what to expect 20g

[PaRaNORML]

i have 97 tsi fwd 1g block 2 head with the tdo5 20g turbo....fmic,greddy type s bov,brand new forged pistons,brand new 1g rods,new bearings,all new valves,3 inch full exhaust,cast iron manifold, how much horsepower can i expect with this set up and how much boost would be safe to run.......can i get 350hp from this set up if properly tuned? thnx

 

[rush2252]

Are you running any kind of tune currently? Stock fuel cut is 16psi on the 2gs unless your tuned and have a way to adjust a/f ratio then its hard to say.

 

[PaRaNORML]

havent driven it at all yet......brand new motor being dropped tommrow.....i was told it could hit 400 easily but i just want 350 .....i bypassed the stock boost control module and are running a diffrent vac setup on turbo to allow up to 30psi

 

[MichaelSuch]

Uh I wouldn't run ANY boost if you're still on stock injectors. You need bigger injectors for that big increase of airflow, since you need bigger injectors you will also need a way to tune for those injectors, go ECMLink. You will also need a Wideband, and probably a few more fuel delivery mods such as a rewire kit, bigger fuel pump and an AFPR.

 

[RadDsm]

Anywhere from 100whp to 1000whp

No way to tell unless you dyno it.

Bench racing FTL

 

[PaRaNORML]

so basicily not enuff mods to support the 20g huh..? the previous 2 g setup i has hit 20psi no problem on the same turbo

 

[PaRaNORML]

i plan on installing 750cc injectors and 255 fuel pump with apex afc

 

[rush2252]

its impossible to hit 20psi on a 2g stock tune. It hits fuel cut and pulls timing after 16psi. Either your butt seat dyno is mistaken or your boost gauge isnt working. Do you have an aftermarket boost gauge installed? IMO your going to have a car that runs worse than stock because of boost lag on that big 20g. Until you have supporting mods expect diappointment.

I wouldnt drive that car until you did an update to fuel system /pump/injector/afpr/etc etc etc... It would be a shame to blow the money you spent on bolt ons because the car was improperly tuned.

- Kolby

 

[fox4]

Correct like its been said you need a bigger fuel pump (255), bigger injectors, an afpr, and then some kind of way of logging fuel trims (wideband, ECM link) and tuning (ECM link, SAFC if you run 650cc injectors or smaller) them also. If you don't that 20g will be pushing way more air into the motor than the stock fuel set up can can handle, and you will be getting tons of knock, and melt all of that brand new stuff you just put on.

 

[MichaelSuch]

i plan on installing 750cc injectors and 255 fuel pump with apex afc

An AFC will only work good with up to 650's I think, and 650's I don't think would unlock the full potential of a 20g...

 

[PaRaNORML]

well i get the car out tommrow.....is it ok to drive it until i upgrade?....even running low booost will i still have alot of lag?

 

[AWD_Hybrid]

PaRaNORML buy a good tube exh mani to spool earlier than the stock
cast iron pos. As above, pump & automotive fpr.
Cheers !

 

[the_mork]

There is some misinformation in this thread that should be cleared up.


First of all a stock car does not hit fuel cut at 16psi. The stock computer has no idea how much boost you are running. A stock car will hit fuel cut when it reaches what it believes to be 100% IDC. This is a safety feature not necessarily a function of running out of fuel. On a 20g that could be any boost level and it is dependent on all sorts of things, total engine VE, atmospheric pressure, humidity, IAT, boost leaks, fuel leaks, exhaust leaks, whether you've told your mother you love her recently, etc.

There is not trick to sorting around the vacuum to miraculously run 30psi. You can use an electronic boost controller, a manual boost controller, or you can change the wastegate duty cycle variables of your ecu to change the behavior of the BCS(not possible with the stock ecu). If you have a 20g on a stock fuel system you MUST run no more than wastegate pressure. This means hook up a vacuum line from a positive pressure area (intercooler piping or compressor housing) directly to the wastegate with nothing on the way.

An AFC is not enough for 750s. You may be able to run them but you will not be able to tune them well and you have spent how much on your engine and turbo?

Buy a quality tuning system. IMO that means ecmlink, a keydiver chip, or an evo8 ecu.

Ecmlink will cost the most and it is robust with a mild learning curve, it requires switching to a 1995 eprom ecu.

A Keydiver chip is less expensive than ecmlink but will be a great tune however it is a "boxed" tune and you can't change it when you change things on your car, this also requires a 95 eprom ecu.

An evo8 ecu is the cheapest and IMO the most robust. It does have a high learning curve though so if you aren't willing to do some learning you will not be able to use it.


Also plan on buying a wideband to use with any of those solutions.


Finally, you will never be fast without proper tuning. All the boltons and engine internals you can buy wont get you to chase down a stock car with injectors and a tune.


Now it is time for you to do some reading, if you don't understand something that I posted just click the search button and read until your eyes hurt, then come back and do it again the next day.

 

[PaRaNORML]

before motor swap the car ran ok..but not perfect the 20g would spool around 3400 but wouldnt hit hard till about 5000 but i also had a cracked exhuast manifold and the stock exhaust sytem........now i have the full 3inch exhuast system so u wouldnt think it would run more effeicnt then it did?

 

[PaRaNORML]

ive spent roughly 3grand this time around.brand new everything and turbo has lless than 1k miles on it...

 

[rush2252]

just curious but why did you start another thread on the same topic?

 

[PaRaNORML]

new to site....trying to expand awnsers.....my bad but i dont see why it bothers you so much?

 

[GofaST4life]

new to site....trying to expand awnsers.....my bad but i dont see why it bothers you so much?

Its only a waste of space.

And plenty of answers have been given. IMO.

 

[the_mork]

before motor swap the car ran ok..but not perfect the 20g would spool around 3400 but wouldnt hit hard till about 5000 but i also had a cracked exhuast manifold and the stock exhaust sytem........now i have the full 3inch exhuast system so u wouldnt think it would run more effeicnt then it did?

It should run much better. You will still hit a wall with airflow though. Someone could easily max out the stock fuel system with a 14b or 16g which would give them about the same power as your max but a spool range that starts with positive pressure around 2000RPM. Not to say that the 20g isn't a great turbo but you aren't using enough of it to take advantage of its flow. With $800 worth of parts you will double the horsepower that your car puts out, get a faster spool, and be safer. If you really don't want to dip your toes into tuning very much then add $300 to go and get someone to tune it for you. You have the motor and turbo to make a beast of a car so why not take advantage of what you've already paid for.

Also for future reference posting multiple threads on the same topic is considered kind of rude. There is more than enough visibility on this site without multiple threads, if you would like the greatest number of quality replies to your questions then your focus should be on descriptive thread titles.

 

[PIMking]

I will advise some suspension mods after anything else you want to spend on the motor because what good is 40980937u03298u74 hp when your FWD will burn the rubber for miles..

I love when people dont read the upgrade path and I love this part.

check these
Tech Guide: 2G 4G63t Upgrades - DSMtuners
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/fre...uestions/55410-top-10-most-popular-dsm-q.html

 

[Defiant]

Bench racing.