereas slicks might like to be spun longer, is the compound more progressive where you don't really need to heat them up as much?

I've been seriously looking into these tires for a while now, but have yet to come across anyone that was using them. I'm in a similar situation as you; I don't really have the option to go anything smaller than a 16" wheel, and like keeping a stock(ish) size tire. (225/60-16). In the past I've run slicks, and have gotten great results with them, although I'm mainly looking at something that I can keep on the car all the time. I don't drive it too much, but when I do, I like having the option of having a decent DR on it should I need to do work.

I've used the Nitto DR in the past when they still made a 225/50-16, and while it was a phenomenal tire for messing around on asphalt, I found it an incredibly hard tire to work with on the track. It was way too inconsistent, and really hard to find the sweet spot at which to launch with. Not to mention the severe tire shake that you would get if you tried to launch the car when the tires were out of that aforementioned "sweet spot".

I found that the Nitto's liked to be extremely hot in order to cut a decent enough short time; however that was at the expense of even worse tire wear from burning the shit out of them every time you get in the box.

Anyways, congrats on getting your short times down. I'm sure that with more use and practice, you should be cutting sub 2.0's in no time. I can typically cut 2.1's pretty consistently on street tires and have seen 1.8's on the old set of MT slicks that I had. I'd be pretty damn happy to see anything shy of 1.9 with the Hoosiers.

Continued good luck with these and hope to see some quicker 60's in the future. Thanks for the great write-up.

 

[CanadianTSi]

Congrats on the new best Daren

 

[daren_p]

ANy of you guys ever consider the M&H street/strip tires here?


http://www.mandhtires.com/store.php?crn=73&action=show&show_products_mode=cat_click

I'm planning on getting 15" Rota slips 15 x 7, and using the M&H 235/60/15 tires. Supposedly have more hold and sticker even then the Hoosiers. Just thought it was odd no one else in this thread has mentioned them as a possible FWD tire for our crowd. If there is a reason, what is it?

My issues was with my big brakes, I couldn't run any smaller then a 16" rim, so those tires wouldn't be an option. I've heard M&H make a really nice slick for fwd's but I find it hard to believe that those linked tires will hold better the the Hoosiers....

 

[daren_p]

From what I've been told, the Hoosier are nylon belted instead of your typical steel (think mentioned above), not sure if its true but the side walls are damn soft for a DR. Will they wrinkle like a slick? Not sure, the lowest I've had them down to was about 16psi, & the tire did have a descent "sag" to it. The tires didn't break lose with them sitting at 18psi today, so I had no need to go any lower. The guy from Hoosier recommend 16-20psi. As the whole idea of a DR is less rolling resistance (& DR's will actually MPH & ET quicker IF you can hook properly with them). The compound on these is super sticky, the guy from Hooser said only a small burn out is required since they are so soft, just basically enough to clean them off will do. My burn outs were very minimal, think my biggest one was maybe 5-6 seconds around 6000-7000 rpms in 1st only. I have a CFDF clutch which isn't the most aggressive either & I live a far distance from the track, so I'm still not to hard on the launch. I think the most boost I built off the line was only a couple psi, so I'm sure with more agressive driving, these should clip off 1.9's without any issues.

Thanks Tyler, its great to finally dip well into the 12's (its been to long coming), it was nice to actually get excited when the guy handed me the slip instead of saying "f**king fwds" Then later you start thinking, if the car was an awd that could have been a 11.9-12.1 run, on street tires Oh well, maybe a 1.9 60 & abit more boost (was running 25-26psi) will get me there.

 

[daren_p]

Also wanted to add, the tires fell soft when their cool but not super stickey. Put a little heat to them & they get rediciously stickey. When I swapped the tires at the end of the day, they had everything I ran over stuck to them from small to big rocks, string, tie wrapes, etc. You name it, it was stuck to the tire Some of it was imbeded pretty good, when I tried to wipe them clean.

Another thing is the one time they did break lose when I barely did a burn out, when they did break lose they were much much less sevear vs the crazy wheel hop I would get with street tires. It was more of a slight spin vs a full out hop.