my car is FUGGED!!!

[larryd]

and another thing .. I went out to the car 2nite to check for cracks anywhere and to make sure there is nothingf obviously wrong and the Tbelt is tight as it was before.. DAMN this is making no sense.. how can it go from tight to lose to tight again?!?!..

Im going to warm the car up tomorrow and do another compression test.. if it comes back really bad Im going to pull the head and see if I can see anything from there.. if I can determine that the piston rings are leaking then Im prolly gonna end up taking the car somewhere.. just towing it there

 

[Bohrn]

tight and loose then tight again?? Sounds like something is expanding when hot and shrinking again when cold??

just guessin...

I remember that the tensioner is a friggin wierd setup, and it slowly expands when opened up. Maybe it is bad, and the spring(??) only has enough tension on it when cold??

 

[KenTSIII]

Forget starting the car. How about taking out the #1 spark plug... install a long skinny screwdriver or 12" socket extension in the cylinger & turning the motor over to TDC by hand w/ the crank & a 1/2" rachet (instructions in the Tbelt VFAQ www.vfaq.com). Turn it to TDC the screwdriver (or whatever you used) will be at the very tip top of it's stroke & both cam dowel pins will be at the 12:00 position. Now look at the cam marks.. are they lined up? My guess is no... That means the Tbelt has skipped. Put the Tbelt back to the correct location & check the compression again.

 

[larryd]

i plan on doing that.. but can you tell me why the tbelt would be loose last night and tight today?? it just doesnt make sense

 

[KenTSIII]

you prolly had a cam snap over... have you done anything to the car (turned it over or moved it)? The cams being in different locations can make the belt tighter or looser from the top.. this is quite normal... but yours sounds excessive.

 

[larryd]

yes.. i drove it home from work that morning to get it here but havent moved it since.. I know.. Im stupid and all that but I live 3 miles from work and had to get it home

 

[cmc]

Your tensioner is acting screwy, thats causing the tight/loose movement in the tbelt

 

[larryd]

but why would it do that.. has anyone ever heard of this happening before.. the tensioner is brand new

 

[ted_the_mexican]

after doing belts and pumps and all the tensioners on my car i had the same loping (granted my replacements werent as extensive as yours but stay with me).

All you need to do first is retime everything. MAke sure that all your marks are aligned and double check evrything. Once you get the Timing Belt set use some vise grips or clamps or whatever to hold the timing belt in place while you set tension on it. Once the tension is set you can remove the clamps and the tension will hold the belt correctly.

Once you have everything in place then try to start you car again. It should run a ton better. Let it warm up and do your tests again. You results will varey greatly from the cool tests.

Also one thing to remember is with any rebuild you need to give your new parts "break-in" time. At least 250-500 miles then you can give it hell, but until then you will be doing more damage than good.

 

[KenTSIII]

after running the car.. inbetween the loose & tight situations.. the motor will put tension back onto the timing belt. It prolly has nothing to do w/ the tensioner.. other than out of adjustment. You can feel any DSM Tbelt at different points after running it & you will feel different amounts of tension.. this has to do w/ how the cams are in relation to each other when you shut the car off... totally normal. But if it's soo loose that you thought you could have pulled the Tbelt off the gears.. then something is definately not right. Do the procedure I stated above ASAP & it will tell you your exact situation... it only take 5 min to do.

 

[larryd]

yeah.. I understand that the cam position will change the tension on the belt a lil bit.. but it went from literally being able to pull the belt off by hand to being as tite as it could get without me doing anything other then driving it home 3 miles from work.. Just seems wierd.. oh well.. im gonna try to get everything lined up 2nite and do another compression test

 

[Violater101]

update?

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by larryd
but why would it do that.. has anyone ever heard of this happening before.. the tensioner is brand new

I would replace the tensioner when you do the second timing belt no matter how it looks. I have put one on my 1G already with 115K miles. Having slack between the cam pulleys is not totally abnormal. I think you have TOO MUCH slack, but some is not abnormal. Like someone said about cam snapover. I had my 1G sitting on jackstands for 5 months and you could move my TB up/down probably 1 inch total. It is tight now, but I guess things relax a bit.

Setting the tension is kind of tricky on these. This is how I do it and have had pretty good luck. Put the pin in the tensioner and install the thing. Time the car carefully (I think you might not have this right--get someone who had done a couple to look over your shoulder). Tighten the tensioner fairly tight (almost as tight as it SHOULD be on the car all the time. Turn the motor over 6 times and let it sit 15 minutes like the book says. Check the TB tension and make sure it is not drastically looser. Snug if necessary. When everything is right, pull the pin. TRY TO PUT IT BACK IN after about 5 or 10 seconds. If it goes in, you have the thing too tight. If the tensioner starts to extend a bit and you can't get the pin back in, you probably have it right. Turn the motor over 6 more times and let it sit 15 minutes. Come back and measure how much of the tensioner is protruding and compare to the spec in the book. It should be right. Repeat as necessary.

 

[ted_the_mexican]

get a new tensioner and then the tension will hold

 

[venom2097]

I had a problem like yours, I started the car to due a compresion test, head a clung,clung.. that incressed with engine speed, had compression like yours (don't know exact #'s)What happd to me was the balance shaft belt had broke and got all bunched up and messed up my TB. And the noise was my cy#2 rod had broke in 1/2, and 5 min later ended up going through the oil pump. and puti a 8in crack in the block.

anyway thats my $3000+ compresion test.

 

[ted_the_mexican]

sorry bout that larry
with a new tensioner then you sounds like it is your timing off.
i had that happen when my tbelt slipped.
all you need to do (not a technical summary but it is in the vfaqs) is jack the car up and then the engine, remove your belts *all of them* then line up your marks on your cams water pump etc.
when you put the belts back on make sure you recheck them for the correct settings them put it all back together and try to strat your car.
this worked for me so it might be worth a shot.
hope it works for you

 

[larryd]

well the update is nothing really.. its a long story but basically to reset the timing belt woulda been a complete pita becuase you have to remove all the accesory belts to set the tbelt and then once thats set put all the accesory belts back on so I can let the car run for 15 mins to warm it up before doin the compression test.. I dont see the point in this as I know the car is also smoking oil ALOT so Im going to take the head off before I do anything.. I really wanted to do a pressure test on the block and check the rings that way and do the same with the head.. Anyhow we have the head just bout ready to come off the car.. like literally the only thing holding it down is the coolant lines on the thermostat.. when we went to jack the car up to drain the coolant the jack broke so we were sol for that night.. and tonight my friend didnt wanna work on the car nor did I .. I really wanna just take the car somewhere and let them deal with it.. problem is the 2 local places that actually know their **** are both backed up.. turbotrix needs atleast 2 weeks before they can touch it and extreme wants atleast a month not to mention a 5000.00 bill to get the car running again.. I just dont know if I can convince myself to do that or not.. I mean 5000.00 is another car.. hell for a couple more I can buy my friends built 1g AWD and put my car back to stock

 

[NJGSX96]

If you are going to travel all the way to Turbotrix, try:

www.diamondstarmotorsport.com
www.bmtranny.com
SBRacing - Ask for Craig (973)627 5533



About pulling the belts and stuff off, I feel ya bro. i am doing that today.. again. Did a timing belt Wednesday and something inside the timing cover case is rubbing. Took it all apart yesterday after work. Gonna hopefully finish it up today.

 

[larryd]

dontcha just get tired of it though.. I mean I know its gotta be right eventually but damn I get soo annoyed anymore when it doesnt work the 3rd or 4th time

 

[Formz]

You didnt even TRY to align the crank pulley and check the cam sprokets? Dude I'm sorry for being harsh but you deserve all of this if you cant take 5 minutes and just CHECK THE ****ING THING.

 

[larryd]

5 mins?? have you ever done this before?? you have to jack up the car, take off the wheel, take off all the accessory belts, take off all the accessory pulleys, take off the lower tbelt cover, thats just to be able to see the mark on the crank pulley.. thats an hours worth of work easily, then there comes into the effect of ligning everything up and setting the tensioner again which is a complete pain in the ass if youve ever dealt with the tensioner pulley for this thing.. and then after you get that done, the tbelt that is, you can go ahead and put the tbelt cover back on, then the accessory pulleys and then the aceessory belts again and the wheel and lower the car and start it again.. from start to stop your looking at easily 4-5 hours of hard labor that on yer own is near impossible and my friend didnt wanna work on the car that night so I didnt blame him..

mind you, after I do all that just to do another compression check that doesnt solve the issue of burning oil.. the tbelt being off a tooth wouldnt cause the car to burn oil.. bad valve seats, bad head gasket, bad piston rings, not the tbelt.. so whats spending all this time aligning the **** right going to solve.. nothing.. it doesnt tell me what else is wrong with the car.. id be basically doing all that to only have to pull it off again to check the head gasket and the piston rings.. there is no easy fix here as you may think

and who the hell do you think you are to tell someone they deserve their car to break on them.. I wouldnt wish this **** on my worst enemy.. and you dont even know me but you assume that since i didnt want to bust my ass for no reason that I deserve this.. well screw u dude..

 

[Formz]

Actually you dont have to take off the lower timing belt cover. with the proper lighting you can see it just fine. But ofcourse, I wouldnt know that since I've only done it 5+ times.....

To turn your crank pulley all you have to do is just TURN THE WHEEL. You dont even have to jack it up! Put a half inch socket extension in there, and TURN. NO NEED to take off ANY BELTS.

 

[IPT]

Gat a timimg belt tool. IT is SOOO mush easier than F**king with the tensioner. They are around $15. Worth every penny.

 

[larryd]

well Im done working on the car.. decicded yesterday when I talked to the mechanic.. he is going to take my car and fix it for me.. put in a 6 bolt with forged internals.. Crower rods with Ross Pistons..

 

[NJGSX96]

Originally posted by IPT
Gat a timimg belt tool. IT is SOOO mush easier than F**king with the tensioner. They are around $15. Worth every penny.

I agree... that tool is the greatest invention ever!!! Saves you so much time and effort!