A short history on the Talon

[Phil1320]

1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD--bought the beginning of October 1996.

October 26, 1996 was the first time at the strip with the car..........BONE STOCK ran best [email protected] with 2.0 60' foot times. I hadn't learned to launch yet obviously.

October 4th, 1997 I made my first pass in the 12's less than a year later with a [email protected]. This was at E-town during the Import Survival Series Event. Total money spent on the car to that point was $710.00 in mods. ATR cat-back, K&N, MBC, and Magnecor wires. Of course, MAF mods etc., that were free. Everyone in the Extreme Motorsports camp was shocked, and so was I. I was getting the hang of the driving finally, and the car RAN STRONG. 18 psi boost and 1.75 60' time. I ran 12.76 and a couple 12.8's the next weekend back at our "local" strip, Lebanon Valley, NY. This is really when my goal to be the quickest stock turbo out there became reality.

July 10th, 1998--DSM Shootout- ran best of [email protected]

Sept. 5, 2000 New best [email protected]

April 28, 2001 New best [email protected]

Sept. 26, 2001 New best [email protected]

Oct. 19, 2001 New best [email protected]

June 21, 2002 New best [email protected]

Sept. 4, 2002 New best [email protected]
This is the night I finally beat Leon R's time of 12.053 with a 12.052 and then the 12.022. 60' times were both 1.73 on these two passes. This is where my ultimate goal was met. Funny, considering when I bought the car, all I wanted was to run a 13 second pass. Now I was nibbling at the 11's. The 13's came pretty easy, so naturally, I wanted a challenge, and, I got it from alot of guys that went quicker than I did, initially.

October 18, 2002. I'm working at Extreme Motorports now. Ran the Talon once down there and made a [email protected] pass as my best......new best 60' at 1.65 and trap at 113. But, no 11 second pass. The job didn't work out and I was home in May of '03.

May 30, 2003 [email protected] Just can't hit 11's!

I'm gonna say sometime in the summer , I think June as I remember holding the record for 8 months or so, I tried again....the timeslip date and time is wrong and I never wrote down the damn date....and hit [email protected] which was a new personal best for me, but, no elevens. If I'm correct, the next day, Leon R. beat my 12.00/12.02 and went into the 11's.

Now, there's a break until 2007:

October 19, 2007 [email protected] Still no elevens.
I had made some changes to the car including, lightweight flywheel, driveshaft, and JIC coilovers. Trap speed jumped to 115. Previous best was 113.32.
Suspension was so stiff, and car was lighter so I was just spinning all four, even through second gear. 60' time on this run was 1.84.

October 21, 2007 [email protected] Still no elevens.
This was two days later at a better prepped track that was closer to sea level--almost an identical run. 60' time was 1.86. In fact, my best 60' for both days was a 1.79. Previously, my worst would be 1.73-1.74

I was just plain stuck at 12.0 and it became a local joke...eventually it wasn't funny anymore and I really needed to go get what I should have had years before, that elusive 11 second timeslip.

Another break until 2009. I know I need traction now. Bullett and I talk about the possibilities. We decide it's slicks...the car needs to hook.

FAST FORWARD:

May 10, 2009 [email protected] FIRST TIME SLICKS

Best 60' that day was 1.57


July 10, 2009 [email protected]

Best 60' that day was 1.54

Trap speed is still current best MPH


October 23, 2009 [email protected]

Best 60' that day was 1.48

Added chip from Dave W. with stutterbox...IT WORKS!


So, new personal bests set at all three outings in 2009 and finally, 11 SECONDS!!! That is a quick chronology of my history in drag racing with the Talon.


That is just to give base to whomever wants to follow from here on out.

Sitting at a personal best of 11.49, there is only one person in front of me for all time 14B ET, the almighty Joe B. and his superfast Laser FWD.

Also, at 11.49, I had no choice but to name this blog with reference to 10 seconds. That is the TARGET now, whether or not it can be met remains to be seen. And, No, I'm not forgetting that first I have to run low 11's before I can get to the 10's....but this blog now has long-term implications rather than something that can't be added to over time.

Efforts to get there are are what this blog is about. Any updates I will do here, with accomplishments at the drag strip or dyno also being posted in the forums if I feel it is noteworthy enough.

Thanks everyone for the interest, ideas, recommendations, and props given in the past, and here's to new ones!

Phil Beers

 

[habitatguy187]

So what're some plans for next season?

 

[Phil1320]

Well, I've got some things in the garage to do to the car:

-rear 1/4 lexan
-Polk front lower control arms
-FP cams/Fidanza Gears

but, in order to run next season, the big thing is a rollbar, seat, and harness.

 

[Phil1320]

Here is a comparo of my best stock run to my current best run:

Stock NOW Difference
60' 2.082 1.481 .601
330' 6.129 4.660 1.469
1/8 9.495 7.279 2.216
1000' 12.384 9.562 2.822
1/4 14.856 11.497 3.359


Pretty amazing that the car is a full 3.35 seconds quicker in the 1/4 mile than it was stock. The best part about it is that the engine is still bone stock and the original turbocharger is still in place and has never been removed, just a ported turbine housing was swapped in. Even 2.21 difference to the 1/8 is a huge reduction in ET, as well as .60 just to the 60' mark. When looking at it in this perspective, it really shows how far the car and I have come.

Just thought that was a neat comparison to share. It's nice to have a few baseline runs before I started to mod the car. Other stock runs were, 14.89(first run ever) and a 14.99.

 

[SBstar]

I hope you don't mind me adding this Phil, but this post always amazed me.

POSTED 12-10-2002

The car: 1990 Talon TSi AWD, currently at just over 78,000 miles

Best ET: [email protected]
Best MPH: [email protected]
Best 1/8 ET & MPH: [email protected]
Best 60': 1.65

Race weight: car+me+1/4 tank or so gas= 2850 lbs.

Mods: K&N, XBC, Magnecor wires, BPR7ES plugs, ported '95 mani, ported turbine housing, portedO2 dump, 2.5' DP, test, 3" ATR, DSM performance underdrive crank pulley, Extreme fuel pump. Eibach pro, KYB AGX, Power Slot rotors, stainless lines, Axxix pads, full Energy Bushing kit, Prothane motor mount kit, ACT 2600-full face disc, front and rear strut braces, lower honeycomb removed as well as divider wall in that same lower chamber, TB coolant bypass, EGR block.

Other things: carbon fiber hood, OMP pins, Racing Hart CP035 16X7--9.6 lbs. each, Z-Speed lightweight lugs, Nitto Drag radials.

How many people have gone WAY slower with more mods, and years of development on those mods. Simply amazing. Keep up the good work.

 

[Phil1320]

Wow, I don't mind at all, where'e you dig that up? And, there it is, I mention the MAF mod there and that's in '02!

Thanks Shane! The car was very impressive at that point, I totally still ripped it on the street and that was still with the 2.5" downpipe, that's right!

Stock injectors, ECU, and no fuel control! The car was in the 10's rich on the dyno too! Cool stuff, I like that you posted that up here as it is part of my story.

 

[Phil1320]

UPDATE: Started removal of miscellaneous sheet metal on the interior REAR of the car. Prepping for the rollbar install whenever I can facilitate it.

Removed rear wing side pieces and trim to prep for removal of rear 1/4 windows. Rear 1/4 lexan is in house and will be installed for next visit to the strip.

That's it so far, and the colder it gets, the less that will get done until next year when it warms up. But, I'll work til it's pretty damn cold......

 

[Phil1320]

Well, I've got all the pricing quoted on things that will be next on the car. Rollbar, intercooler, lexan, etc. At least I know what it will take now cash wise to get to the next level. It will be a while before I can spend anything at all. But, my game plan is now complete. Now, the first goal for the car has nothing to do with being at the actual drag strip. The plan is called Prep for next dragstrip visit.

 

[Phil1320]

Well, not to much to report, but, I've been working on the Talon on the warmer days. Rear excess sheetmetal is almost all done. Rear bumper is removed for some modification. Rear 1/4 windows are ready to be removed.

Saving for rollbar, almost there. Looks like I'll be running a Kirkey aluminum drag seat. I would have opted for a Sparco or Sabelt, but, the price difference is enormous, I'll worry about a roadrace seat when the time actually comes.

Probably run a G-Force harness.

Baby steps. But, if I can run 3 times in 2010 as I did in 2009, I'm sure my personal best 11.49 can be beaten.

GOAL for 2010 is .20 or better.......11.20's.

Should have more to report soon as winter leaves...

 

[BleedingSilver]

Have you ever have the car weighed at its current point or dynoed at its current point? its funny how your going 11.49 at your current point on the stock turbo and Im looking to run an 11.49 on a holset 35 which towers over the 14b. God its amazing what our stock turbos and weight reduction and good driving can do. I love the 14b with all my heart but in my fwd its just way to traction retarded to be a drag car.

 

[400hp93talon]

You've gone a long way....Your a true dsm fanatic if there ever was one I'd say!!

 

[Phil1320]

Guys-

I do not have an exact weight currently, or let me say the scale was not open in July when I went 11.59@116 or in October when I went 11.49@113. It was open in May when I hit a test and tune and ran my first 11 second passes with a best of 11.75. The car weighed in at 2400 on the nose and with my out of shape ass total weight was 2605 lbs. There was a small amount of weight reduction after that 1st trip to the strip to the tune of about 25-30 lbs. So, while not having the exact number, I estimated the car at 2370 lbs. and total race weight at 2575 lbs. Now, I have to add the rollbar in which will obviously add weight. But, I do have some other things to swap out and/or remove which I'm sure you read above.

Thanks for the compliment!, I'd like to think of myself as die hard DSMr. Even though my contribution to the community is small, I think it's still relevant.

I hope to accomplish more this year, we'll see how it goes.

 

[Phil1320]

Sorry-forgot to address this.

The last dyno was in 2007. The car made 295 AWHP and 337 ft.-lb. at 21 psi corrected. Uncorrected it made 304 AWHP and 348 ft.-lb.

The only change since this dyno besides me making minor adjustments on the AFC based on the wideband reading were some timing adjustments at 6500 and 7000 rpm via EPROM chip. Since those two areas are well above the rpm where I make peak power, I doubt there is a gain in peak power. But, for sure there might be a few more ponies at the ground between 6500 and 7000 than there was. I'm only seeing that area on the launch and a bit in 4th gear. I shift out of second and 3rd generally by 6600 rpm.

Once the new FMIC core is on, I will re-dyno at that time. Most likely I will upgrade the intercooler, dyno, then add the cams and remove balance shafts and re-dyno. I'm hoping to see at least 10 more peak HP at the ground, but mostly wanting to see more power over my current curve.

 

[Phil1320]

Project is on hold until further notice. Some work on the car will take place randomly in 2010, however no 1/4 mile passes will be made.

Thanks to those for the support over the past year and before.

Phil Beers

 

[muddfisher85]

Too bad was looking for you to break into the 10's this year.

 

[Phil1320]

Thanks for the words! That would have been great. Even if I was able to get out this year, I don't think 10's was in the cards. Next time out, whenever that may be, I'd be happy with 11.40 on the nose.......

 

[viprez586]

Plasma cut out the rear spare tire hump/trunk area. Reinforced it with some boxed tubing.
Of course you'll have to run a cell or figure out a good way to mount the tank.
I bet doing this alone is an easy 200lbs lighter.

Only downside is now the ass is super light!

 

[Phil1320]

For sure weight is the name of the game for me. I don't have the time or money to invest in too elaborate a set up at this time.

There are no updates for the most part. Still need to get rear 1/4 window lexan and door window lexan in. Still need to have rollbar installed. Still need new seat and 5 point harness. Still need to get better & larger FMIC. Still have to install Polk lower control arms. So, there's quite a bit of work to be done. We'll see if I can get anything done this fall. If not, it all waits till next year. We are into September and noone has gone quicker than my 11.49 pass from 2009 which also means noone is any closer to matching or beating the 10.84 14b all time record pass by Joe Bucci. The year isn't over and I think there are a couple contenders, but, as of now, no solid results for these guys. Lotsa guys running in the 12's and improving their times though.

 

[SBstar]

I think you'll gain a good bit of power by adding those cams, fmic, and there's probably more in the tune since you've never had the opportunity to do more then what the afc provided, the chip I'm sure helps, but without tuning and changes you're stuck with what's on there. Obviously what's left with weight removal will be on par with what you're adding with the cage so not a whole lot left there. I can't wait to see you back out again!

 

[Phil1320]

I'm sure you're right Shane, I haven't oprtimized anything but my driving.....and I'd like to think I can find something there too.....true, any more weight reduction will be negated by the cage, unless I get lighter wheels and $4000 worth of brake man brakes so that the weight is unsprung rather than dead weight, but that ain't happening......cams, I/C, and link would be a good gain, and balance shaft removal, gonna try all that for next year I hope.....thanks for the support, I'm anxious to get back out there too.....

So, my update is that I've started some work on the car before it gets too cold, just basic stuff, like the pic in the 14b thread shows.....prepping for rollbar and lexan rear 1/4 windows and door windows. Nate C's idea of air/water intrigues me, but, with roadracing in the car's future, that's a tough one. At that point I may as well do a 1 gallon fuel cell too......you never know

 

[Phil1320]

Whelp, it turns out I made it to the drag strip in 2010. I honestly had no plans to, and it was a spur of the moment rush once local DSM shop, Forced Induction Motorsports, gave me a generous offer---They'd get me to the strip and back, if I could get the car ready to race in a few days. Without getting into all that was apart, let's just say about 6 hours of work, and it was ready to go. I had not even started the car since last October 23rd when I pulled it off the trailer and into the garage. Started it up last Tuesday, raced it on Friday. No change in the tune since 2007.

So, first pass, missed third.....threw it on the second attempt and went [email protected] 1.50 60'.

Pass #[email protected] 1.48 60'
Pass #[email protected] 1.48 60'
Pass #[email protected] 1.48 60'

Pass #[email protected] 1.49 60' --- on this pass, at about 1100-1200 ft. The car spat the turbine wheel and shaft out the exhaust onto the track. It has been confirmed by several parties that the nut that secures the compressor wheel to the shaft literally loosed up, fell off, and the turbine side was free to go. Obviously, a good bit of oil exited via the exhaust creating quite the smoke show.

After comparing time slips the pass that the turbo gave up on was a potential 11.57 pass. This would have been my second quickest ever behind my 11.49. I have two 11.59 passes from last year that tie for my second quickest. It would have been nice to have one in the middle.

I knew that it would be tough to beat my 11.49 from last October. That was the perfect combination of everything. But, I came close.

So, now I have some parts that are damaged, and I have a 14b that I need to acquire in order to stay on the trek. Too bad a simple think like a nut working it's way loose cut that turbos life short--it most definitely had more in it and the car pulled like a MF----as always.

As when anyone has some hard knocks with cars, I will hope to come out lighter, stronger, and faster in 2011.

That's it for now

 

[Phil1320]

Engine is ready to come out. I just have to source a hoist and stand.

Gonna do the balance shaft eliminator kit and camshafts(FP1X.) I also need to get some upgrade valve springs. I have the Fidanza cam gears to help dial the cams in.

It's possible that I will pull the head and have it cleaned and freshened with some mild work on the exhaust side. It looks pretty nasty at the exhaust ports and the bottoms of the exhaust valves are pretty nasty too. I suppose 20 years of driving with some frequent leaded gas use will do that. We assume some flow is being lost there.

I will take this time to swap the lighter Polk tubular A-arms in, I've had them long enough without using them. Gonna do some other lightening with the Lexan 1/4 windows, and hopefully do lexan door windows as well.

Hoping to come out next year with the car weighing in at 2200 and total race weight at 2400 or tick under that.


So, that's where I'm at.

 

[Phil1320]

Hi all--With the help of two great friends, Mark(bullett) and Bob......the engine came out of the Talon yesterday. So, almost 20.5 years after it was installed, it come sout for the first time. Verified that the VIN stamped in the block matches the chassis.....check. So, it is the original engine. Overall it looks pretty good from the outside. Slight seepage from the starter side of the rear main, and the backside of the oil pan. But that's it.

So, now to decide what path to take as far as what I want to do. Definitely will take care of the balance shaft removal. At more than 20 years old, I think it would be in my best interest to pull the head, and fully inspect. At that time, have the head cleaned up, and install valve springs, cams, and gears. Maybe just a mild polish on the exhaust ports. Once the head and the oil pan are removed, based on whatever I find on the bottom end will dictate wether I do anything there or not. I'd love to toss some 2G pistons in if anything, and have the rods checked, shot-peened and balanced, ultimately, balancing the entire rotating assembly would be nice as well.

Many of these things are up in the air as of now, but, at least the engine is out and can be worked on after the holidays.

So, at a minimum, with the impending upgrades, I would expect to go back to the dragstrip next year with the thought that I won't be fighting for hundredths of a second and hopefully a few tenths better than my personal best of 11.49 are in the cards.

My early speculation for next years goal will be 11.2X, still on the 14b turbo, the only difference is that I will now enjoy some of the mods that the other fast 14b guys have been able to.

That's it for now.....

 

[Phil1320]

Well, just a little update. Have not taken head off of or pulled oil pan from block yet. I decided to work on the car itself first. So, the engine bay is clear except for brake lines and fuel feed/return lines. All else has been removed. Steering column, clutch master, brake master/booster, wiring harness...etc.

Dash has been removed and interior wiring harness has been removed.

The plan is to remove the rest of the unneccesary wirign from all three parts of main wiring harness. A tedious job, but, after removing portions last year for the headlghts, horns, pop-up motors etc. I can say that wiring saves some weight. Some misc. brackets and hardware have also been removed along with the cruise control module, and doot buzzer. Small stuff, but, the total savings is over 3 lbs. already.....

That's it for now!