con rod question

[Puller]

I have wiseco pistons and am using my 1g rods, a machine shop got my old pistons off the rods but had to break them to do so. They can't put my new ones on the rods for lack of tools or something. Problem is, i can't find anyone to do this soon enough. I was wondering if i warmed the con rods and pistons to like 150-200*F and froze the pins if you guys think it will slip in with even a little force. I need this done ASAP (monday the 9th) so the 2 possible shops that would do it arent open now obviously and aren't open monday. basically im gonna try anyways but i was wondering if anyones tried it but thats my dilema.

 

[Rick@AP]

You do realize that the rods you have are set up for press fit and the Weisco pistons are set up for floating? Probably not. Do yourself a favor and buy a set of 95 pistons or ditch the 1g rods and get a set of Eagle rods.

 

[Puller]

the point is i want to use my rods. please explain. if the pistons are set up for floating and rods not, what's the difference? if the rods pressed it still moves with the pin inside the piston. if it floats it does the same only slides on the pin not with, correct? if not explain i don't see where problems may occur but please enlighten me more specifically.

 

[i550]

For you to use your factory rods with those pistons you need to modify the pin end of the rods. You have two choices, one is correct while the other is a hack that will fail.

Correct way - A bushing and oil passage need to be added to the pin end of the rod.

Hack - the pin end is honed to fit the pin and an oil hole is added. No bushing is used and the pin and rod will kill each other.

 

[Puller]

thanks, eagle rods are set up for floating correct?

 

[1fast97gsx]

I think you have to specify 1g or 2g .. I'm guessing the 2gs are set up for floating.

 

[i550]

Originally posted by Puller
thanks, eagle rods are set up for floating correct?

The Eagle rods are set up for floating pins and you may or may not have to have them pin fit.

 

[gsxitement]

o.k., so you're saying that because that 1g pistons are press fit, if you go to a floating set up, the pin has a smaller diameter than stock, so you would have to much clearance in the small end which, as we all know is bad. so now, are all floating sysytems the same, or do different manufacturers maybe account for the possibilty that people might go with a stock rod. this would be good to know since i'm doing a 6 bolt in my 98 gsx, and i'm using the big rods that came in the block, with ross pistons. i really hope i don't need to get rods....cause that could be devastating to my budget.

 

[anomalyinva]

Eagle rods $365 at www.slowboyracing.com

 

[Rick@AP]

Originally posted by anomalyinva
Eagle rods $365 at www.slowboyracing.com

They are cheaper than that in more than a few places, but how does this answer his question?

Press fit means exactly what it implies, the pin is nearly the same size diameter as the small end of the rod. You have to literally press the pin in with a machine in order to make the pin go through. The rotation of the piston occurs at the outside of the pins where they meet the pistons. Full floater pistons have pins that can be pressed through by hand with a little oil on the pins surface. The ends of the pins are fixed and the rotation happens at the small end of the rod.

You cannot mix full floating pistons or rods with press fit pistons and rods, unless you have the rods machined BIG time. Its not worth the cost and effort to convert. If you just feel you need an upgrade but have to use the 1g rods, then you should go with the stock 95+ pistons and have the rods machined to fit the larger diameter pins.

All aftermarket piston manufacturers automatically set up there pistons as full floaters unless you special order something different. 99.9% of the pistons out there set up as full floaters will work with every aftermarket rod manufactured to use full floating pistons.

Yes, Eagle rods are set up for full floating pistons.

 

[Puller]

great. that helps a lot. i didn't even see the spiro lox in the box until a while ago when someone mentioned aftermarket pistons being floating. "shit." so check the trader im letting them go for trade or cash/paypal.

 

[2.4 turbo Hyped]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=33623&item=2459400619&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWN%3AIT

Eagle rods 300 bucks shipped very fast service. This is where I got mine.

 

[gsxitement]

o.k....now, the stock rods have an oil squirter in the shoulder and the eagles don't....am i gonna spin a bearing since the bearings have the holes for the squirter....but also since the stock ones had the holes in the cap and didn't spin the bearings i figure i should be alright.....also i've never heard of anyone running a full babbit faced bearing in our cars....any info?

 

[Rick@AP]

Originally posted by gsxitement
o.k....now, the stock rods have an oil squirter in the shoulder and the eagles don't....am i gonna spin a bearing since the bearings have the holes for the squirter....but also since the stock ones had the holes in the cap and didn't spin the bearings i figure i should be alright.....also i've never heard of anyone running a full babbit faced bearing in our cars....any info?

The squirter in the shoulder of the stock rods is there to help oil the cylinder walls. The crank, however, slings enough oil around to lube the walls well enough without the shoulder oiling option. The rod bearings are lubed from the chamfered holes in the crank which are found on each journal. All the bearings better have babbit faces on them if not your running metal - oil - metal, which won't last long.

 

[gsxitement]

no no... i meant that in the bearings i have, they have the hole to accomodate the squirter, and there is no distinction from upper and lower rod bearings...either in the stock ones and my new ones, meaning they all have a hole right about center of the bearing...oh believe me, i am not about to put bad bearings in my car

 

[Rick@AP]

Depending on the type of rod that you use, some rods come with what is called rifle drilling. This is a hole going up the length of the rod that squirts oil on the pin. If your rods don't have it, don't sweat the hole the in the bearing.

 

[jydog]

The Wiseco pistons I bought also came with pin retainers which I didn't use. I just had the pins pressed in and trashed the retainers. However if you can get the pin in without a press, even with your method of heat and cold, I would never trust them to stay in.

 

[Rick@AP]

Originally posted by jydog
The Wiseco pistons I bought also came with pin retainers which I didn't use. I just had the pins pressed in and trashed the retainers. However if you can get the pin in without a press, even with your method of heat and cold, I would never trust them to stay in.

You trashed the pieces that keep the pistons attached to the pin? Then what is holding the pin and piston together?

 

[gsxitement]

o.k....i got the rods and pistons put together, 4 spira locks per piston..damn that busted my balls......the pins pressed in pretty easy, and if they got tight, a little coersion with a light tap from a plastic hammer got em in right......good god ross pistons and eagle rods look good...too bad they'll be buried in the block.

 

[jrotten]

It was mentioned earlier in this post that the rods may need to be pin fitted. I got Ross shelf pistons and Eagle 1G rods, and the Ross pins will only go into the Eagle rod half way before binding. I was expecting a tight fit but not binding, and I dont want to hit those pins with a hammer plastic or otherwise. That pin should just slide right through the rod nice and smooth with a little lube no? I even froze the pin to shrink it, still binding. I can get the rods honed to fit I'm sure but I wa$ not expecting to need thi$ done. Can you fit the pins yourself somehow? thanks!