DSM newb came from STI (Comparison)

[mgould4]

Just got my first DSM after tons of research. I am coming from an STI. Love both cars but needed something cheaper on the wallet. Now that I have the DSM, I may need to sell it and buy a commuter for a new job. It's funny how life throws curve balls like that. Anyway I'm going to try to enjoy it while I have it. I can tell this thing has tons of potential. It's tuned really conservatively right now (hits 20psi) and definitely not in the efficiency range of the turbo.

Here's the mod list (I hope to have some pics in a few days):

98 GSX RED
6 Bolt Swap with 2G Head
Shep Stage 3 Trans with Welded Center Diff
ACT 2900
Shearer FAbrications Custom exhaust 3inch (Twin tip sleeper look)
PTE front mount with Shearer upper IC pipe
Hahn Racecraft 20g with 10cm hotside (would've rather had a regular 20g but it's still a nice piece imo just has a little higher boost threashold. No creep though)
FP Turbo Inlet
95 EPROM with DSMlink (capacitors fixed by Buscher Racing)
Stock MAS
Konig Wheels

If tuned more aggressively, I bet this will easily be a mid 11 sec car.


Coming from the STI, the biggest difference is comfort and gearing. The gearing in the DSM is much better suited for everyday driving or the strip. The STI gears are so short and close (which is good for autocross) that daily driving it can be more annoying. Although it does help to stay in the powerband. And at the strip you must make a 4-5 shift in the Suby. The suspension on the STI is also stiff and harsh while the eclipse is sporty but comfortable. There's no question which platform is superior for drag racing, that goes for EVOs as well. That being said I wish I could have kept the STI because I really loved it. As for the welded center diff, it barely bothers me. I didn't know what to expect because some people really frown upon it. I don't mind at all though. Anyway, this seems like a cool forum and I'll definitely be hanging and learning while I still have the DSM before I have to get my daddymobile.

 

[Dragon TalonTsi]

You'll be in the high 11s with race gas or meth injection if driven well. FYI, an AWD DSM can be made to run circles around an STi on a road course or autoX without too much trouble.

I second that.... even if they are good drivers, we still, with can, stock for stock I have done it and I have seen it done before..... and with my new setup, man, I run even more circles around them...

 

[oldman]

mgould4, welcome to tuners. Looks like you're already starting out with a decent setup though I prefer virgins myself.

To all of you that have gone off topic, do not turn this thread into DSM vs STI thread, anymore off topic posts will be warned and deleted.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

mgould4, welcome to tuners. Looks like you're already starting out with a decent setup though I prefer virgins myself.

To all of you that have gone off topic, do not turn this thread into DSM vs STI thread, anymore off topic posts will be warned and deleted.

Sorry about that. The title included the word "comparison". I guess I got the wrong idea.

 

[oldman]

No problem, just trying to prevent a "them vs us" threads which never end nicely and rarely fair.

 

[wvturbo2]

The comparison isn't which is better, but are they both good cars are they both fast and are they both fun yes. A dsm as he said is more affordable and a great bang for the buck and as they said get the car tuned and try try again til your running the car the best you can, sounds like you've got a killer setup enjoy the ride it may get bumpy .

 

[AndrewD5418]

And what exactly makes DSM's implementation of AWD any less true? And what is the advantage of a 6 speed gear box?

Our AWD system is 50/50 front and back, pretty much the best design out there, IMO. And we've definitely established that 6 speed trannies are often lesser in the 1/4 mile and especially a pain in the neck for daily driving. Don't get me wrong they have their place and are pretty nice overall.

I just don't see where you were going with your post.

I guess you don't know how limited a VC LSD is...? A 6 speed is better for auto x. Much better gear range selections for curves. I don't give two shits bout 1/4 times, straighs are lame. Same with nascar. Pain in the neck for DD? No...

STi can be 50/50 aswell.

 

[mgould4]

Thanks for the welcomes. My intent was to just give a simple compare/contrast not to put them in a head to head comparison. I really like both cars. I like EVOs too. I'd love to have an 04 Cobra too. Point is, like others have expressed, for strip, street, autoX, etc... whatever your cup of tea is, any given car will have its pros/cons. In the end, I could have fun building up any of those cars. On another note, I justed started playing with DSMlink. It's pretty cool software. I had customed tuned EM on my STI, but I've never been able to datalog. Now I want to take my laptop out everytime I drive.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

I guess you don't know how limited a VC LSD is...? A 6 speed is better for auto x. Much better gear range selections for curves. I don't give two shits bout 1/4 times, straighs are lame. Same with nascar. Pain in the neck for DD? No...

STi can be 50/50 aswell.

Well you guys can infer that I don't know jack as much as you will but no one has yet told me what makes DSM's AWD untrue or what the serious flaw in a VC LSD is. I'm glad a 6 speed is better for autox. Like I said, it has its perks.
I honestly envy the suby's because they're new and we're old. I'd love to get the chance to drive one.
Anyways, the OP is right though. Each cars have their purpose/areas of expertise. Maybe one day I can have one of each.
And to the OP welcome to the club, I practically live on here. Can't wait to get DSMlink over here let us know how you like tuning with it!
Peace.

 

[LordZed]

What's up everyone! I'm in a scaled down version of your situation, Mgould.
I purchased a 02 WRX Wagon when they came out here in the U.S. I loved that car like it was my first born! I had the car for three years and logged just over 85K miles on it with absolutly no problems except a week first gear syncro. (a common problem on WRX's from that year) The company I worked for shut down and I had to let it go. It was the car or the house, and my wife wasn't about to live out of a car

My Best friend, a GVR-4 owner and feeling very sorry for my broke AWD less ass, found a 91 TSi for $600 bucks. It came with a blown motor and some pretty nice body dent's ding's and faded paint. We swapped the motor out with a JDM VR4-RS motor we ran across (I know! How lucky am I to find a RS motor!) and she's up and running now. Not perfect because I havent been able to start putting the money into tunning her and getting her looking extra nice just yet, but hey, the project has only just begun!

With that I can say this. Compared to the 2.0 WRX I had, this car has every bit the potential if not more. I have the Cyclone manifold hooked up properly and working and I'm not sure if that's what makes the difference, but below 3000 rpm the DSM is far superior. Your laughing right now saying "who the hell need's power below 3000 rpm?" but believe me, boost in the Subie didn't even start to ramp up untill 3000 rpm. That ment if some kid in a Honda next to me caught me just a little off guard, there was no hammer it and go. It was more like, hope I can catch a down shift quick enough or it's lag city and bye bye Honda. Catching a quick shift in a WRX is a lot like catching a quick shift in a DSM. Unless you have all the right goodies, there just not fast shifting trannies.
I've driven a few STi's and they do not suffer from this lag problem nearly as much due to there gearing and displacement. The DSM start's pulling like a freight train from 2200 in this car. The tranny's feel very similar....notchy and beefy. Each gear is a solid intentional action. I still have to do the bushing mod to tighten thing's up a bit, but they feel very similar and both are 5 speed's. Brakes suck in both cars but the edge goes to the Subie for being 11 years newer in technology and having dual piston's up front. I'm going to address all the shortcomming's in the DSM however.

But all in all, a very similar car to me. I think I like the DSM more because it's cheeper to mod, more unique, and it gives me more to tinker with.
Sorry to run on with a comparo, but it's just nice to see a comparison thread! Plus, I live in GA too!! Mgould, hit me up with the number to that dyno. I'll be needing it eventually!!
I don't post much because I can usually get all the info I need from the search function, but reading a crap load of post's from you guy's lead's me to believe this is a super friendly place to be! See ya'll around!

 

[v2ner]

What's up everyone! I'm in a scaled down version of your situation, Mgould.
I purchased a 02 WRX Wagon when they came out here in the U.S. I loved that car like it was my first born! I had the car for three years and logged just over 85K miles on it with absolutly no problems except a week first gear syncro. (a common problem on WRX's from that year) The company I worked for shut down and I had to let it go. It was the car or the house, and my wife wasn't about to live out of a car

My Best friend, a GVR-4 owner and feeling very sorry for my broke AWD less ass, found a 91 TSi for $600 bucks. It came with a blown motor and some pretty nice body dent's ding's and faded paint. We swapped the motor out with a JDM VR4-RS motor we ran across (I know! How lucky am I to find a RS motor!) and she's up and running now. Not perfect because I havent been able to start putting the money into tunning her and getting her looking extra nice just yet, but hey, the project has only just begun!

With that I can say this. Compared to the 2.0 WRX I had, this car has every bit the potential if not more. I have the Cyclone manifold hooked up properly and working and I'm not sure if that's what makes the difference, but below 3000 rpm the DSM is far superior. Your laughing right now saying "who the hell need's power below 3000 rpm?" but believe me, boost in the Subie didn't even start to ramp up untill 3000 rpm. That ment if some kid in a Honda next to me caught me just a little off guard, there was no hammer it and go. It was more like, hope I can catch a down shift quick enough or it's lag city and bye bye Honda. Catching a quick shift in a WRX is a lot like catching a quick shift in a DSM. Unless you have all the right goodies, there just not fast shifting trannies.
I've driven a few STi's and they do not suffer from this lag problem nearly as much due to there gearing and displacement. The DSM start's pulling like a freight train from 2200 in this car. The tranny's feel very similar....notchy and beefy. Each gear is a solid intentional action. I still have to do the bushing mod to tighten thing's up a bit, but they feel very similar and both are 5 speed's. Brakes suck in both cars but the edge goes to the Subie for being 11 years newer in technology and having dual piston's up front. I'm going to address all the shortcomming's in the DSM however.

But all in all, a very similar car to me. I think I like the DSM more because it's cheeper to mod, more unique, and it gives me more to tinker with.
Sorry to run on with a comparo, but it's just nice to see a comparison thread! Plus, I live in GA too!! Mgould, hit me up with the number to that dyno. I'll be needing it eventually!!
I don't post much because I can usually get all the info I need from the search function, but reading a crap load of post's from you guy's lead's me to believe this is a super friendly place to be! See ya'll around!

Hey, aren't you that guy from power rangers? haha, anywaz, sounds like a good start....kepp it up.

 

[LordZed]

HA! No he's my twin brother. I'm not hell bent on world domination and colored spandex.
There's such a wacky and weird story behind this name that I won't bore you with the details. It's not Power Rangers related though.

 

[brute]

I'd like to hear it, as long as you post it in The Hangout so we don't clutter this thread.

 

[PRESSURIZED]

As long as your car is tuned well and in good running condition, 11's are very possible.

I did it, the first time at the track in my car, on Pump gas and a couple gallons of Xylene from Home Depot.. and Im talking 91 Octane.

Im gonna throw in some c12 or c16 and crank up the boost/timing....hoping for mid 11's

-Mike

20G Most underrated turbo...my FP 20G kicks ficking assssssss...

BTW, those dyno numbers are on my old 50 Trim....... IMHO 20G>50 Trim....faster spool.

Go to www.dsmlink.com/forums

DSMLINK is the SHIT

 

[LordZed]

I'd like to hear it, as long as you post it in The Hangout so we don't clutter this thread.

Ok then, if you really want to hear it I'll post an introductory thread about myself and user name in the hangout room.