103 octane

[trevnasty]

maybe a newbie question


can i run 103 or 114 octane with out breacking SH@$ with 550cc inj,walbro fuel pump,rewired pump wires,big evo III 16g,3in gm maf,maf tranlator,hard upper intercooler pipe,ect

Thanks guys

 

[kahl23]

Running race gas gives you no more power in and of itself. In fact, if you run race gas and don't tune for it your car will run like crap, you'll foul plugs, and be generally slower than usual. The only things you'd "break" by running race gas would be if that gas was leaded, then you would foul plugs more often (whatever, copper NGK's are cheap), kill O2 sensors more often, and kill your catalytic converter. Running only a maf-t, you really will see minimal gains from race gas, you don't have the ability to take advantage of the race gas by leaning it out while advancing timing. Save your money, run pump. My ¢2.

 

[trevnasty]

right on man thanks for looken out

 

[PIMking]

I put it in at the track in my 90. I had no cat and stock fuel. I got to the track with the fuel light on and put about 4 gallons in it. It helps keep knock counts down. I turned up the boost a bit to be safe with the race gas. I just didnt run it at all times. I would put regular 93 octane in her and she was good to go. I know it makes your o2 bad but denzo makes a lead resistant o2 sensor. It never fouled my plugs though.

The best part was the smell that c16 gives off when its burned.

 

[turbotemper]

Actually the octane rating above 110 all have lead in them which is very bad for catalytic converters, O2's, etc.
You can get away with running the cool blue 100 octane which is unleaded. There is also 100LL (low lead)(aviation fuel) Great for that little boost in octane rating you may need. IMO i would not run anything above the 100LL on any motor unless it was an old 60's-70's muscle car which back then there was lead in the gas.

 

[trevnasty]

ok if i ran 100 oct what would be a good psi to run on a big evo III 16g

 

[hubz91talontsi]

a good psi which you don't get any knock

 

[trevnasty]

ok so i em screwed becuse i dont have a way to read knock no dsmlink or chiped ecu

 

[turbotemper]

Im no expert but maybe another few more pounds not like 5-10 but a few. You really need a wideband O2 to monitor your A/F and some sort of tuning software to be really safe and know whats going on in the motor.

 

[trevnasty]

thanx 4 all the help guys

 

[PIMking]

Actually the octane rating above 110 all have lead in them which is very bad for catalytic converters, O2's, etc.
You can get away with running the cool blue 100 octane which is unleaded. There is also 100LL (low lead)(aviation fuel) Great for that little boost in octane rating you may need. IMO i would not run anything above the 100LL on any motor unless it was an old 60's-70's muscle car which back then there was lead in the gas.

Please explain. Im pretty sure that lead was added in fuel for something to help the valves. Also why do you see drag cars using leaded fuel? those are not 60-70's motors.

Plenty of people use leaded fuels in there cars for the drag strip. just read up on it. It could foul you o2 and plugs if you have a cat its not good for it but other than that its not going to make you blow up your motor.

 

[spyderturbo007]

ok so i em screwed becuse i dont have a way to read knock no dsmlink or chiped ecu

You can do it with a logger if you have one. Something like this would work.

 

[pboglio]

maybe a newbie question


can i run 103 or 114 octane with out breacking SH@$ with 550cc inj,walbro fuel pump,rewired pump wires,big evo III 16g,3in gm maf,maf tranlator,hard upper intercooler pipe,ect

Thanks guys

I usually run 30% 118 octane (xylene from Sherwin williams) and 70% 93 octane with 2 bottles Lucas Octane booster. It averages to about 106 octane. I run about 28 psi dropping to 22 psi near redline with 21* ignition timing on an EVOIII 16g. I don't get any knock with that combo. I wouldn't call it cheap, but its cheaper than a new motor.

The problem with 100 Unleaded is that you need to completely drain the fuel tank otherwise the unleaded in the tank will dilute it. This is why I run a mix of High octane with pump. They also don't sell high octane in the winter, which is why I run the fuel combination that I do.

 

[cjridert1]

You dont have any management right (aside from an AFC I guess?) I didnt see anything in your profile - If you do, different story; assuming you dont - get a logger and keep adding boost till you have knock, then bring it back a couple psi. These are fine with pump (and that ridiculous stock timing curve); those 550s will probably only be safe till low 20s psi (watch you duty cycles) - You can lean it out a bit on race gas (again, till you get knock) and maybe get 25psi out? Get a logger, keep your eye on things and add some air man. Good luck!

 

[turbotemper]

Please explain. Im pretty sure that lead was added in fuel for something to help the valves. Also why do you see drag cars using leaded fuel? those are not 60-70's motors.

Plenty of people use leaded fuels in there cars for the drag strip. just read up on it. It could foul you o2 and plugs if you have a cat its not good for it but other than that its not going to make you blow up your motor.

Where did i say it would blow it up??? Where exactly??? Nowhere???

Most actual drag cars run on alcohol/nitro not gas.
And yes plenty of people do run leaded fuel at the track and on their DD but they are also tuned for that type of fuel usually.

Older cars tend not to have cats on the exhaust. I didnt say it was bad for the motor i said it was bad for newer cars with their newer O2's and the cats.
Lead does act as a lubricant in the combustion chamber but lead wasnt added to the fuel to "help the valves". What was it supposed to do add power??? Valves dont make power . Air + Fuel + spark = power.
Drag cars run open headers (which is a straight pipe) So in other words there is no where to go but out of the head to the air not through a cat(s) and muffler(s) to the air.

 

[spooling 1g]

I run a 50-50 mix of cam2 and 94oct. all the time i have'nt killed one o2 sensor nor do i have a cat.Zero knock @21 psi on a 16g.

 

[pboglio]

Higher octane can add power. I've noticed from my datalogs that it tends to smooth out all the dips in the power curve by providing more consistent combustion even at the same ignition timing values.

I tried 118 leaded straight and my car hated it, bogged like crazy and had the worst throttle response. At the time the car was tuned perfectly on the way to the track on pump gas, then adding the high octane leaded fuel the car couldn't get out of its own way. Never had a chance to retune it at the track.

Thats why I recommend unleaded in a mix, since it doesn't require a massive retune of the fuel/ignition timing maps.

 

[PIMking]

Where did i say it would blow it up??? Where exactly??? Nowhere???

Most actual drag cars run on alcohol/nitro not gas.
And yes plenty of people do run leaded fuel at the track and on their DD but they are also tuned for that type of fuel usually.

Older cars tend not to have cats on the exhaust. I didn't say it was bad for the motor i said it was bad for newer cars with their newer O2's and the cats.
Lead does act as a lubricant in the combustion chamber but lead wasnt added to the fuel to "help the valves". What was it supposed to do add power??? Valves dont make power . Air + Fuel + spark = power.
Drag cars run open headers (which is a straight pipe) So in other words there is no where to go but out of the head to the air not through a cat(s) and muffler(s) to the air.

Lead was added in for the fact that the lead cushion the valves. as for making power valves do help. why do they make 1mm oversided valves? why do they make cams to open the valves? its all about getting the air in and out as efficient as possible.

Also for drag cars dont try to patronizing me. My uncle raced in the NHRA for years with both alcohol car and a nitro cars. I'm talking about when you go to the track on a test and tune and the mustang with the 351 next to you or the camaro with slicks and open headers.

Did you know you can take the o2 out and use a torch and clean the o2 sensor after running leaded fuel. I also said that if you don't have a cat you don't have to worry about clogging it from using Leaded fuels.

 

[PIMking]

Air + Fuel + spark = power.

ummm

air/fuel mixture + compression+ spark ='s power... tell you highschool shop teacher to quit.

you need three things for an internal combustion engine to work.

fuel/compression and spark

 

[Achelea]

Right, I'm a FAA Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic. (IE the Federal gov says I can work on airplane bodies and their engines, from turbine to Piston driven, called Reciprocating Engines.) And I have to make a comment, well, refer to a comment about the horsepower of the engine.

On the link below, go to the Last post. Well, the one before mine at least.

Rough Equivalents Blog Archive How Many Horsepower In A Twinkie?

That might clarify somethings. I might be able to explain if there are any further questions.

 

[turbotemper]

ok smart ass i wasnt being technical

Go try to talk shit somewhere else i was correcting you because i never said it would blow the motor, you said i did, and asked you to show me where and you couldnt
We werent talking about oversized valves or how to get air in the head either, we were talking about running 103 or leaded fuel in his 4g63 motor w/ his mods.
Also what does this mean?
"Also for drag cars dont try to patronizing me. My uncle raced in the NHRA for years with both alcohol car and a nitro cars. I'm talking about when you go to the track on a test and tune and the mustang with the 351 next to you or the camaro with slicks and open headers."
Is your e penis bigger since you typed that
Please explain what this has to do w/ anything.
Ive been to the track and been there in a sub 3k lbs car w/ slicks making 12 second passes. I never talked to you like you were an idiot but your proving me wrong.
So as for me patronizing you show me as well where i patronized you?

 

[trevnasty]

sh$$ guys look like i posted a heated dabate on 103 octane thanks everyone for there reply's know i need to know what i need to buy first to be able to run and monitor my car with higher octane,so what should i buy first fmic,wideband,datelogger,ect thanks trever

 

[trevnasty]

sh$$ guys look like i posted a heated dabate on 103 octane thanks everyone for there reply's know i need to know what i need to buy first to be able to run and monitor my car with higher octane,so what should i buy first fmic,wideband,datelogger,ect thanks trever

 

[turbotemper]

If you have the money buy the AEM standalone ECM setup. Comes with everything you need for tuning.
Other guys go piggyback style using multiple devices to control spark,timing,fuel,etc. It works for most but t so much simpler to use the AEM setup.
Best investment you could make if you plan to keep the car and highly modify it.