Replacing rings after 4k miles

[1fast97gsx]

I'm replacing my rings on my block again because I think my last set didn't seat right. I've put 3700 miles on the car since the pistons / rings and the block was bored and honed. Do I need to bother with a ridge reemer to do the ring swap since it's only been 4000 miles? Should I rehone the block or is this impossible without making the bore sizes too big. Should I just pull the pistons .. put a new ring set on and put them back in?

 

[tsiawd98]

If you used syntetic oil for your break in period,then thats why your pistons rings did not seat right. if you did use syn. oil next time use some cheap oil thats not syntetic then after the break in use whatever you usually. just take the engine apart and hone it for like a couple of seconds in each cylinder and clean the parts put it back together and it should be fine. but i would also measure the gaps of everything.

 

[bastarddsm]

did you ever do a leak down or a compression check on your motor?????

 

[1fast97gsx]

I didn't use synthetic to break it in ... didn't switch over until it had 2k miles actually. Compression was 180, 170, 160, 155 ( from memory ) ... didn't know anyone that could do a leakdown test expect for AMS but they want $60 just to do that. A new ringset is around $100 so might as well spend the extra $40 and the extra 2 hours ( either way the head has to come off ) to change the rings.

EDIT .. my throttle cable was stuck so at "0%" throttle I was actually giving the car like 5% or so. ( cable was messed up ) In other words when I thought I was at idle I was actually at 1500 rpm because the throttle was open a little bit ... I think that had a big impact on the break in of the rings since I didn't get the "vary my speeds" under these conditions until I actually took it out for a drive. ( 25 minutes after initial start up ) and then let it jsut idle again for another 10 minutes after I got back.

 

[burldude]

Huh Man you are thinking that it is going to be broke in at 3700 miles ? :thumbdown These motor are famous for low tension rings So I would recomend putting another 10,000 on it and check again . I would check the search if I where you . Your throttle cable issue is nothing and you are making problems up for yourself . If you are worried about the synthetic in your motor now, drain it and put some dinosuar juice back in and start counting down to ten grand . Do you honestly think that you would have a full breakin at 3700 ? If you look back at your cylinder pressure it goes consistant with the cooling in the block Hotter on one side colder on the other = better break in starting on one side leading to colder on the other side Dont waste the time or effort ,Please

 

[Mirage2LTurbo]

My motor puffed one smoke at startup, and blew 195-200-200-200 across the board after 15 minutes of idling just to warm up the engine. It hasn't burned a drop of oil since. If you're constantly swapping out rings, you might want to consider have a good machine shop do your work and do it right.

 

[burldude]

My motor puffed one smoke at startup, and blew 195-200-200-200 across the board after 15 minutes of idling just to warm up the engine. It hasn't burned a drop of oil since. If you're constantly swapping out rings, you might want to consider have a good machine shop do your work and do it right.

1.Your motor must have been torque plate honed and have higher compression pistons
2. Your full of it ?
3. Gapless rings set, with tighter ring piston clearances ?
4. You have gone na and have not updates your profile and are running 10 to 1.
5 . Your compression tester is garbage and reading higher than it should ?

Any way this is about this is about 1fast97gsx and his "uneven compression" . My motor had around 180,00 miles on the block and had no ridge and the crosshatch was still there. Did I hone the crosshatch that was existing ? No . Why? If the crosshatch is still there with 180,000 then the low tension rings are not going to be able to remove a new crosshatch and I would just be making the ring end gap bigger ( by honing the cylinders).

1fast do another comression check . Then do another one with a little oil in the cylinders . We still dont have enough info off what you have provided to make a diagnosis . Did you check end gap ? What did the cylinders look like ? What was the reason for the rebuild ? Did you bore oversize ? As it is now I can only guess ?

 

[Mirage2LTurbo]

1.Your motor must have been torque plate honed and have higher compression pistons
2. Your full of it ?
3. Gapless rings set, with tighter ring piston clearances ?
4. You have gone na and have not updates your profile and are running 10 to 1.
5 . Your compression tester is garbage and reading higher than it should ?

Any way this is about this is about 1fast97gsx and his "uneven compression" . My motor had around 180,00 miles on the block and had no ridge and the crosshatch was still there. Did I hone the crosshatch that was existing ? No . Why? If the crosshatch is still there with 180,000 then the low tension rings are not going to be able to remove a new crosshatch and I would just be making the ring end gap bigger ( by honing the cylinders).

1fast do another comression check . Then do another one with a little oil in the cylinders . We still dont have enough info off what you have provided to make a diagnosis . Did you check end gap ? What did the cylinders look like ? What was the reason for the rebuild ? Did you bore oversize ? As it is now I can only guess ?

1. 9:1 Wiseco's coated, no torque plate was used either.

2. I'm not full of it, but you might be. Also, it's "you're" and not "your."

3. Yes, I had the top ring sent to Totalseal and it was machined to be gapless. Do you need me to draw you a picture?

4. I'm definitly turbo, and I've always run 9:1 (the only set of pistons in this motor other than the 2g's)

5. The compression gauge is fine. Actually, the cam timing did end up being a tooth off. We noticed this after driving it around and having no power. This would account for the higher readings. Maybe you should check into your info a bit more, and realize there is a lot more than just c/r that goes into how high a gauge reads. You didn't ask if I milled my head for one, which might make a little difference.

Thanks

-Colin

 

[TSIfreek]

1fastgsx, I would drain the synthetic oil out and put some cheep 10w30 in it and go beat the snot out of it. It may work it may not. As far as honing the block again yes you will need to do it because you may have glazed the cylinder walls. New rings need that fresh honing to machine in with the cylinder wall to provide the best seal.
Next time you start your fresh engine what ever it is keep it between 2k and 2500 rpm until it reaches temp and then go out and beat on it with stock boost for 10 miles then change the oil again. You need that pressure from the engine working to really seat the rings well or else they are just glazing the walls.

 

[TSIfreek]

BTW what ring end gaps did you go with??

 

[1fast97gsx]

Huh Man you are thinking that it is going to be broke in at 3700 miles ? :thumbdown These motor are famous for low tension rings So I would recomend putting another 10,000 on it and check again . I would check the search if I where you . Your throttle cable issue is nothing and you are making problems up for yourself . If you are worried about the synthetic in your motor now, drain it and put some dinosuar juice back in and start counting down to ten grand . Do you honestly think that you would have a full breakin at 3700 ? If you look back at your cylinder pressure it goes consistant with the cooling in the block Hotter on one side colder on the other = better break in starting on one side leading to colder on the other side Dont waste the time or effort ,Please

Well the compression numbers are pretty uneven and I'm burning a ton of oil. The car also seems to have gotten a bit slower since 1000 miles ago. I didn't start running synthetic until the 2k mile mark so I'm not worried about that.

Block was bored .020 and it has ross pistons and eagle rods. Reason for rebuild was just to make it stronger.

 

[TSIfreek]

Forgot to ad you will have no problem lightly honeing it again. It will take off very little. Just let your machineist know whats up.

 

[burldude]

Now I see that you are burning a ton of oil . Not good :thumbdown . Tear down is needed.

 

[autronicDSM]

You're not supposed to switch to regular oil after using synthetic. You'll end up breaking the motor.

 

[Mirage2LTurbo]

You're not supposed to switch to regular oil after using synthetic. You'll end up breaking the motor.

WHere do you come up with this from?

 

[1fast97gsx]

You're not supposed to switch to regular oil after using synthetic. You'll end up breaking the motor.

I don't agree with that at all .. that's an old rumor. We have customers at my work ask that question all the time too. WHY would it ruin the motor??

 

[rsr93]

You're not supposed to switch to regular oil after using synthetic. You'll end up breaking the motor.

:laugh:

thats just plain stupid

 

[1fast97gsx]

**TESTED COMPRESSION AGAIN AND VERY SUPRISED**

I got 165 165 168 165 .... I swear the last few times it was all over the place but now it's actually pretty decent. Maybe the rings really weren't seated? I still have blue smoke coming out of my exhaust though under wot and burn quite a bit. Could this just be leaky valves? Does that compression sound about right with 8.5:1 pistons and an MLS headgasket ( thicker than stock )? Maybe I'll just put my other head on and hope it takes care of it all.

 

[autronicDSM]

:laugh:

thats just plain stupid

Oh is it? It happened to me 3 years ago, all the bearings went out. I have a friend who was a machanic for 20 years and he told me that. Another engineer that I work with told me the same. I think I'll believe them then some kid's opinion.

Supposedly they used to have a warning on the bottle (small print) that said that. Last time I used synthetic oil was about that time.

 

[greathuskie]

find the problem then fix it, dont just throw random parts at it hoping it will fix it

 

[autronicDSM]

I don't agree with that at all .. that's an old rumor. We have customers at my work ask that question all the time too. WHY would it ruin the motor??

The way it was explained to me, regular oil won't form a thin film on the surfaces after synthetic was used. I don't know if it's an old rumor if my bearings died. Coincidence or not, you decide.

 

[half-cocked]

1. 9:1 Wiseco's coated, no torque plate was used either.

2. I'm not full of it, but you might be. Also, it's "you're" and not "your."

3. Yes, I had the top ring sent to Totalseal and it was machined to be gapless. Do you need me to draw you a picture?

4. I'm definitly turbo, and I've always run 9:1 (the only set of pistons in this motor other than the 2g's)

5. The compression gauge is fine. Actually, the cam timing did end up being a tooth off. We noticed this after driving it around and having no power. This would account for the higher readings. Maybe you should check into your info a bit more, and realize there is a lot more than just c/r that goes into how high a gauge reads. You didn't ask if I milled my head for one, which might make a little difference.

Thanks

-Colin

Since you had not use a torqueplate did you have the the piston to wall clearance upped?

 

[heavyD]

The way it was explained to me, regular oil won't form a thin film on the surfaces after synthetic was used. I don't know if it's an old rumor if my bearings died. Coincidence or not, you decide.

Nothing but an old wives tale. Go to Mobile, Amsoil, or any sythetic site and read their FAQ's. I've bought my last three cars used and switched them all over to synthetic with no problems to any of them. The only thing that can happen is that if you have worn seals, synthetic will tend to leak more.

 

[ITSME4G63]

YOu hsould just sell the ####ing car, you have too many problems with it, moda####a always strives to make it to dsm meet but cant, if you do take apart your engine though, show me how its done, i wanna see first hand, thanks.

 

[autronicDSM]

Nothing but an old wives tale. Go to Mobile, Amsoil, or any sythetic site and read their FAQ's. I've bought my last three cars used and switched them all over to synthetic with no problems to any of them. The only thing that can happen is that if you have worn seals, synthetic will tend to leak more.

Read my post, it's switching from synthetic back to regular.