starter relay problem (did search, problems a bit different)

[cgburns]

this is my problem, i'm working on a 90 plymouth laser 1.8l and the only way i can get it to start is by bypassing the starter relay...like this:

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i know thats kinda hard to see but basically from being able to do that i figured it was the relay and ordered another but this one does the same thing...when you turn the key without the relay being bypassed all it does is make a clicking sound and nothing cranks, but everything starts and seems to run fine with that wire bypassing the relay..i've done all the bench and on-vehicle tests to the starter and everything is good so its not that, tested continuity between MPI control relay, starter, MPI control unit, and starter relay and all is good there, all fuses are good too...so i'm kinda lost, unless the dealer sent me another bad starter relay??... what do yall think?

 

[92redman]

does yours have the theft alarm?

also, take a picture further up the page showing the starter motor circuit because I don't have my service manual up here at school.

 

[cgburns]

no it doesn't have the theft alarm... here's 2 more pics up the diagram

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[92redman]

Try checking the continuity between pin 4 of the relay and the ground for the clutch switch with the clutch pedal pressed in, if possible.

Also, does the top wire on the starter motor that goes off the top of the page go to a fused B+ source??

 

[cgburns]

the wire coming up from the 3rd pic is the top wire on the starter and it connects directly to the battery... and as for testing the continuity between pin4 and clutch switch ground, i could try it, but if there was a problem in there then the car wouldn't start with or without the clutch depressed correct?

 

[92redman]

do you have to press the clutch in when you bypass the relay?

 

[cgburns]

the starter relay, yes, i push the clutch in and it starts right up

 

[92redman]

Man, I am having a hard time figuring this out. Could you post a pic of the ignition switch diagram?

Edit: nevermind, I was looking at the whole thing wrong.

 

[92redman]

The parts of the circuit I outlined in red are the parts you are bypassing with you jumper wire, these are the most likely and probably only places your problem could be. Are you sure that you can't start it with out pressing in the clutch with the relay bypassed?

 

[cgburns]

no, i'll try that today

 

[cgburns]

ok i just tried that and it started right up without even pushing the clutch in...so does that mean i'm actually bypassing the clutch switch and there inlies the problem??... thought i had ruled that out b/c we tried bypassing the clutch switch by putting a jumper wire between the two connections on the clutch switch itself and the car still didn't start

 

[92redman]

No, that means I am interpreting the circuit correctly. Okay, you have the options that I outlined in red. You can test the relay itself to make sure it is in fact good by hooking your meter up to pins 1 and 3 to check for continuity, then hook up pins 2 and 4 to a 12 volt source. You should get continuity when you apply the 12 volts. If this tests good then you have left, theat wire that goes from pin 1 to the splice; the actual contacts that the realay plugs into; and the clutch switch circuit.

To rule out the clutch switch circuit, run a jumper wire from the pin 4 connection to the battery ground terminal and try to start it. If it starts, you then can check the switch itself by jumping from one side to the other like you did, if that fails it is an open in the wiring itself.

If the clutch switch circuit checks out fine, you know it is one of the other possibilities.

Haha, I probably made that all about as clear as mud.

 

[92redman]

ok i just tried that and it started right up without even pushing the clutch in...so does that mean i'm actually bypassing the clutch switch and there inlies the problem??... thought i had ruled that out b/c we tried bypassing the clutch switch by putting a jumper wire between the two connections on the clutch switch itself and the car still didn't start

What your jumper wire is doing is actually making a direct connection from the ignition switch to the pull-in and hold-in coils in the starter moter. That tells you that the ignition switch is good, the wiring between the ignition switch and jumper wire is good, the fuses are good, the starter is good, and the wiring from the relay to the starter is good.

 

[cgburns]

hmm yeah i'll try those tests tomorrow...this things beginning to get on my nerves haha

 

[cgburns]

FIXED! ...it was the clutch switch...thanks for the help man

 

[92redman]

np.