Safe first mods on a rebuilt stock 2g

[wohley8]

Hey-

I am currently having a reman engine installed into my 2g AWD auto Talon, which is dead stock... I love the car, bought it new, and it is my daily driver. I do have an opprtunity to get a bit more out of it, and have read so much on it that my eyes are crossing. My goals are modest, say under 300 hp. I have been told that is is safest to run my old t25 turbo on the reman engine since there is a possibility of metal debris, which could kill the existing turbo which has a bit of play in the shaft with 108k on it. I'm already spending a good amount on the engine, have opted for a new K/N intake kit, new exhoust manifild (mine was cracked by the dealer that replaced the timing belt, and killed my engine) and 3" turbo back, and a replacement BOV.

Now would be a good time to replace the injectors and fuel pump with 550s and a 190 pump if I were to add a larger turbo after the break in period, but then I would need a fuel management device, and boost controller and I'll be honest, that scares me as this is not anything I have done before and as I understand it, you can go terminally wrong very easily.

The meat of my question is this... is there a relatively mild turbo upgrade that would be safe to run and be managed by the stock ECU, provided I upgrade the injectors and fuel pump? I had been looking at the big t28 and the 16g, but they seem to be not so mild as they both flow over 500cfm as opposed to the 290 cfm of the stock t25...

I would be grateful for anyone's experiences...

 

[DSMunknown]

I hope you are going to (or have already done) break the engine in like you're supposed to:




http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215733



Worry about the above first if you haven't already done so.

 

[kspharris]

You should get the ECU chipped. That will take care of ALL your tuning. Remember that you will not have to use all of the turbo that you get. I would go for the Evo 16g because it will be more effecient than the T28. The 550's and the 190lph are going to be perfect for what you are looking. The ECU can tune it for you so that you do not have to. I would also PM Andymoraitis and he can help you pick a tune. I hope this helps you and if you need any more help then PM me and I will help you out. Thanks, Keith.

 

[JayRolla]

I recommend getting a chip like he says but then also a safc for fine tuning. The way andy does it is fine but all he can mess with is boost. His full tune is on the chip. It works good but I would rather have control of my fuel. I would go DSMlink myself.

 

[wohley8]

Oh, yes... I am going to put my old turbo back on for the break in period, no real mods save for replacing the cracked mainfold, the BOV and the K/N intake kit, the exhuast (turbo back)... I am torn, I can take the safe route, buy a cheap used stock t25 and have that remanufactured while I am breaking in, then just put that on after the break in period OR upgrade to something a little better. Of course that is a can of worms. I just wanted to know if there was a mild upgrade that the stock ECU could manage, with just the addition of 550cc injectors and a new fuel pump, and a boost guage/controller.

Trust me, I'm conservative... I love my car, and want it to be my daily ride for years to come after what I'm putting into it now! Not looking for a glorious death ride.

 

[Bo0O0ostedDSM]

Now would be a good time to replace the injectors and fuel pump with 550s and a 190 pump if I were to add a larger turbo after the break in period, but then I would need a fuel management device, and boost controller...

I think he already has the engine break in on his mind.

 

[kspharris]

If you want I will sell you my T25, it is BRAND new, due to warranty. Well it actually has like 1,500 miles on it. I would post it in the classified but can not yet. I will sell it for cheap, PM me if you are interested.

 

[Bo0O0ostedDSM]

Oh, yes... I am going to put my old turbo back on for the break in period, no real mods save for replacing the cracked mainfold, the BOV and the K/N intake kit, the exhuast (turbo back)... I am torn, I can take the safe route, buy a cheap used stock t25 and have that remanufactured while I am breaking in, then just put that on after the break in period OR upgrade to something a little better. Of course that is a can of worms. I just wanted to know if there was a mild upgrade that the stock ECU could manage, with just the addition of 550cc injectors and a new fuel pump, and a boost guage/controller.

Trust me, I'm conservative... I love my car, and want it to be my daily ride for years to come after what I'm putting into it now! Not looking for a glorious death ride.

The T28 is the closest thing to a "mild" upgrade from the (stock) T25... from outside appearance, they look the same. However, I wouldn't even do that during the engine break in period. Also, if your thinking about putting 550cc injectors on, know that you can't just put them on and call it a day. Whenever you install larger injectors, you need some way to control them. SAFC, DSMlink, reflash ECU, etc.

 

[wohley8]

That's really why I was looking at the t28, same housing, nice quick spool up direct bolt on, etc, but the flow is significantly higher. Thanks for your input on the fuel mods, I was wondering about that, if I could just put them in as the engine is just about to arrive at the shop so it would be easier.

Lets say I were to do the turbo mod, ECU upgrade after the break in period... what will the impact be on the safety of the engine, and reliability? Like I said I want to get that little bit more out of it, but safely.

 

[wohley8]

Am looking at the links, wow, very different to what I have heard on breaking an engine in... Can see the logic in it. Thanks for the info, I'll read it all.

 

[wohley8]

You should get the ECU chipped. That will take care of ALL your tuning. Remember that you will not have to use all of the turbo that you get. I would go for the Evo 16g because it will be more effecient than the T28. The 550's and the 190lph are going to be perfect for what you are looking. The ECU can tune it for you so that you do not have to. I would also PM Andymoraitis and he can help you pick a tune. I hope this helps you and if you need any more help then PM me and I will help you out. Thanks, Keith.

Keith, thanks... sounds like a good solution, fairly hands off, don't really have the experience with tuning, don't want to learn the hard way now. I have looked at the DSMLink, and that looks like a powerful tool in the hands of someone who knows how to use it... Also a powerful tool of destruction for someone who does not have the knowledge, which would be me. I'm looking to get set up and just motor, safely and into the future.

 

[vaboys2ndgen]

i would say after the break in period if you plan on making right about 300whp. go with a ported 14b or a ported small 16g that'll make that power right about where u want it. 190fuel pump, 550s, safc/logger(easy to use, took me a few days to figure out but i got it down somewhat) just remember slow is fast when learning.

 

[jumpfroggy]

I was looking at the small 16g for this range. With a 190/550 and AFC seems like it wouldn't be too much to dive into. What really got me interested was the thread about small vs. big 16g's (and evo3) and how the small is more efficient (looking at the compressor map), so for smaller setups it may make a better choice. I was always interested in "mild" upgrades (vs. the "go bigger and have room to upgrade" mentality) since I'm island-bound, no track, and too much traffic. I'd look into the small 16g for all that.

 

[wohley8]

What are good choices for a fairly hands off but reliable ECU mod? Anybody running this type of set up as with a small 16g, 14b or t28? The SAFC scares me a bit, I hear the "slow is fast on that one", much like bomb disposal I guess. I really want to hear about this type of set ups reliability on a day to day basis... That's really a major concern for me, as I have to admit I'm not really a mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, but my motivation certainly is increasing on that score. The shops I have dealt with have taken my cash and killed my motor to start with...