DSMLink + Timing + fuel = ??? (long)

[TurboDSMer]

ok i have DSMLink and it was completely tuned before i got the car. my car started stuttering and misfiring badly the other day, and because of my 6 bolt swap i had troubles with misfiring once before, so i plugged in the laptop and checked my DTC's, and as usual my rear o2 sensor was the only reason for the light, my ECU wasnt picking up any misfire... so i pulled the plugs. one was melted, and the others were scorched to all holy hell. i went out and picked up some NGK BPR7ES's, installed and the car ran fine for the rest of the day.
Today i start up the car, and as i'm driving as soon as i got on the throttle a little and started spooling some boost, it started to stutter again, not as bad as before but still enough to make it a miserable ride. Because of how the plugs looked when i pulled them i was told that my car sounded like it was running too lean, so i plugged in and richened it up, and while i was using DSMLink i checked the timing, its set to +4 the whole way across. now i dont know much about timing, does that seem totally off? i'm running a small 16g turbo, nuthin huge... what do you think?
(sorry so long)

_Sean

 

[kpt4321]

+4 degrees sounds like it could be about right.

Get a local guy who is familiar with DSMLink to take the car for a tuning session.

 

[Violater101]

Well, what kind of knock are you getting with the 4 degrees of advance. As long as i'm not knocking, i'm going to try to get as much timing as possible for pumpgas. What kind of octane are you running?

 

[TurboDSMer]

runnin 93 octane pump gas, only a little knock... the car is back to misfiring to the point where i dont wanan drive it again, i cant wait for my new wires to get here, i'm hoping thats the problem.

 

[doug]

I was just reading a thread on the DSMLink forums yesterday about timing vs. fuel vs. boost. Several guys mentioned that many DSMs prefer boost over timing. The basic gist of the thread seemed to be add just a little timing and leave it alone, then play more with the boost and fuel.

 

[Violater101]

It's hard to run 20 plus degrees of timing on pumpgas with 19 or 20psi and not have at least 2 or 3 degrees of knock (which basically negates any timing you try to add) so I tend to agree with more boost and like stock timing above 4krpms. Adding timing early on to spool the turbo isn't really an issue, its around 6k that knock starts to come on from what I have seen.

 

[Iceman]

Originally posted by TurboDSMer
ok i have DSMLink and it was completely tuned before i got the car. my car started stuttering and misfiring badly the other day, and because of my 6 bolt swap i had troubles with misfiring once before, so i plugged in the laptop and checked my DTC's, and as usual my rear o2 sensor was the only reason for the light, my ECU wasnt picking up any misfire... so i pulled the plugs. one was melted, and the others were scorched to all holy hell. i went out and picked up some NGK BPR7ES's, installed and the car ran fine for the rest of the day.
Today i start up the car, and as i'm driving as soon as i got on the throttle a little and started spooling some boost, it started to stutter again, not as bad as before but still enough to make it a miserable ride. Because of how the plugs looked when i pulled them i was told that my car sounded like it was running too lean, so i plugged in and richened it up, and while i was using DSMLink i checked the timing, its set to +4 the whole way across. now i dont know much about timing, does that seem totally off? i'm running a small 16g turbo, nuthin huge... what do you think?
(sorry so long)

_Sean

Holy crap...... Okay so basicly you need to make your timming table a slop. I'm not going to get into this right now but you should be seeing around 18-20deg at 7kRPM. You might of done serious damg to your engine.... Things i would check and do: Headgasket, Plugs agian, boost leak test, compression test. If all turns out good than you got off lucky.

I hope i described that in newb terms

 

[TurboDSMer]

problem solved, and you prolly wont believe it, but this was all happeneing because all my ignition wires were turned to face straight back, facing the intake manifold. i turned them all to go in he direction the arrows showed, and the car is running mint again.... i'm still gonna have it compression tested, the head gasket is fine, and i know i have a boost leak because my 1g BOV is leaking, the plugs are also still fine.... thanks for the help guys.

 

[Iceman]

Originally posted by TurboDSMer
problem solved, and you prolly wont believe it, but this was all happeneing because all my ignition wires were turned to face straight back, facing the intake manifold. i turned them all to go in he direction the arrows showed, and the car is running mint again.... i'm still gonna have it compression tested, the head gasket is fine, and i know i have a boost leak because my 1g BOV is leaking, the plugs are also still fine.... thanks for the help guys.

So you had to turn your plug wires to make them work im hearing? That doesn't make sense to me.... I don't see how that would help you what so ever. Actually i sappose it would if the spark was hitting the plugs (which i dout). There must be something else you changed....

 

[Groomz]

Originally posted by Violater101
It's hard to run 20 plus degrees of timing on pumpgas with 19 or 20psi and not have at least 2 or 3 degrees of knock (which basically negates any timing you try to add) so I tend to agree with more boost and like stock timing above 4krpms. Adding timing early on to spool the turbo isn't really an issue, its around 6k that knock starts to come on from what I have seen.

1G's would be able to have 20+ degree's of timing because of their lower compression. 2G's run less timing but produce about the same power from the higher compression.

Timing is taken away to increase spool, not added.

 

[kpt4321]

Removing timing will spool the turbo faster, but until you reach full boost the car will be slower. In reality, the car will usually be faster from point a to point b is you add timing; the boost won't come on much slower, and the car will have decent power out of boost.