magun stage 3 q's ???

[insanewayne]

Hey guys

Hope this isn't an "inapropriate" question. But i've heard alot about www.magnusmotorsports.com, and about thier 4g64 with the 1g 4g63 turbo head on it, I've done alot of research i've done into it, and, it looks nutty...here's my questions

This may be a dumb Q, but on the site it doesnt say what the setup comes with excactly, and i've no luck with feedback through emails.

http://www.magnusmotorsports.com/productdetails.asp?CategoryID=17&SubID=87&CatalogueID=235

theres what im looking at. I'm guessin it come with everything but the turbo, but their sellin a stage 3 head that nets 75hp+ over stock....for 2400 $ so somehow im doubting that the 4g64/4g63 comes with the head

I currently own a 91 laser turbo that i got for 1750$ (CAN), which is a damn good deal..it need a lil bit of work, with should run me about 500$ , then i should be able to get between 4-5000$ for it...with that i plan on buyin a 90-91 talon awd shell with tranny (cuz there's no mitsu here in Canada ), and then with the left over cash and some saved up money, gettin magnus to build me a motor, could u imagne the spool time and larger turbo capabilities with a this setup? ....if u browse around the site, in the achomplishments section, you'll find that there's also a stage 4 head in the works..... i guesse basically what im lookin for is some knowledgeable opinions here, and some suggestions, or info on magus motor sports

Any help here would be greatly appreciated here guys, thanks

wayne

OH, and P.S it says there, for that 4g64/4g63, that it can produce 800 hp + !!, is this for real....man i need to go change my boxers..........

 

[insanewayne]

shit, sorry for the double post, could a mod delete this one, thanks

wayne

 

[DCJ98GST]

You are correct. For that price you only get the shortblock; the head is sold separately. Look into getting the Long rod option. I have done some research on them and may be worth the extra $200.

 

[insanewayne]

hmm okay, do u know the advantages/disadvantages of the long rod option, does it just give better rod angles?, for higher revving? does this affect torque? ...or wouldnt a longer rod theoretically be slightly weaker? or does that not matter cuz of the improved angle...oh and hey , i know magnus is based in canada, but on the home page there is a Canadian flag and an American flag in the top right corner, and the canadian flag is faded, so im guessin these are US funds?....if so .... **** cuz im lookin at least 10 g's for what i was plannin on buyin.... :thumbdown

thanks

wayne

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

You are getting way the hell out of your league. Just buiild a fast car on the stock motor.

 

[insanewayne]

why thank you very much, but i think i'll stay way the hell out of my league and learn, these are future plans, and thats why im asking questions....are my questions directed towards your "league" of motor tech? if so , then how did u get there? by learning?.....hmmm...so i think thats what ill do, and learn, but thanks alot for that insight, very helpful

wayne

P.S i've dont some reading now about rod/storke ratios, so hopefully, with some more education, i'll be in that "league" to know what kinda set up i want when the time comes.

 

[rarson]

A larger rod/stroke ratio decreases the angle of the rod, placing less side load on the pistons and allowing a higher rev limit. There's more to it than just that, but it requires a lot more explanation from someone better versed than me. Basically though, a higher rod/stroke motor will have an easier time sucking in it's own air than a smaller ratio motor (in a N/A setup). I don't think that makes much of a difference though in a turbo application.

If you want to rev it high, you'll want a higher rod/stroke ratio.

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

why thank you very much, but i think i'll stay way the hell out of my league and learn, these are future plans, and thats why im asking questions....are my questions directed towards your "league" of motor tech? if so , then how did u get there? by learning?.....hmmm...so i think thats what ill do, and learn, but thanks alot for that insight, very helpful

wayne

P.S i've dont some reading now about rod/storke ratios, so hopefully, with some more education, i'll be in that "league" to know what kinda set up i want when the time comes.

If your league had anything to do with wanting to be educated you would build the engine yourself, or atleast have it assembled from parts you chose. You can build an identical motor for 2k.

Second, when you say stuff like....This motor can make 800+ hp!....you sound like a tool. Dropped into a stock dsm it would add 20 or 30 hp, but the primary benefit of uilding an engine is strength, not power.

 

[insanewayne]

wow, buddy, your just a ####in loser eh? - but thanks for all the great info

anyways, thats funny, cuz after doin some more reading, and totaling up how much that would cost through magnus, i've decided to build it myself, cuz your right, its cheaper and i would really like to say I built my motor instead of magnus, and learn all the shit that goes along with it, and as far as my 800 hp coment, sorry i wont add any humor to my posts anymore,.....the motor adds 130 lbs of torque, and 50 hp in a comparison to a stock 4g63,.... I wasnt sayin "oh yaye look if i pay this guy some money he'll buy 800 hp in my car ...oooh giddy up guys!!! ", i was just lookin for some input about magnus and thier products and service, and some knowledgeable opinions, but if u cant help me with that, then please feel free to stop posting in this thread.

ok , so does anyone know any good links for doin a 6 bolt 4g64/4g63???, cuz i aint doind a 7, and all the pages ive found are for a 7 into a 2g, and i want the oposite,

thanks guys...

wayne

 

[bigjangin]

you wont get 50hp and 130 ft lbs on your car. They gained this on their race car, which runs 9's.

 

[DSMJim]

Magnus does excellent work and you get what you pay for. Pricing Magnus agains what it costs to do it yourself is not a fair comparison. You will always end up seeing that you can do it cheaper yourself. Its the stuff your gonna pay for because you screwed it up in the beginning that is what costs you more in the long run. Unless you konw EXACTLY what your doing, don't try and bulid a motor yourself. If it was that easy nobody would be able to sell built short blocks beause they are so easy to build. That simply is not the case.

If you buy a 4G64 from Magnus you will not be sorry, the power and potential will definately be there, just be prepared to pay for it when you ask for top notch parts from a Top notch DSM tuner. You gotta pay to play and playing with the big boys ain't cheap...

Magnus always get a from me...

 

[insanewayne]

thank your very much for the informative post, i realize the things u stated, but would still enjoy the challenge of buildin it myself, i'll be takin a automotive tech course in college in this comming year, and would find it a great project, therefore, does anyone know a good site or a list to do this in a 1g, with the 6 bolt?

thanks again dsmtim, i'm still considering doing the block myself, and gettin one of their stage 4 heads, but i really appreciate the reply

wayne

 

[CanadianTSi]

Magnus always get a from me...

The stuff I have seen come outta Magnus gets a big
:thumbdown from me...

A guy I know had a six bolt swap done there and it was just brutal, he had to take it to buschur and have them fix it.

 

[JoeWagon]

If you want vendor opinions, you will most likely find Magnus to be a high quality source for DSM (and other) parts AND info.

I suggest you slow down and learn as you go. IE. run a stock motor into some decent times first. There is no such thing as entering the game and going to the top without knowing your stuff. No hobby/profession is like that. OK, if you want a built 2.4 shortblock, go search for people who run this setup and what they have said about it.

If you are asking questions like "what do i need?", don't be mad when people state the obvious and say you sound like a beginner and you need to stop worrying about supporting 800whp. It's not in your budget, anyway.

 

[bigjangin]

Well said.

I think thats why people were getting on your case, by the way you wrote your post you sound like a beginner(no offense intended) and building a motor is not a task a beginner can handle. But good luck in whatever you do, you'll never learn unless you get your hands dirty sometime.

 

[insanewayne]

yeh, i could see how my post could sound like a begginers post, i guesse i just wanted opinions and it came across wrong... I can't afford to buy a build engine, so im doin it my self...i know a decent amout, I've been readin off this site for 6 months, then finally got my dsm last month, its stock, (besides for free mods which i did the day after i got it), it has a cracked valve cover which im fixin this week, and a hole in the flexpipe. I dont want to come acrodd like a tool, cuz im not, but i've definately found my new passion, and that is engines and cars particularily are dms's. My learnin started off with b16's etc, and i was close to buyin a 90 teg, but then went....wtf....these things are pu$$y POS!!! i dont want to be a all show no go ricer !!! ....then stuumbled across dms's and im in love. I have many friends with shops in the house, cuz i dont , and their all quite knowledgeable. I know which things i need from which motor...but i dont want to do a 7 bolt, F that , so is it only the 95 galants that had a 6 bolt 4g64? or were there others?....and to anyone readin this, please dont take me as some noob gettin all excited, and thinkin im going to throw 800 hp into my car after turnin a few wrenches, i was simply stating the sites claims of 800 hp .

And the reason im not going to upgrade my stock motor is cuz i paid 1750 for the car (CAD), and with 500-1000$ of work ill get 4-5K for it, and i want an AWD platform....therefore no money is going into this car besides the necissary work to get it in mint shape. So i've decided to take my work $ and build up a motor while i take my auto tech class this semester, and then find an AWD rolling chassi...(lookin for a 90 TSI AWD shell with tranny if anyone knows a good place to look) sorry this post is gettin long, but im trying to defend myself of being labeled a tool . I know quite a bit about our cars from this site, and just have yet to get the hands on experience, but with my course comin up, i think it'll all line up perfectly. Oh and my project car i'll be building is for personal enjoyment and street races mainly, considering i live on vancouver island, and the only track is a 1/8 mile, and an hour away ....so im not lookin for 800hp....but in about a year i hope to be pushin 500.....anyways, ill stop now, and thanks to anyone who took the time to read this post......IM NOT A TOOOOOL!!!

thanx

wayne


OH and hey , does anyone know a cheap fix for the hole in my flex pipe??...cuz the 300$ for a new one isnt makin me happy ....and im presuming there necissary, or the car with just vibrate like a pocket rocket eh?...thanks

 

[bigjangin]

Ok I'll give you the benefit of the doubt then. I see you live in B.C. , I'm not too far away(Seattle).

First, I'm guilty of it too but try to type with proper grammar. People will take you more seriously.

Second, I dont know where you are going that is telling you a flex section is $300, my entire stainless steel 3" downpipe was less than that(only $95, gotta love ebay sometimes).

Third, you want a 6 bolt 2.4L. They came in 85-87 galants I believe(g64b?), or the g4cs(the one I prefer, its easier to find and it will definitely bolt up to a dsm tranny) out of 89-91 hyundai sonatas.

 

[insanewayne]

Thanks for the g4cs info, I got my 95 and 85 mixed up , but ill be sure to look for the sonata motor, and for the flex pipe, i've read on here that a member had to pay 195 for his new flex section....so I a guessed approx 300 Canadian would be close to what i'm lookin at, but i've never dealt with Ebay, being being 18 with no credit card doesn't help, But hey, a full 3' DP section for 90$ sounds great, was it in good shape?

That's cool your in seatle , closest DSMer in this site i've found so far . And thanks for the benifit of the doubt

wayne

 

[bigjangin]

no the whole downpipe was 95 dollars. Not just the flex section. It was brand new. There are a few threads about ebay downpipes with pictures on this site.

 

[insanewayne]

Yeh. I knew you meant the hole downpipe, thats why i wrote "full 3" DP" for 90$, but i guesse i shouldn't have added the word "section" in there , i didnt mean flex section, just the hole DP part , my bad, thanks again for the info, and ill be sure to look up those threads right now.

wayne

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

Magnus does excellent work and you get what you pay for. Pricing Magnus agains what it costs to do it yourself is not a fair comparison. You will always end up seeing that you can do it cheaper yourself. Its the stuff your gonna pay for because you screwed it up in the beginning that is what costs you more in the long run. Unless you konw EXACTLY what your doing, don't try and bulid a motor yourself. If it was that easy nobody would be able to sell built short blocks beause they are so easy to build. That simply is not the case.

If you buy a 4G64 from Magnus you will not be sorry, the power and potential will definately be there, just be prepared to pay for it when you ask for top notch parts from a Top notch DSM tuner. You gotta pay to play and playing with the big boys ain't cheap...

Magnus always get a from me...

It is that easy, don't perpetuate myth's of extreme difficulty, and it's the reason people pay 300% too much for engines. I mean, you pay a machine shop to do the machine work and then assembly is just bolts.

 

[insanewayne]

yeh , thats the route i think ill go, i have friends with some good machine shop connections, so i can get a deal on the work there too.

Now, anyone know any good canadian places to find dsm engine parts? or rolling chassi's? ....i've had shit for luck over the net finding anything near me, and the local wreckers on the island dont get alot of dms's.

thanks

wayne

 

[boostedinaz]

It is that easy, don't perpetuate myth's of extreme difficulty, and it's the reason people pay 300% too much for engines. I mean, you pay a machine shop to do the machine work and then assembly is just bolts.

If it is so easy then why aren't there more people doing it??? There are alot of factors that make it more complicated than just putting a few bolts together. If you dont have a good machine shop then no matter what you do it will fail. In AZ there is only one machine shop with a torque plate for a 4G63. With out that how are you going to compensate for the bores being out of round when you bolt the head on??? What happens if they order the pistons with the wrong pin height and your pistons dont fit right??? There are alot of factors that need to be checked. Then if all that is right how are you going to make sure that all the clearances are right when you get it home after it has been shipped and moved around?? You are going to doubel check before final assembly right?? With plastigauge?? I hope not. I have been into cars for along time and for a daily driver I could put together a small block and make it run, but I wouldnt even attempt to build a race motor, let alone a hybrid with forged components.

Since it is just that simple how many motor have you assembled and had run for a few thousand miles???

Michael

 

[Topper348]

I agree with boostedinaz

One of the things you are purchasing from one of these great shops is knowledge.

Take your block down to the machine shop and start talking to them about performance and ask them their opinion about your planned setup.

Most race engines require some pretty specific clearances based on level of boost and/or use of nitrous. Go see how many local shops have a torque plate for a 4G63(or G4CS as the case may be). If your looking to rebuild a stock motor, go ahead you should be ok. I can do that. But personally, I am going to let a reputable shop build my 6-bolt 2.4L G4CS block. The reason isnt because i cannot bolt an engine together, but because:

1. There is not a fully equipped race shop that has tons of experience.
2. There is no machine shop locally that can do all the special things it takes to build a solid G4CS race motor. (Im not saying they dont have the machines, but the know how and knowledge specificall with DSM's)
3. If the block is somehow miraculously screwed up, then they will normally do whatever it takes to correct it. In other words, you wont have to eat another $1000+ in machine costs and larger pistons (talking from experience)


Not only that, but you have an engine that was built by the best machines, and some knowledgable guys. Also you dont have to cross your fingers when the time comes to turn the key.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[insanewayne]

I definately hear what you guys are sayin, and I do agree, but i can't afford 10 K for a motor (CAN)...And i'd love to have the experience of trying to do this. And i really want to start learning more, and get into performance tuning, After I finish the auto tech certificate i'm takin in sept, which is only a year long, ill have my auto tech certificate, and a year of my apprentiship done. And then i plan on pursuing performance tuning engines etc. So...i know a decent amount of stuff from reading this site, but does anyone have a good link to some need-to-know info before i tackle this project. Like formulas, for clearances depending on boost and nitrous - ( Topper348 ) ? or any other good articles about machining used block for engine building, etc etc... OR just anything to help me get started, ...dont worry i'm doin a search right now, but any help or links would be great.

thanks guys

wayne