3 inch intercooler piping?

[oldman]

Your $ would have been better spent on a 1g tb(close to 2.5"), a 2.5 tb elbow, and 2.5" ic piping. The 3" is going to create a severe pressure drop and you will be overworking your turbo to make the same power as someone else with 2.25-2.5" ic piping.

My TB has been bored out to 63mm = 2.4083149606299".

Wouldn't it make sense to try to match what the compressor inlet and outlet are? And then, like oldman said, unless everything is that diameter, how could it help?

Just like exhaust flow, it's ok to go from small to large but not large to small so there are no dead spots. IMO flowing large volume will not help you if you're losing velocity, it will probably hurt. Same reason why it isn't a good idea to just bolt on a 1g intake manifold on a 2g head though we all agree that the 1g IM flows more than 2g IM.

 

[Stapl3]

It's like having a 3" DP is great but it does you no good if you still have the stock cat back.

Using this thinking makes sheet metal intake manifolds seem unless without a hogged out head.

 

[oldman]

Using this thinking makes sheet metal intake manifolds seem unless without a hogged out head.

To an extent yes, reason why you wouldn't recommend smim to someone with stock exhaust. With that said, it will not hurt as long as the IM flange matches the intake ports (no dead spots) on the head but to realize the full potential of the smim, the head will have to be properly ported eventually(not hogged out).

 

[97gstnick]

I'll agree that 3" piping probably won't help but it won't hurt either. Larger piping will not make the turbo work harder. Larger piping is less of a restriction and less restriction means more flow. That's the purpose of the BOV to keep the flow going and not build backpressure on the turbo. (this can cause surge) Turbo spool is more a function of exhaust side design rather than flow on the compessor side and temp increase is directly related to pressure rise. You could say that it has to fill more area and that will decrease spool time but atmospheric pressure can fill this void fast enough let alone something with a turbo.

you make a lot of sense dude. that was more inline with what i was thinkin. maybe 3 inch would make it easier for the turbo to flow the air. sure the throttlebody is small and adds alot of restriction. but think about it, thats a lot of air that gets pushed towards the throttle body. so that in fact could possible be good, all that air would push hard t get through. but i dont know for sure, thats why im gonna do it. ill let you guys know.

 

[-silencer-]

And then "BAM!", the 2g 52mm TB (2.0472 in). Let us know what happen.

Maybe he's got a Magnus SMIM with 75mm (2.93") Mustang TB?

 

[gamingguru]

He doesn't.

 

[RipperXX]

Haven't read the whole thread.


But theres a tuneing shop near me in GA that has a 95 I think Eclipse GSX wuth 3" intercooler pipes, its the owners daily driver


From what he told me and I saw, they swapped in a 2.4L and had a turbo on that thing that looked like it belonged on a desile (huge!!!) besides one of the cleanest engine bay's I have seen in person I quickly noticed the huge pipeing. And was like "Whoa what tha...Yea thats 3" thats insane"


Now since it was a pretty extream setup imo anyway, Im not sure if my experiance helps here, but he took me for a ride to get some oil at a parts store down the road and holy shit. Had nearly no lag at all. I was also told on the high boost setting with C16 that the car put out just over 600whp which was easily beleave able after feeling it at 14psi.

Oh yea and the engine had a 1G 63 head with stock (as far as I could tell) 1G IM and TB

Personaly I have 2.5" Dejon on my 1G but I dont plan on ever getting anything bigger than a 20g.

 

[mkspriggs]

i may be wrong im not sure but wouldnt this be the same aspect as the way all heads are built?we have small exhaust valves because the air can get out easier then it can get it,so if we take and make the intake valves bigger then we get improved performance.so the way i am looking at it the more air we are getting in the better because we know it isnt going to have that hard of a time getting out,as long as there is equivalent exaust piping and as the wiseman said with the ports being upgraded eventually.i look as it being alot better in the long run.

and even on a 14b i dont see that big of a problem as long as you take the steps mentioned,tb,exhaust,ports,etc to support it.

 

[loweperf]

i may be wrong im not sure but wouldnt this be the same aspect as the way all heads are built?we have small exhaust valves because the air can get out easier then it can get it,so if we take and make the intake valves bigger then we get improved performance.so the way i am looking at it the more air we are getting in the better because we know it isnt going to have that hard of a time getting out,as long as there is equivalent exaust piping and as the wiseman said with the ports being upgraded eventually.i look as it being alot better in the long run.

and even on a 14b i dont see that big of a problem as long as you take the steps mentioned,tb,exhaust,ports,etc to support it.

Yes,you can also think of it this way. My car(mods in profile)has a T-66 3" piping,Magnus intake,ported head. Let's say I make 20 psi @ 6000 rpm now take a basically stock engine on a 14b make 20psi @ 6000 rpm both have the same boost level at the same rpm but mine will definitely make more power because there is more air flowing into the engine.

 

[GPTourer]

i may be wrong im not sure but wouldnt this be the same aspect as the way all heads are built?we have small exhaust valves because the air can get out easier then it can get it,so if we take and make the intake valves bigger then we get improved performance.

Yeah, but doesn't the combustion process have something to do with that? Exhaust gas is hot, has the remants of burnt fuel and is forced out by an explosion, so its dynamics are a lot different from the much cooler intake are being forced in by the turbo and the intake stroke.

 

[oldman]

Yeah, but doesn't the combustion process have something to do with that? Exhaust gas is hot, has the remants of burnt fuel and is forced out by an explosion,

Actually it's forced out by the exhaust stroke, not by an "explosion" which occurs at the ignition stroke. You do not want an explosion anyway, you want an ignition then a flame front following the piston through out the ignition stroke for an even burn.

 

[92tealTSI]

3'' piping is overkill for your 50 trim, spend your money elsewhere Im sure thats what you wanted to hear

 

[mkspriggs]

but we are still basically talking about the same process but at a different location of the engine,we are still trying to get as much air as we can in and get it out just as quick.honestly i think this helps in the long run and that is why i looked at it as of the head,we want to force more air in because it is harder to get it in then out.exspecially with us all having 2.5 to 3 in exaust i think it would be benificial to have this piping.i personally know i guy with a saleen[of course not really a car to compare us to,] that he put a huge turbo on and 4 in piping to match his exhaust and he saw a huge performance gin when he did.and that was just increasing the piping from 2.5 to 3,so exspecially you guys running 50 trim and bigger i see alot of improvent,maybe not to much us 14 b and 16g but i dont see it hurting us either.but i would still like to hear how your testing comes out,exspecially if you already have the bends like you said whats it gonna hurt?good luck and let us know what you find,good and bad

 

[jdmspilner]

Yes, 3 inch is on the verge of over kill. On my car the IC Im gonna run is a Apexi Supra core with 3 inch in/outs on it but Im only running a little 20g so im gonna have to step it down after the IC. Its not the best thing to do but its what I have to. I might try and run 2.75 to the TB insted of 2.5 but Im not sure.

 

[GPTourer]

Actually it's forced out by the exhaust stroke, not by an "explosion" which occurs at the ignition stroke. You do not want an explosion anyway, you want an ignition then a flame front following the piston through out the ignition stroke for an even burn.

Right, exhaust stroke. And I do know that explosion is a poor way to describe the controlled burn that goes on inside of an engine. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that the exhaust air coming out is much different dynamically then the cool air going in. Maybe that's part of the reason why DP's and exhausts are typically bigger then intakes.

 

[talon_boy69]

You'll have more lag...on spoolup and between shifts. Also you CAN have compressor surge because of the bov not being able to flow that volume. I'd say stick with 2.5". Your turbo outlet is 2" ...intercooler outlet is probably 2.5"... TB is 2.5" so there's no need for 3". I'd go 3" if I had a gt35R, with S compressor housing(2.5" outlet, 4" inlet) lower IC pipe 2.5" , and make the intercooler outlet 3", 3" UIP and 3" TB...

 

[Lunch_Box]

I was going with a 3" upper and 2.5" lower on my car which will be spooling a GT40R turbo. My FMIC has a 3" in and out and a very wiseman told me to go with 3" upper and lower.

 

[oldman]

I was going with a 3" upper and 2.5" lower on my car which will be spooling a GT40R turbo. My FMIC has a 3" in and out and a very wiseman told me to go with 3" upper and lower.

Just making sure you're not running the stock TB and IM?

 

[Lunch_Box]

Just making sure you're not running the stock TB and IM?

Yeah I am running a Power Plus 3" throttle body and a custom SMIM so there will be no sudden drop in pipe size to produce turbulence.

 

[hose101772]

There needs to be a step to reduce swirl in the intercooler piping,preferably near the compressor outlet.Straight pipe maintains swirl and thus makes the the air charge travel farther.

 

[GPTourer]

There needs to be a step to reduce swirl in the intercooler piping,preferably near the compressor outlet.Straight pipe maintains swirl and thus makes the the air charge travel farther.

This is ambiguous to me. You say there needs to be a step, but then a straight pipe makes for a "further" charge. By step you mean a change in diameter right? Straight to me means no change. What are you suggesting is better? Reducing "swirl" or maintaining it?

 

[hose101772]

further

Futher would indicate time,farther would be distance,as in distance the air charge travels.


Yes,by step I mean an increase in diameter of the piping from the compressor.Swirl makes for a longer path for the air charge through the system,there for,any measures to reduce swirl would/should be beneficial.

 

[loweperf]

Futher would indicate time,farther would be distance,as in distance the air charge travels.


Yes,by step I mean an increase in diameter of the piping from the compressor.Swirl makes for a longer path for the air charge through the system,there for,any measures to reduce swirl would/should be beneficial.

This discussion really boils down to wether or not your out flowing your 2.5 inch or whatever pipe size your running. As far as swirl goes,if I can build 30psi in the manifold it don't matter how long it took to get there. It got there before the engine could use it otherwise you would never build boost.

 

[97gstnick]

but we are still basically talking about the same process but at a different location of the engine,we are still trying to get as much air as we can in and get it out just as quick.honestly i think this helps in the long run and that is why i looked at it as of the head,we want to force more air in because it is harder to get it in then out.exspecially with us all having 2.5 to 3 in exaust i think it would be benificial to have this piping.i personally know i guy with a saleen[of course not really a car to compare us to,] that he put a huge turbo on and 4 in piping to match his exhaust and he saw a huge performance gin when he did.and that was just increasing the piping from 2.5 to 3,so exspecially you guys running 50 trim and bigger i see alot of improvent,maybe not to much us 14 b and 16g but i dont see it hurting us either.but i would still like to hear how your testing comes out,exspecially if you already have the bends like you said whats it gonna hurt?good luck and let us know what you find,good and bad

thank you for your encouragement. i am going to go with 3 inch piping for sure. i have alot of it and i am curious. many people here have brought up good points, but i am still not totally on either side. therefore, im gonna do what i feel like i need to do. im gonna find out if it works or not. i will give you guys a detailed report of what goes on, and maybe some wisemen can break it down. thanks for the input guys, it is much appreciated. and i definitely like seeing how professional we (dsmers) act on here.

 

[hose101772]

This discussion really boils down to wether or not your out flowing your 2.5 inch or whatever pipe size your running.

Not really,what are calling "outflowing"?Over 300fps?

The discussion seems to be if 3" intercooler piping would be worth the trouble of making it.

Just like exhaust where 2.5" maybe fine but a step up to 3" usually shows some gains.Not saying it will help everyone but I doubt anyone would notice a loss by going to 3" piping.