Completely confused on smoking issue

[johneclipse]

so im at a complete loss now...car is running 13.x AFR under boost according to my AEM UEGO. turbo has no lay in/out or side/side. but its still smoking from what looks to be coming from under the hood somewhere when under boost. my powersteering rack is looped with everything else of it deleted. EGR has the vac lines unhooked with no block off plate{just the stock gasket}(to my knowledge this alone should keep it from spitting out smoke right?) charc canister is still hooked up the way it should be. AC is deleted with nothing left. I know there is a small exhaust leak at the manifold/head connection. Could the smoke be from piston rings or valve seals? the only other thing is i believe my balance shaft is out of balance, but i still have plenty of oil pressure even under boost. i have no idea at all what is causing it and its making me totally mad. once again, it ONLY smokes under boost.

its a 90 eclipse GSX. Mod list is up to date i believe

 

[doubleclutch99]

A compression test and a leak down test might shed a little light on the subject. either way it's good info to rule out a few things. does the smoke have any color to it ? turbo seals could be a good source of smoke if they are leaking.

 

[johneclipse]

A compression test and a leak down test might shed a little light on the subject. either way it's good info to rule out a few things. does the smoke have any color to it ? turbo seals could be a good source of smoke if they are leaking.

smoke is pure white. no odor to it. im gonna try and get a compression tester monday from my schools shop. ill post back with those numbers as soon as i can.

 

[doubleclutch99]

The last time i seen white smoke with no odor on my car, the compressor wheel of the turbo was eating the inside of the compressor housing. not alarm you but check the shaft play on the turbo. the key thing you wrote is that it only does it under boost and that makes me think maybe this is the same issue i had. just a thought

 

[RipperXX]

White smoke = coolant
Bluish smoke = oil
Black smoke = rich / too much fuel.

 

[teenvette77]

its pure white and coming straight out from under the hood correct? could be a pin hole in a coolant line. under load, more pressure in the collant system could push coolant out and spray the manifold. My GST did this untill the hose completely failed. Untill that happened there wasnt any residue or coolanty smell when i pop'd the hood. Just that random puff of white smoke when pulling wholeshots. Was driving me nuts too.

And not to nitpick anyone above me but turbos dont have seals in their CHRA's. Just bearings and dust shields. Only an imbalance of pressure on either side of the bearing or serious damage can cause a turbo to leak oil. We get these questions a TiAL all the time. Even the Formula teams we sponsor in Europe couldnt wrap their minds around this.

 

[RipperXX]

I would suggest you pressure test the coolant system. Also there is a dyelite product you can add to the coolant that causes it to glow under UV light to help find leaks. It could be this, coolant from the turbo, or HG failure.

Although if it's from the HG, you will likely have lower compression in that cyl (although not always) and the spark plugs will be discolored.

 

[johneclipse]

i just did a MLS HG, arp studs, and 14b rebuild with a 16g hotside while doing my waterpump. possibly could be a pin hole in a coolant line. My turbo feed line is brand new. so i reckon ill replace my rad hoses.

could it be my egr? I removed the vac lines to "bypass" it. I was under the impression i didnt necessarily have to use a block off plate when removing the lines. Possible that its still opening letting the exhaust out{making it smoke}?

as far as my coolant system goes, in the past 2 weeks i have replaced: radiator with an aluminum one, dual slim-line fans, thermostat, radiator cap, waterpump, and turbo coolant feed line. I have a bypassed heater core with a new hose on it.

i guess im gonna beg my shop teacher to let me borrow a pressure tester for the radiator/system and a compression tester.

also, my turbo is still rock solid since the rebuild. no play at all in/out or side/side.

 

[teenvette77]

your turbo...is it mounted at the stock orientation? oil feed lined up with oil out should be nearly perfectly vertical. being off can allow oil to pool against and seep through the bearing. Usually this causes a puff of smoke at startup but could still cause smoke at other times....wierder things have happened.

 

[bme91gsx]

its pure white and coming straight out from under the hood correct? could be a pin hole in a coolant line. under load, more pressure in the collant system could push coolant out and spray the manifold. My GST did this untill the hose completely failed. Untill that happened there wasnt any residue or coolanty smell when i pop'd the hood. Just that random puff of white smoke when pulling wholeshots. Was driving me nuts too.

And not to nitpick anyone above me but turbos dont have seals in their CHRA's. Just bearings and dust shields. Only an imbalance of pressure on either side of the bearing or serious damage can cause a turbo to leak oil. We get these questions a TiAL all the time. Even the Formula teams we sponsor in Europe couldnt wrap their minds around this.

so what would you call the piston ring in the seal plate and the piston ring on the turbine wheel?

your turbo...is it mounted at the stock orientation? oil feed lined up with oil out should be nearly perfectly vertical. being off can allow oil to pool against and seep through the bearing. Usually this causes a puff of smoke at startup but could still cause smoke at other times....wierder things have happened.

on the contrary sir.. it would leak past the ring or seals as some people may refer to them..

so im at a complete loss now...car is running 13.x AFR under boost according to my AEM UEGO. turbo has no lay in/out or side/side. but its still smoking from what looks to be coming from under the hood somewhere when under boost. my powersteering rack is looped with everything else of it deleted. EGR has the vac lines unhooked with no block off plate{just the stock gasket}(to my knowledge this alone should keep it from spitting out smoke right?) charc canister is still hooked up the way it should be. AC is deleted with nothing left. I know there is a small exhaust leak at the manifold/head connection. Could the smoke be from piston rings or valve seals? the only other thing is i believe my balance shaft is out of balance, but i still have plenty of oil pressure even under boost. i have no idea at all what is causing it and its making me totally mad. once again, it ONLY smokes under boost.

its a 90 eclipse GSX. Mod list is up to date i believe

Compression test is your best friend

 

[doubleclutch99]

And not to nitpick anyone above me but turbos dont have seals in their CHRA's. Just bearings and dust shields. Only an imbalance of pressure on either side of the bearing or serious damage can cause a turbo to leak oil. We get these questions a TiAL all the time. Even the Formula teams we sponsor in Europe couldnt wrap their minds around this.[/QUOTE]

That's not true. they do have seals, but they are called sealing rings, or piston rings as a friend of mine that builds turbos at bullseye pointed out . its actually a piston ring. and what does a piston ring do ? it seals combustion gases into the cylinders . to turn raw fuel into energy. so yeah when you give out bad info people get the wrong idea and yes when the ring or seal goes bad it can and does sometimes smoke. here's some reading for you guys. Turbo Rebuild

 

[johneclipse]

your turbo...is it mounted at the stock orientation? oil feed lined up with oil out should be nearly perfectly vertical. being off can allow oil to pool against and seep through the bearing. Usually this causes a puff of smoke at startup but could still cause smoke at other times....wierder things have happened.

turbo is still set up the same as stock. im gonna get a compression tester and coolant pressure tester monday...ill post back with results.

 

[teenvette77]

And not to nitpick anyone above me but turbos dont have seals in their CHRA's. Just bearings and dust shields. Only an imbalance of pressure on either side of the bearing or serious damage can cause a turbo to leak oil. We get these questions a TiAL all the time. Even the Formula teams we sponsor in Europe couldnt wrap their minds around this.

That's not true. they do have seals, but they are called sealing rings, or piston rings as a friend of mine that builds turbos at bullseye pointed out . its actually a piston ring. and what does a piston ring do ? it seals combustion gases into the cylinders . to turn raw fuel into energy. so yeah when you give out bad info people get the wrong idea and yes when the ring or seal goes bad it can and does sometimes smoke. here's some reading for you guys. Turbo Rebuild

You two guys from Muskegon...lets not jack this guys thread. If you want to continue this debate please stop in at TiAL around 3:30. Thats when i clock out. Ask for Jake and Jack. 450 S Shiawassee St Owosso, MI. JSUK the construction out front sucks. If ive been fed the wrong info from our "tech" guy(Jake) i want to iron this out. Specially since we ARE TiAL, , giving out bad info is not good PR. Maybe he was just talking about ball bearing Garrett turbos, idk....but this has been what ive been told for the entirety of 3 years working there...

To the O.P......let us know what you find!

 

[doubleclutch99]

No thread jacking here, just explaining that you were'nt entirely correct in your first statement sir. i even gave a link to prove it. thanks. http://vfaq.com/mods/Turbo-rebuild.html . if you scroll almost all the way down you'll be able to see the piston ring aka seal . this is the part i'm talking about that will leak oil and smoke as it gets wore out.

 

[teenvette77]

No thread jacking here, just explaining that you were'nt entirely correct in your first statement sir. i even gave a link to prove it. thanks. Turbo Rebuild . if you scroll almost all the way down you'll be able to see the piston ring aka seal . this is the part i'm talking about that will leak oil and smoke as it gets wore out.

I just dont want to clutter up this guys thread. Thats all. And i agree with your explaination; this is throwing a monkey wrench into everything ive been told since I started working at TiAL. Ill take this info in tomorrow and ask what they mean by "no seals".

 

[johneclipse]

so i've decided to go tomorrow morning before school and grab new radiator hoses. i was suggested maybe one of them has a pinhole in it and under boost its causing it to swell enough to let coolant out. every other line is brand new, so if its not the rad hoses...i needed them anyways so no harm done.

 

[johneclipse]

after the new radiator hoses and tightening the turbo coolant feed. the smoke is much less. still get a small puff under heavy boost though...ill figure it out sooner or later . still waitin on my EGR block off plate...should be here tomorrow