Mr. Freeze water/methenol injection

[96blacktalon]

I was wondering if any of you had seen this. I can post the link to the page directly because of the way they're set up, but go to this sight: http://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/
then go to "anderson products" in the top left and go to the mr. freeze, or scroll down to the middle of the home page under whats new and go to "mr. freeze" I've seen the other meth/water injection kits, but this seems simpler and easier to tune with. especially since you could adjust/ change the valves to only pull under a certain boost range. and no pump or electrical crap to deal with. if you use the second option i listed of how to read access the page, it'll show you the article in 5.0 mustang and super fords magazine that i read about it in. seems like a good idea. comments, hints, thoughts. just throwing it out there. for the price, it seems great. thanks for the input all.

jeff

 

[Defiant]

http://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/mr-freeze.html

I don't believe their horsepower claims, but I am very much in favor of water injection. And, adding alcohol to the mix is okay.

I'm curious what kind of setup they're selling there, looks like some kind of jimcrackery to use supercharger pressure to equalize the storage tank, but from there I'm stymied.

 

[96blacktalon]

well, as far as the HP gains, i dunno. if it did allow them to add some timing without having to worry about detonation, then i can understand more gains than just that of the cooler intake charge. but, 90 is a lot for any car. did you read the article that went with it? they did state that they had to retune for all those gains, and who's to say that wasn't several hours worth of tuning??? but for the price of a DSMlink and one of those, all total maybe 800 bucks, anywhere over 50 HP at the wheels would be a lot of bang for the buck. thanks for the input. anybody else? anybody else seen anything like this from another company? apart from the powered ones such as those from cooling mist...

jeff

 

[kutschca]

I'm curious about this setup. The reason that the other systems have a high pressure pump is to make the water/alcohol form a fine mist when coming out of the nozzle, which seems to be best for this type of setup. With this setup, I'm not sure how they get any pressure behind the mix to spray it in the intake. I would like to find out in more detail about how this system works.

As for the hp gains, they are a bit much, but if they were done on a supercharged mustang that did not have any intercooler or aftercooler setup originally, then they're not completely out of the question.

 

[96blacktalon]

Good point about the un-cooled supercharged part. I suppose on an application that was already cooled to some degree, it would have to be significantly less. as far as the pressure for the spray, it's done by vaccuum created in the intake pipe by the turbo/supercharger when in spools. and as Defiant pointed out, i think it has a return pressure line to keep air pressure within the tank even so that it's easier to draw the liquid out. also, your point about the fine mist seems pretty relevant too. hmmm? maybe i'll have to get on a mustang sight to see if anybody's got more info on this. thanks.

jeff

 

[kutschca]

I've considered water/alcohol injection in my car, and still may do it in the future. Just about every kit I've seen uses a high pressure pump for the water/alky mix. I don't think it would be very effective without this, because instead of having a clean mist that will blend evenly with the air, you will have air, and then dribbles of water running inside your intake/intercooler pipes. This kit may have a way to remedy this problem, but they don't really go into detail how it works. It seems to me that just using the intake pressure alone would not be enough to effectively mist the water through a nozzle.

 

[86MCSS]

I was already considering trying this for my car. I just wanted to see how it would work. Its basically a water tank and lines with check valves so it does not suck water/alky into the engine under vacuum and only allows it into the engine under boost. I wasnt to sure though how or if the water/alky would even mist or just drizzle out?

 

[Jehu]

I could see two scenarios
1. It looks like the contraption is just gravity fed. The container is pressurized to allow the water to flow into the charge air pipe. Atomization? Fergitaboutit. Bad idea.
2. The pressurized bottle sprays pre-supercharger. Might not damage a roots type, much, but will definately damage a centrifugal type supercharger.

Bottom line, to feed enough water/alcohol in there to achieve the claimed HP output, w/o adequate pressure for atomization, is a bad idea. Most single phase nozzles require at least 40psi dp to create adequate atomization.

 

[kutschca]

I finally read the article they link to about the product. Their tests were done on a mustang that was mostly a drag car. It was running a centrifugal supercharger at 17lbs of boost without any sort of intercooler/aftercooler setup. Mr. Freeze gets installed in the intake track in front of the blower and uses the suction to pull the mix out of the tank.

I do not think this would work on our cars. I have heard of people running water injection before the turbo in order to have the turbo atomize the mixture, but we have one big problem with that - the intercooler. If you try to send a mixture of air and water/alky through an intercooler it will likely seperate the air and fuel and you will just have water/alky dripping through your intercooler pipes and eventually making it up to your intake. That's not really the way that water injection is supposed to work.

My advice is that this product may work well for supercharged or turbo applications without an intercooler/aftercooler, but for our cars your best bet is to save up and get a proper water injection system with a high pressure pump.

 

[ken inn]

you are partially correct. that large container is an accumulator. the supercharger pressurizes the accumulator, and forces the liquid into the intake, BEFORE the supercharger. the supercharger atomizes the mix. on a turbo car, this would mean shooting the mix into the compressor. this would instantly turn the mix to steam, and it would cool very nicely. the water/alcohol will NOT separate. the downside is that it would destroy the blades on the compressor, kinda like sandblasting. i would bet that the supercharger would eventually suffer some damage, too. but drag cars dont care, they go thru engines a lot faster. and, for 170 bucks, you can easily build your own water injection system. use the windshield washer resevoir for supply, shurflo pump(on sale as low as 40 bucks), aquamist nozzle-20 bucks, hobbs switch-30 bucks. then you got some misc stuff, 4mm nylon line, some fittings, relay, and wires. as long as you put the nozzle(s) BEFORE the t/bdy, you dont need no solenoid, or accumulator. wi will up the octane number by as much as 6 points, it will clean the heck out of everything, the tops of the pistons look like new. spark plugs are so clean, i cant tell how they are burning any more. one test showed a 153 deg drop in intake temps, and wi alone was better than a front mount, and a liquid to air intercooler.