Intercoolers: Apexi or Greddy

[Boosted98gsx]

Spearco 2-178 for 2g-b's

 

[DCJ98GST]

Anybody like the intercoolers from DSM-Performance?

Top-bottom configuration with short routed piping.

http://www.dsm-performance.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=59

 

[jayntguru]

DSM-P
I took a look at a DSM-P intercooler about a year ago, it sucked. They have changed hands now, so I have no idea if the "kit" is any better.

Greddy (addl info from what I posted earlier):
I went 119.7 MPH on mine in a full weight 2G, fastest guy on the turbo I ran by a few MPH, too.

No overheating problems at all related to the IC. I ran both stock fans, nothing fancy. That's in GA 90+ degree 90+ humidity weather.

 

[DCJ98GST]

Originally posted by jayntguru
DSM-P
I took a look at a DSM-P intercooler about a year ago, it sucked. They have changed hands now, so I have no idea if the "kit" is any better.

Why do you think that it sucked? I am curious b/c I was thinking of buying this.

 

[jayntguru]

I'm making a list:

Upper IC pipe is only one piece, you have to pull the bumper to pull the upper pipe.

Upper IC pipe squeezes one side of the upper coolant hose.

Their cast intake squeezes the other half of the upper coolant hose if it is installed.

Welds were not that good looking.

IC was hanging down too low.

IC was "mounted" with sheet metal screws.

Bottom end tank blocks most of air passage through IC.

This particular unit was installed by DSM-P back in the day.

Again, this was a year ago, maybe a little more. Things could have changed, but if its the same kit, RUN away. Anything mentioned here is better than that one.

 

[TellschAWD]

Originally posted by got traction?
get an IRC fmic.

IRC all the way...

Brian

 

[larryd]

I agree. IRC any day over the Greddy or Apexi, if your buying new then do it right the first time.

 

[focusedrage]

where do i get those? do they come with pipes? and will the fill the opening in a bomex kit (the one with the lights)

 

[FourG63 97GST]

http://www.indyracecores.com/

 

[greentrbo_95gst]

email [email protected] about the whole kit and pricing. He works for prostreet industries
www.prostreetonline.com
tell him that i referred by me and i bet you he will beat the price offered by other performance shops
I am usin Spearco 2-216 with 2.5" piping on my car.

 

[SoCaliEclipse]

Originally posted by larryd
I agree. IRC any day over the Greddy or Apexi, if your buying new then do it right the first time.

So whats so incredible about they IRC? Also, I want something that i wont have to modify my I/C location....the IRC looks like it will need a ton of work....or am i just not seeing it right?
Is the Apex a good choice if i want an efficient, but also not too difficult to install FMIC? I will have a fluidyne radiator soon...so i am not too worried about overheating....thanks larry!
Brian

 

[larryd]

the IRC kit uses a Speaco 2-216 core which is one of the best cores on the market. The piping is all 2.5". The piping is as direct as you can get to the throttle body and the turbo.

Thats what makes that kit the best one on the market IMHO..

There are many reasons to use the Greddy or Apexi though. Like it bolts up directly to a T25 style turbo, the piping is all routed so nothing has to be modified. Price is a lil cheaper then the other choices.

 

[GSXTCY]

Here is my T28 cut and welded 130 degrees the opposite direction:

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And here is my FMIC:

 

[SPEEDY]

Originally posted by larryd
I agree. IRC any day over the Greddy or Apexi, if your buying new then do it right the first time.

Ooooh... that's just great Larry now you tell me that . Just curious Larry did you have the Big GReddy fmic on when you made that dyno run of 383whp with your L2R?

 

[larryd]

yes i did.. and note what I said Speedy.. if your buying new I would suggest the IRC kit anyday.. if you are buying used then why not. the greddy core worked fine on my car, i just always want more.

 

[Slow99x]

Is the Apex a good choice if i want an efficient, but also not too difficult to install FMIC? I will have a fluidyne radiator soon...so i am not too worried about overheating....thanks larry!
Brian [/B][/QUOTE]

The A'pexi uses the Delta fin so that cool air can pass through to the radiator. My buddy runs 11s with a stock radiator and this IC.

 

[marksae]

Originally posted by GSXTCY
Here is my T28 cut and welded 130 degrees the opposite direction:

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

And here is my FMIC:

Sucks that you had to lose your foglights like that. The VP fmic kit could have been better if it just ran the piping a little lower and you could have kept your lights. Also, VP could have just used a 90 degree bend as the first bend in the ic piping since most big turbos have outlets pointing down.

 

[SoCaliEclipse]

The A'pexi uses the Delta fin so that cool air can pass through to the radiator. My buddy runs 11s with a stock radiator and this IC. [/B][/QUOTE]

So it looks like we have one vote there for the Apex...anyone else? If it is true that this one doesnt have any prob with overheating it might be the way to go....anyone else have an opinion about yes/no on the apex? and also, does anyone know where and how much i should expect if i pick one up?
keep in mind that i am looking for a direct bolt-on...no cutting of the turbo or anything like that (no offense Nick....i dont have the guts to do stuff like that....), very functional, and good looking FMIC....
thanks guys
Brian

 

[99GST]

a Do-it-yourself FMIC from Road Race Engineering. Go to their website, and click on the Do-It-Yourself parts. Order the Griffen I/C Side to Side Core. Mine is 24x10x2.75, which is large enough for most applications. Then order the HKS end tanks from them too. For a kick ass FMIC I paid $340+$70+$80 = $490.00. Then have a shop build you the pipes and install it yourself. Bam. you have an excellent FMIC which cools better than the GReddy and Apexi, cheaper than the rest, and will put u pa good fight against some of the Spearco cores out there.

Here is the link: click here

Now, if you are going hardcore and all out with LARGE turbo then get the IRC and be done.

Later.
Nathan

 

[SPEEDY]

Originally posted by larryd
yes i did.. and note what I said Speedy.. if your buying new I would suggest the IRC kit anyday.. if you are buying used then why not. the greddy core worked fine on my car, i just always want more.

Larry you know I'm just giving you a hard time. It's all good brother ! I think my big GReddy fmic is pretty darn killer, and should be suffice enough for me for quite sometime. I do agree with you that the IRC is by far one of the best units out there. The VP fmic is killer also, but I don't like the idea of losing my fog lights. Later!!

 

[DCJ98GST]

Why doesnt anybody go with the top-bottom set up with the endtanks on opposite sides? It is known to be a much better cooling setup than on the same side.

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/intercoolers.htm

Check out the Spearco Intercooler Assemblies box

2-221 In and Out on Opposite Sides = $590

They say it is for the GVR-4 but it should work on our cars as well. Pipes would be custom from RRE.

I think this set up would cool as efficiently as the side to sides but with much less pressure drop.

This is a must read before you buy an intercooler!

http://www.are.com.au/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm

From the link under configuration:

"In our initial testing, 80% of charge air used end 25% of core at 264 cfm @ 25" water. Just turning bottom tank around makes a big difference !"

That is the problem with top-bottom coolers is that the air takes the shortest path and uses the first 25% of the core. If the endtanks are on opposite sides all paths are the same length and the air will be equally distributed along the core! Makes sense to me.

The only thing I dont like about the IRC setup is the square end tanks would create pressure drop and hinder flow. They talk about square endtanks on the link.

 

[TellschAWD]

The only thing I dont like about the IRC setup is the square end tanks would create pressure drop and hinder flow. They talk about square endtanks on the link.

You sure this would fall into the square end tank category?

 

[DCJ98GST]

I was more looking at the 2G set up.

http://www.indyracecores.com/2ginstall.html

But even that end tank set up in your post does not help smooth air flow. Just thing of it as being the air that is moving at 300 ft/sec and slaming against the wall of the endtank as it enters before turning 90deg to enter the core. Then it has all those square edges in the other directions to get caught up in.

The apex endtanks look better as they are directed straight towards the core and any 90deg bends are smooth and are in the pipes.

http://www.apexi-usa.com/intake_gtintercooler.asp

Here is another quote from the link above:

"A street car is not in high boost that much of the time (maybe 10% max.- or no licence, no tyres!), and for possibly 50% of the time in vacuum, with maybe another 30% at less than 5psi boost, so the engine operates as a naturally aspirated engine for approximately 70% of it's life. Now, how many hundreds of hours a year do the Group A Supercar teams spend on the flow bench trying to find even a half a percent increase in flow? A square edge tank can easily cause a 20 percent drop in flow, at low boost driving !! Some people confuse the result of poor tank/pipe design with turbo lag, when it actually may have little or nothing to do with the turbo's performance. "

 

[jayntguru]

Regarding square end tanks:

Ever looked inside the tubes of an intercooler? They aren't smooth. There's probably a reason for that...