help me fix the BEAST

[BoBbOrAzE]

... and by beast I mean my 1990 1.8 liter 92hp eclipse. I am currently trying to get it to run and I have been reading through the numerous similar posts so far yet still no luck. If someone could help me out it would be greatly appreciated. As the story goes the previous owner was driving the vehicle, it suddenly died and he pushed it home. He believed that the timing jumped a couple teeth. The engine turns over but does not start.

What I have done so far...

- checked all the fuses
- triple checked the firing order on the distributor cap
- checked for spark (held the plug out to a ground and saw a decent arc)
- checked for fuel (tried to listen for the injector clicks but couldnt hear, disconnected fuel rail and fuel came pouring out. Maybe injectors arent firing? I couldnt find any fuel on the plugs...)
- compression test (176 - 180 -185 - 180 , which leads me to believe with these numbers theres no way the timing could be off to the point where its the reason the car died, or im wrong?)
- checked ecu (there is indeed slight leakage of the capacitors, but from what I have read most of the time when the ecu leaks and dies theres no fuel or spark. And I hear no clicking or smells yet so im guessing its going to die in a couple months)

So im kind of stuck. It has been sitting for 8 months with 1/8th tank of fuel left and I was just about to drain and fill it back up, but I cant see it starting because of that.



I attached some pics of the ecu, the only reason I havent said aw screw it its def the ecu is because with spark, fuel and compression I dont see why it shouldnt at least sputter or chug or anything.

Sorry for the long post and thanks to anyone who helps.

 

[spatulahunter1]

i didnt know he was broken, he seemed to kick alota ass in the new movie.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

ha well I dont think thats going to help get it started, but I just realized I called it the beast and the car happens to be blue just like beast in xmen. hahaa it has a new name

 

[zippyshoe]

Re-install the ECU and see if your car turns-on the check engine light after you try to start it a few times. If you're lucky, it will turn-on the check engine light and store one or more fault codes. If it does, and if you can get access to a scan tool, then you could retrieve the stored fault codes. This would be a great first step in troubleshooting the problem.

 

[Gs Dewd]

That ecu can still be dead. Those caps do look bad. Do you have a friend with a 1.8l car you can try the ecu from?

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

hey thanks, yea first thing I did was look for the check engine light but it doesnt stay on, acts completely normal. Ive started it a bunch of times since I put the ecu back in and I think by now it probably should have come on if it was going to throw a code.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Yea the ecu does look bad but I forgot to mention the bottom of the board is completely clean. Ive been pming a bunch of people trying to find one assuming its maybe causing the engine to spark erratically or not deliver fuel.

no unfortunately I dont know any automatic 1.8ers around where I live.

 

[zippyshoe]

Those capacitors do look pretty unhealthy. If you are getting good fuel and spark, then a couple of other items that could prevent it from starting are a faulty crankshaft angle sensor, or a faulty camshaft angle sensor, although these faults generally produce fault codes.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

I could be completely wrong but I dont believe the 1.8 has either? I mean I know where they are on my gsx but I cant find them on this car nor does it specify them in the manual. hmm

edit: Although its probably going to end up being the ecu, it doesnt look like im getting fuel. I have attempted starting it over and over and when I pull the plug and blot it there is no evidence of fuel.

 

[Gs Dewd]

Yea the ecu does look bad but I forgot to mention the bottom of the board is completely clean. Ive been pming a bunch of people trying to find one assuming its maybe causing the engine to spark erratically or not deliver fuel.

no unfortunately I dont know any automatic 1.8ers around where I live.

You should be able to start it with a ecu from a 5 spd car.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Really? wow if thats true that would definitely increase my chances of finding one. I didnt think so originally because their serial numbers end differently with an "a" for auto and a "m" for manual leading me to believe they wont interchange correctly. But who knows, I will keep a look out for both now.

 

[zippyshoe]

I could be completely wrong but I dont believe the 1.8 has either? I mean I know where they are on my gsx but I cant find them on this car nor does it specify them in the manual. hmm

edit: Although its probably going to end up being the ecu, it doesnt look like im getting fuel. I have attempted starting it over and over and when I pull the plug and blot it there is no evidence of fuel.

Oops... The 1.8L engine might not contain these sensors. You mentioned a distributor cap with your 1.8L, which means the ignition system for the 1.8L differs from the 2.0L which uses a coilpack and the firing of the spark plugs is controlled by the ECU. A faulty injector is still a possibility.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Is there a way to test if an injector is working? Basically I have attempted to do the screwdriver to ear trick to see if its clicking but with all the noise when the car trying to start its difficult to tell. And like I said there are no signs of fuel on the plugs, yet there is fuel in the rail. Maybe I could hook up a voltmeter to one of the injector clips and have someone start the car and I can look for a voltage spike?

and thanks a lot zippyshoe and Gs Dewd, you both definitely got rep points from me

 

[zippyshoe]

One simple item you could check related to the fuel injectors is to measure the resistance of each injector. If you have a service manual or repair manual for that vehicle, there should be a spec for fuel injector resistance. Remove the electrical connector from each injector and, using an ohmmeter, measure the resistance of each injector and verify that each injector is within spec. Even if all injectors measure within spec, this is still no guarantee that the injectors are functioning properly. However, if any injectors fall out of spec, then you should definitely suspect that injector.

 

[steve]

The position sensors are inside the dristributor on a 1.8L as are the coil and PTM.
There is no question that the ECU is bad but some question as to how bad.
There isn't any difference between the manual and automatic 1.8L ECUs. They have the same part number.

1.8L ECUs aren't my speciality so I can't offer any troubleshooting tips other that ask if the car starts if you use starting fluid?

Steve

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Alright well here is the latest.

I noticed that the tachometer needle is spiking up randomly between 0 and 500 when the ignition is turned to on. It could be completely unrelated.

Anyways, so I never even thought about spraying some ether into the throttle body, figured it was mostly helpful for carbureted engines. So I took a can and gave it a shot and the engine started for a second or two! So this leads me to believe that the car must not be getting fuel. Maybe injectors not firing, fuel filter completely clogged, fuel pump bad, ecu not sending fuel... I have no clue. I have some more searching to do now that ive kind of narrowed it down. Thanks!

 

[Gs Dewd]

Alright well here is the latest.

I noticed that the tachometer needle is spiking up randomly between 0 and 500 when the ignition is turned to on. It could be completely unrelated.

Anyways, so I never even thought about spraying some ether into the throttle body, figured it was mostly helpful for carbureted engines. So I took a can and gave it a shot and the engine started for a second or two! So this leads me to believe that the car must not be getting fuel. Maybe injectors not firing, fuel filter completely clogged, fuel pump bad, ecu not sending fuel... I have no clue. I have some more searching to do now that ive kind of narrowed it down. Thanks!

To check whether the feul pump or injectors are the culprit just pull the return line off the rail and cranl the engine over if fuel comes out the pump is working. That will narrow it down to the ecu or injectors. I would see if you can find a friend that has a ecu you can borrow and see if that will fire it up.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Hey, I tested the fuel pump via the test connector and it works fine. I removed the rail itself and plenty of fuel came shooting out. No matter how many times I crank it the plugs stay bone dry. So at this point im pretty sure the injectors arent pulsing... most likely because of the ecu.

I just got a 1.8l ecu today, yet to try it out but before I could do anything I attempted one last time with the stock ecu and suddenly now its not turning over. I turn the key and all I here is a click followed by the fuel pump running. The only thing I can think of is the battery is too drained (measures 12.3 volts?) or a fuse blew? I dont know, but I have the get the starter going first before I can swap the ecu. yeyyy

 

[zippyshoe]

The problem could very well be your battery is weak. Will the engine crank if you try and jump-start your car?

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

quick question: Should the engine turn over if the ecu is disconnected?

I have a 50amp start function (steady 14.5 volts) on my charger, I attempted to start it with that yet its still not turning over. All I hear still is the fuel pump work and a click from behind the radio from what I believe is the starter relay. I have also cleaned the cables/terminals and tightened them down. As well as hitting the starter.

Yet the car was turning over 2 days ago. Basically I left the keys in the ignition, the battery drained, I recharged it and it turned over fine. I removed the ecu for like the 5th time for further inspection. A little later I put it back in. Get in today and now it wont turn over.

Anyone have any ideas?

 

[zippyshoe]

Have you tried installing your new 1.8L ECU yet? This may be worth a try. Your old, possibly defective ECU may be preventing your engine from starting.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

The jump-start function on my charger sucks, I let it charge overnight and it turned over fine. So I got really excited and swapped the ecu... Nothing, the same thing happened, although when it turns over it sounds a little different, I cant describe it, like a deeper turning sound or something. Dont know, not sure what to do next.

I have to try to find out if the injectors are still not pulsing with this new ecu.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

Im really sorry to bring back my old thread but I didnt want to start a new one on the same subject and Im out of ideas. Current update with the car I now have a good used ecu with the exact same serial number. I swapped it in and now the injectors are finally pulsing and no cel. Yet the car stillll doesnt want to start?? I know the fuel pump is still pumping and im sure the compression is still good. Its not kicking with starter fluid unlike before when it would actually kick over a little. Maybe for some reason im not getting spark or correct spark now?? im so clueless and if any has any other ideas please let me know.

Ecu - good
Fuel - good
Injector pulse - good
spark - to be checked soon
compression/timing - good