2G Looking for advice & suggestions on planned 2g build

[r6speed]

Hoping for your expert opinions & suggestions on my planned build. Any and all advice is greatly appreciated!

Specifically need help with wastegate setup (just use the stock MHI 16g wastegate?), boost control (suggestions?), and speed density setup (use ecmlink cable with speed density GM kit or just use the speed density kit for 2g without ecmlinks speed density cable? Use 5 bar AEM sensor instead of omni that the speed density kit comes with?)

I'm looking for a clean reliable build, nothing crazy. Hoping for ~20psi boost. Most important to me is reliability.

The site won't let me update my current mods and/or wishlist, so here it is.

Current modifications:
-1g BOV recirculated (not crushed)
-apexi N1 down pipe and exhaust (3")
-FMIC (ebay)
-KN Air filter with ebay intake pipe
-14b turbo, wastegate, and oem 2g O2 housing
-Stainless turbo oil feed line
-ARP head studs

Planned modifications:
-255 walbro fuel pump
-STM fuel pump rewire
-1000cc FIC injectors
-Fuel lab FPR & fuel filter
-MHI big 16g turbo
-FP exhaust manifold with heat blanket
-ACT 2100 clutch

-ECMLink V3 (already have socketed Eprom ECU, not installed yet)
-Speed density setup (planning to buy speed density cable from ecmlink and then use the GM speed density kit, thoughts?)

I've been out of the dsm world for several years. The car was gone through by English Racing in Washington several years back (about 10k miles or so ago). They did the ARP head studs while replacing head gasket, timing belt, water pump, valve seats, etc.
The car currently has about 95k original miles or so. Sitting on 17 wheels, New raybestos calipers, rotors, and pads. New Michelin pilot tires and oem suspension.

The car purrs like a kitten and runs great. The only current problem is boost creep (to be expected with 3" exhaust, stock O2 housing, no tuning, and no porting on turbo or O2).

I'm curious if you guys agree with my parts list above for my goals and if there is anything you would change or suggest? Also hoping for help on anything else I am missing?

I plan on installing these parts and then trailering the car to an experienced tuner to finish it up.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Vegas Smith]

I would run the Ingersol-rand boost solenoid. Slightly more difficult to dial in but gives you better control over the boost than a manual one. Either hardwire in the new sensors or if you aren't good with wiring then get the ecmlink extension. Absolutely do not buy an omni map sensor. Get a GM 3 bar or if you want to hardwire in an AEM 3.5bar map then that's good too. If you're wanting to stick with a 16g then maybe consider an evo3 exhaust manifold. All of your fuel system depends on whether you want to run e85 or not but with a 16g you can get really far on the stuff you've picked.

 

[r6speed]

Thank you Vegas Smith.
I will look into the Ingersol-rand boost solenoid.
I think I'll go ahead and hardwire an AEM map sensor. Should I get the 3.5 bar or the 5 bar? I was previously told 5 bar from another member on here...

I want to run pump gas, not planning on e85 and would prefer to stick with the 16g.
Is the Evo3 exhaust manifold a direct bolt on to the 7-bolt? I think I've seen those for even less money than the FP manifold (but used), so I'm up for that option if it's a better choice.

Thanks again!

 

[Vegas Smith]

Well, the reason I say the 3.5bar is that will get you up to 34ish psi of boost. Either sensor is fine (I've ran both) but there is potential for the 5 bar to have worse resolution. I didn't experience that but I've read others have.
The evo3 manifold should provide better spoolup on a 16g based on testing that people have done. If you already have an fp manifold then no big deal.

 

[r6speed]

Ok that's good information, I'll go with the 3.5 bar.

I don't have the manifold yet, but from what I am reading it seems the Evo manifold would be better for the big 16g because of the sizing/connection from the manifold to the turbo (7cm instead of 6cm).
What about using an FP manifold for an Evo such as this? Or should I stick with an OEM Evo manifold?

Forced Performance Race Manifold: Mitsubishi EVO 4-9 & with Ceramic Coating + Porting

The new FP manifold for the EVO4-9 features 20% larger runners and collector entry angles that would make a tubular header blush. Durable high temperature alloy to resist cracking and compatibilty with the original factory heat shield are features that everyone can appreciate! In house testing...

www.extremepsi.com

Thoughts on this approach?

Can you confirm this is the 3.5 bar sensor you would choose?

AEM Stainless Steel MAP/PSIa Sensor: 50 PSIa / 3.5 Bar

Absolute (PSIa) Pressure Sensors AEM offers high quality stainless steel PSIa sensors in 15 (1BAR), 30 (2BAR), 50 (3.5BAR), and 75 (5BAR). PSIa is referenced to absolute zero. Absolute zero is the pressure measurement when all the pressure exerted by the atmosphere has been removed. The most...

www.extremepsi.com

Suggestions on where to get wiring pigtail for this sensor?

Thanks!

 

[Vegas Smith]

That's an evo4-9 manifold and wont work. That map sensor is the correct one I'm taking about. Just search aem map sensor pigtail and you'll find it. If you want to save some money I have my old used one with pigtail.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

Ok that's good information, I'll go with the 3.5 bar.

I don't have the manifold yet, but from what I am reading it seems the Evo manifold would be better for the big 16g because of the sizing/connection from the manifold to the turbo (7cm instead of 6cm).

The stock 2g or EVO exhaust manifold has smaller runners than the FP unit, which will provide faster spoolup. The 6cm/7cm designation refers to the volute size of the turbine housing. The larger the number, the more top end power it will support, but at a cost of slower spool up

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

So here's what I'd do. Goto autozone or rock auto and buy a brand new oem replacement and port match it. I think the last time I bought one is was 130$ from autozone with a warranty. I ported it myself and havent had any cracking issues.

I totally agree with @Vegas Smith though. don't buy a omni sensor. All I see is bad post about them.

 

[r6speed]

Ok thanks for clearing that up.
I'm struggling to find the part number for the oem evo III exhaust manifold, does anyone have that number by chance?
I'm not finding an oem 2g exhaust manifold anywhere. Rockauto has an 'ATP' brand and autozone has 'Dorman' brand. Is Dorman the original manufacturer for the 2g manifold? I've had good luck with Dorman parts in the past...
I have Zero experience with porting (but I do have the tools to do it), so I'm not sure this would be the best option for me...
I honestly don't even fully understand what I would be porting to be completely honest...
If I'm understanding this correctly, I should probably use a factory 2g manifold and leave it at 6cm (no porting) to prevent lag.
NoSlo2PTO would you agree with this statement?
Since I'm only trying to run 20 psi, the porting seems like it would cause unnecessary boost lag?
Also, since the 16g is 7cm and the oem 2g manifold is 6cm, should I be using the 2g 6cm gasket or the Evo III 7cm gasket?

Also, do I have to buy the whole speed density kit even though I won't be using the Omni or is there a way to buy just the IAT and the bung for the MAP sensor?

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

Yeah so I used Dorman. And your not going to find a brand new evo 3 manifold. I'll post some pics tonight of what part to port to better explain. But I'd just buy the Dorman, port it and be done with it.

Yes you can buy just the iat or just the map sensor.

 

[r6speed]

Awesome thank you Hickory.
I will buy the Dorman.
It sounds like the porting is a very controversial subject on whether it makes things better or worse. From what I understand, it helps utalize full potential of the 16g (more boost), but comes at a cost of some boost lag.
Since I'm not trying to max out the 16g, I wonder if the porting is actually a good idea for my situation.
Either way, I'd love to see your pictures and may end up porting per your suggestion. I'll keep researching this controversial subject.
Thanks I really appreciate the help!

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

Yeah I wouldn't hog out the runners or anything crazy. Just make the port on the turbo side of the manifold to 7cm and remove the lip on the inside or any casting errors if there is any. On the Dorman if I remember correctly only thing I had to do was port the turbo side. I'll be home in about an hour I got ya.

 

[r6speed]

You rock Hickory, much appreciated!

So it sounds like I'll need a 7cm gasket (originally for evo 3) rather than a 6cm gasket (originally for 2g)?
Is that correct?

Can I use my original 2g O2 housing or will I need one from an Evo III?
Should I port the O2 housing as well (specifically the wastegate side of the O2)?

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

No problem welcome to help anytime. Yes you can use the original 2g o2 housing that's what I use atleast on 16g/20g combos. If I do port the o2 housing it's the outlet where the downpipe connects. Just so there's not a funnel like point in the exhaust. Also yes just buy a 7cm gasket And you'll be set.

Now if there is enough meat on the wastegate flapper hole I'd recommend making it a little bigger. Not anything crazy though.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

As I said before, the 6cm/7cm is only referring to the volute of the turbine housing. It has NOTHING to do with the size of the hole where it mates up to the exhaust manifold. The only porting you do on the exhaust manifold is to match the gasket (called port matching). You also remove the step on the manifold. Get an SS mitsu gasket from one of the vendors.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

Can I use my original 2g O2 housing or will I need one from an Evo III?
Should I port the O2 housing as well (specifically the wastegate side of the O2)?

The EVO III O2 housing is clocked slightly different than the OEM 1g/2g O2 housing. You will have to cut the flange off your downpipe and reclock it for the EVO III housing. Just use the 2g o2 housing.

The goals for my old car were strictly for top end power. But I was running an OEM 2G exhaust manifold and 2G O2 housing, and I ran mid 10’s in the 1/4 mile, using a bolt on turbo. Both units were ported.

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

Here is the stock 2g manifold and the 2g Dorman manifold with a port match job.

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[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

@NOSLO2PT0 then why is there a 6cm and 7 cm gasket? Lol

 

[dustyboner]

Im pretty sure the evo 3 o2 housing (dp side) has the studs space to far apart to use on a stock down pipe. I'll have to go check

Its like 4 or 4.10" on center for the stud spacing

I have a 1g manifold for a 13g turbo. If you look at it, any other manifold will seem awesome.

 

[r6speed]

Ok got it.
Thank you Hickory I really appreciate the pictures!

I'll go with the Dorman 2g exhaust manifold and port to match the 7cm gasket.
I'll also plan on slightly porting my original 2g O2 housing.

I've seen the AEM MAP sensor installed in a couple different locations.
1) on the throttle body elbow (intake manifold side of BOV)
2) on the Intercooler pipe below the BOV (Intercooler side of BOV)
Any suggestions on which is better? I'm thinking it should go on the throttle body elbow? Is that correct?

Now for some tuning questions.
It seems I can monitor and/or log boost and AFR with ECMLink V3, so is it necessary to have any additional monitoring gauges such as boost, EGTs, or air/fuel in the car? Do I need a wideband LC-2? If I do need them, any suggestions on brands and which I should have?
I have a boost gauge and a water temp gauge now, but I'd prefer delete them and keep the interior as stock looking as possible (going for the super clean look here).

Thanks again for all the help!!

 

[dustyboner]

i think boost, AF and oil pressure are good to have in a pillar pod. That way you can always see them.
If you overboost, start running to lean or your oil pressure gets too low you can shut it down before anything gets hurt.
also setting the CEL to flash if your getting knock is also good. there is a setting in link for that .

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

So I'd recommend a innovate mtxl wideband. It works really good with ecmlink when wired in. And your map sensor will be your boost monitoring on ecmlink as well. So I'd just get rid of the gauges and just keep a wideband gauge.

Map sensor placement I'd just run it off the intake manifold with a short piece of hose.

 

[r6speed]

Is this the wideband you are suggesting?

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Here is the one ECMLink suggests:

ECMTuning, Inc.

www.ecmtuning.com

Also on Amazon it appears, can't tell for sure it is the same model # as ECMLink:

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Or should I go for something like this?

EXTREME PSI : Your #1 Source for In Stock Performance Parts

 

[Hickory-NC-2Ggsx]

Yeah the problem is aem stuff doesn't play well with ecmlink. It's harder to get ecmlink to read the same as the gauge.

 

[r6speed]

Ok got it, so stick with the one ECMLink offers (link above) or the MTX-L model?

Thoughts on using this for air/fuel, boost monitoring, and boost control?

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And this for oil pressure & temperature?

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