ECMlink Idle and Cruise tune, critics welcome

[talonsteve25]

This is my first time with link and tune on the new set up, just want some advise on how my logs look. Both idle and cruise attached, and i threw in a log of me messing around seeing a tiny bit of knock. Thanks

 

[motozachl]

idle and cruise look really good! man i'm so jealous i want v3 so bad just to have more tuning points

 

[yukiz]

airflow per rev a bit high, adjust your tps to .63v at idle. make sure throttle position sits at 0% at idle. also, you want to log LTFT Mid, LTFT Low, idle switch, and isc position. after all these, make another idle log.

 

[talonsteve25]

New idle log, fixed tps and lowered airflow per rev my car is auto so it should be a bit higher then a standard. I dont have a working ISC, or one at all so i did no log it. And i included a WOT pull that i need some advice on.

 

[DSMer541]

wow that is alot of knock.... I would go to your da timing table and pull the 5500 rpm 1.8-3.4 load cells from 13* to 12*, and then 6000 rpm from 16* down to 13* degrees .... basically pull 1*degree at 5500 rpm and 3* degrees at 6k up.....

also you need a logging Wideband that I can see, other wise I dont know what your AFR is... which is extremely important.

 

[crazyquik22023]

I agree with the above post. Log you wideband so we can see what AFR's you are really seeing. But I would try at first pull a degree or two of timing using the timing sliders from the 5500-7000 rpm range.

 

[talonsteve25]

Im not to sure how to log my wide band? I do have it hooked up to simulate a narrow band and wired to my ecu. I watched it through the pull and it stayed at a constant 10.8 - 10.5 which seems a bit rich. Boost estimate is dead on and a/f ratio estimate is close under a pull and dead on cruising. Ill go ahead and pull some timing from 5500 up by tracking the log. What about fuel wise? Do i need to touch any of the sliders?

 

[crazyquik22023]

Im not to sure how to log my wide band? I do have it hooked up to simulate a narrow band and wired to my ecu. I watched it through the pull and it stayed at a constant 10.8 - 10.5 which seems a bit rich. Boost estimate is dead on and a/f ratio estimate is close under a pull and dead on cruising. Ill go ahead and pull some timing from 5500 up by tracking the log. What about fuel wise? Do i need to touch any of the sliders?

10.5-10.8 is pretty rich. You probably want to shoot closer to 11.5-11.8 which is still pretty conservative. So lower your fuel sliders a few steps from where you start seeing the rich afr's then go do a pull and see where your at. As for your W.B. where do you have it wired into? You don't have it selected anywhere in the ECU inputs tab. So select where you have your W.B. wired to then go to a log and go to captured values and capture RawlinWB.

 

[talonsteve25]

Ok ill pull some timing and fuel and go for another pull, so percent wise how much fuel do you estimate i should pull? Im not sure how sensitive the sliders are. And another thing if im looking for more boost i would turn it up first then tune accordingly correct? I have my wideband wired into pin76, the front o2 sensor and through the simulated narrow band wire the wb has, would i still be able to log it?

 

[crazyquik22023]

Ok ill pull some timing and fuel and go for another pull, so percent wise how much fuel do you estimate i should pull? Im not sure how sensitive the sliders are. And another thing if im looking for more boost i would turn it up first then tune accordingly correct? I have my wideband wired into pin76, the front o2 sensor and through the simulated narrow band wire the wb has, would i still be able to log it?

Try dropping all necessary fuel sliders 5% and see where that puts you. Just drop the necessary timing sliders by 1 deg. If your doing more boost yes turn it up first then tune what you need to. I have my wideband wired to the front o2 also. Just go into ECU Inputs and where it says Wideband at the bottom choose Front o2. And on the top where it says front o2 select your wideband. Then go to a log, right click, select captured values, select Raw values, select RawlinWB.

 

[DSMer541]

I wouldent go too far over 11:1 AFR on pump gas.... My setup likes more fuel, I go from about 10.8 falling to 10.5 AFR @ 26 psi, any less fuel than that and I have to pull timeing beacause of knock, wich lowers the power curve..... I would leave the AFR were its at, turn up the boost to were you want it, then adjust timing accordingly, then pull some fuel if neccesary or even add fuel if needed.... every car is different, but remember this- the key to making power is more timing and more fuel.... and of-coarse more boost, .....

 

[crazyquik22023]

I wouldent go too far over 11:1 AFR on pump gas.... My setup likes more fuel, I go from about 10.8 falling to 10.5 AFR @ 26 psi, any less fuel than that and I have to pull timeing beacause of knock, wich lowers the power curve..... I would leave the AFR were its at, turn up the boost to were you want it, then adjust timing accordingly, then pull some fuel if neccesary or even add fuel if needed.... every car is different, but remember this- the key to making power is more timing and more fuel.... and of-coarse more boost, .....

I agree that running richer is always more safe, but I think 10.5 is very rich. I personally can maintain an 11.6-11.8 AFR while on 28 psi on 93. I have no knock at all and I also have added a few degrees of timing. Don't get me wrong if the O.P. takes away some fuel and starts seeing knock then by all means add more fuel and run as rich as you want. I am just saying it would be better to shoot for an AFR in the 11's if you can.

 

[talonsteve25]

Took another log today after pulling some timing and it took all knock away at around 25 psi, havent touched fuel sliders yet though still running in the 10.5-10.8 range and it felt strong. I probly will take some fuel away if my new log looks ok or add more boost. Also i tryed finding the RawlinWB under the raw values but i couldnt find it i just found 2 options for front o2 so i tryed logging one of them hopefully its correct. And the end of the log i blew off the bc line so it shot up to 30 psi, with a bit of knock but i got that fixed.

 

[snowborder714]

Was this a 2-3 gear pull? If so, could you just get a straight 3rd gear pull from 2k to redline?

I'd suggest:
-go into the ALS/Knock tab and set the knock sensor control to about 2500 RPM and 25%+ TPS.
-go into the Dash tab and change the Knock CEL to 2.
-check your DTC tab as you have a few codes thrown.

Are you still running the stock 7 bolt engine?

You couldn't find the raw value because you don't have your wideband input saved in ECMlink. Go to the ECU Inputs tab and insert the proper values to the right of what input you chose. What color wire(s) from the LC-1 do you have input to the ECU? I'm going to guess the yellow wire since you mentioned using narrowband sim, but don't see that activated through the software.

 

[talonsteve25]

It was first, second and third, third was the last one when the line popped off, but ill get all that cleared up fix the wide band issue and get another log.

The codes were the o2 sensors since the back one is gone and front is the wb sensor, and two random ones i wasn't sure about maybe i removed them for what ever reason.

The motor is a 7 bolt but its built, mods in profile, and yeah its the yellow wire thats wired in.

 

[snowborder714]

Get a 3rd gear only pull.

The yellow wire is the wrong wire if you want to log the wideband, but the correct one if you want to use the LC-1's built in narrowband sim. I'd suggest reprogramming the yellow wire to output a wideband signal and then use ECMlink's built in narrowband sim.

 

[talonsteve25]

Or couldn't i just run the brown wide band wire to the rear o2 sensor wire on the ecu?

"Scott McIntyre provided the following information on our user support forums for his install of the LC1 into the front O2 sensor bung. He uses the kit's narrowband output (analog 1) to drive the front O2 input for closed loop operation and then feeds the kit's analog 2 output to the rear O2 input on the ECU for datalogging wideband A/F ratio. The following are pictures he posted of his install procedure."

I say that because I'm sure id have to go on a hunt to find the lc-1 software.

EDIT: And its hard to get a 3rd gear pull my cars auto so I'm guessing it'll just down shift.

 

[talonsteve25]

Ok this is as good as it gets so far as far as my logs go, this was in drive from 3k to red line, i took some fuel and more timing away and bumped up the boost to 28 psi to get to this point.

I also did what snowboarder said. I still havent had the chance to log the wb unfortunitly, but i DID get the afratioest basiclly dead on to my wide band as i watched it through the intire pull. Boost estimate is also now dead on.

The issue is still knock of course there is alot in this log, I have a feeling the fuel around here isnt helping. I think i need to adjust my global fuel telling from the log and the way i moved the sliders, but again i need advice on that as im still learning. Also i pulled more timing which needs to be reviewed. And if nothing else i can turn down the boost and wait untill i get a meth kit or something.

 

[snowborder714]

The global fuel % should never be adjusted. You set it once for the injectors you're running at that's it. Deadtime on the other had can be adjusted to make sure you get CombinedFT and AirFlowPerRev in check at idle.

As for your knock, that is a lot. I would start by turning the boost down, maybe around 24psi.

I also believe you need some MAF adjustment from about 4500 RPM on up. Your AFRatioEst lines up with your MaxOct DA table up until there, but then the AFRatioEst drops down in the 10's while according to the table you should be in the mid 9's. This will be easier to tell once you get your wideband logged and can view the wideband and AFRatioEst lines side by side.

 

[talonsteve25]

Yeah it doesnt line up with the MaxOct table because i adjusted the fuel sliders in that range by taking away 10% it lined up before i did that. I know you can adjust by the table or the sliders and everyone said the sliders were easier.

 

[Calan]

...everyone said the sliders were easier.

But not the best way to get a good tune.

The sliders apply to all load values based on a throttle percentage, and are a hold-over from earlier versions when that's all there was.

You should use the DA tables to set a target AFR for each RPM/load point, and then calibrate your airflow (MAFComp) until you can hit those target values repeatedly.

This is assuming your global fuel and deadtime are set correctly for your base fuel pressure, injector size, and type of fuel.

 

[snowborder714]

Doh, I thought I looked at the sliders and saw them at 0. Must've confused that with something else.

They are easier...to an extent. A slider will adjust fuel in the RPM range for all engine loads, whether very little or a lot. The table will give you control of fuel by load and RPM, which is much more accurate.


Edit: Oh no, the old man beat me!!

 

[Calan]

First time for everything...

 

[talonsteve25]

So basically the sliders are kind of hack, like an safc. And i thought using both the timing and fuel tables would be better since they have the load factor as well.

So just to make sure iv finally got this, i would change my MaxOct DA table values to what i would like to see during a pull, half pull, ect, then move the MaftComp sliders, in the specific air flow ranges, untill i see that my logged wb values are matching the table values?

So moving the sliders up would richen and moving the sliders down would lean as far as the MaftComp sliders would go correct?

Btw thanks for the help guys.

 

[Calan]

Correct on all accounts....except you'll want to adjust the MAFComp to get fuel trims lined up during closed loop, and match your DA AFR values during WOT (open loop). Use the MAFComp wizard in ECMLink to help with the closed loop adjustments.

Make sure your fuel settings are correct first though, and then don't mess with them again unless you change type of fuel, injectors, etc.