Building that bisshh

[ITSME4G63]

Alright guys, I have one question, I want to build my engine up, I already have the eagle/ross combo sitting in my room, but this car is going to be a daily driver on a small16g, is a built engine as reliable as the stock or even 1g rods on 2 pistons? Im leaning to selling the ross/eagle combo and getting something like 1g rods on 2g pistons or just oem replacements. What do you guys think?

 

[clownface]

i would think the aftermarket stuff would be better as long as its all put in the engine right.

 

[greathuskie]

i would think the aftermarket stuff would be better as long as its all put in the engine right.

not necessarily, he will never make enough power to require having taht forged motor, the 1g/2g motor is a great motor that i wish i would have bought instead of crower/wiseco, however him having eagle/ross wont hurt at all if the block is machined and assembled with the right clearances etc

only bad thing about that is he may be adding a bit of weight to the rotating mass, but eagle rods are relatively light so its not too bad

 

[TSIfreek]

Yea the combo you have if correct for your aplication will by far out last any OEM part. When you have the short block built for you (highly recomended) everything will be ballanced perfect with each other so more RPMs and power will be noticable and obtainable with out stress. Just look at the quality of the pistons and rods dude you dont have to be a genious to see what part is more supierior
As long as you a have the short block built corectly yes it will outlast the oem parts becuse they are designed to take more abuse (boost) than the OEM stuff.

 

[greathuskie]

Yea the combo you have if correct for your aplication will by far out last any OEM part. When you have the short block built for you (highly recomended) everything will be ballanced perfect with each other so more RPMs and power will be noticable and obtainable with out stress. Just look at the quality of the pistons and rods dude you dont have to be a genious to see what part is more supierior
As long as you a have the short block built corectly yes it will outlast the oem parts becuse they are designed to take more abuse (boost) than the OEM stuff.

back anything up you just said with proof
a 1g/2g motor is the best combo any street car with just a 16g will ever see

 

[clownface]

ummm.....i dont see why anyone would think that a 1g/2g engine would be better then a eagle/ross engine, it might be over kill though.

 

[greathuskie]

i never said it was better overall

it is extreme overkill, a waste of money, and the 1g/2g motor is better for what he is doing

why run the negatives of a forged motor when you iwll never make enough power to even require opening any 4g63 block at all?

 

[turbo2oh]

i never said it was better overall
it is extreme overkill, a waste of money, and the 1g/2g motor is better for what he is doing
why run the negatives of a forged motor when you iwll never make enough power to even require opening any 4g63 block at all?

I agree, small 16g daily driver doesn't need a built engine. Sell them and put the $$ towards something else.

 

[TSIfreek]

I agree that a 12 second street car doesnt need a built short block. If you are running bigger than a 50 trim I would have it built.
Now that he has the rotaing assembly I would just have it built. It will cost him no less. If it were me I would keep the Ross/eagle combo for insurance reasons and you can get alont more when you decide on selling it.
Yes alot of guys run the 2g pistons and big rods because they are cheep but the rods/pistons he has are just better materials that last longer under abuse for engines boosting over 23 psi and hitting 11.00s at the track all day. On a street car its not needed but good insurance down the road.

 

[Chrono]

Agreed, on the 1G/2G combo the beefie rods and pistons are over kill. Also if you want a nice set of 1G big rods and pistions let me know, Ill hook u up cheap

 

[midnght]

Just call any *Reputable* DSM engine builder and ask them the downside of a Forged Beefed up engine vs. a 1G/2G combo for a daily s16G driven car. You will get all the RIGHT info you want.

Hell, ask some of the guys on here that run built motors at the AutoX and track all season and see how often they need a rebuild.

 

[clownface]

Just call any *Reputable* DSM engine builder and ask them the downside of a Forged Beefed up engine vs. a 1G/2G combo for a daily s16G driven car. You will get all the RIGHT info you want.

Hell, ask some of the guys on here that run built motors at the AutoX and track all season and see how often they need a rebuild.

You sound like you already know. So ill just ask you. What are the downsides to forged stuff vs a 1g/2g combo?

 

[DSMJim]

Ross pistons are great quality and better than stock, there is no doubt. Eagle rods are better than stock rods as well but they are not high quality aftermakret rods, they are made in China if anybody wants to know...

One other thing...

Yea the combo you have if correct for your aplication will by far out last any OEM part. When you have the short block built for you (highly recomended) everything will be ballanced perfect with each other so more RPMs and power will be noticable and obtainable with out stress. Just look at the quality of the pistons and rods dude you dont have to be a genious to see what part is more supierior

Aftermarket parts are not balanced you need to pay for this additionally and many do not as it's fairly expensive to balance a motor properly. This means your balancing everything that is spinning in the motor, thats a lot of work and money/trouble for most people to go though. Many just bore the block drop in the new pistons rods with new main and rod bearings and walk away. That last step of balancing is never generally done on a 500whp or less engine...

As with any aftermarket product there are always tradeoffs compared to stock. Generally most aftermarket pistons are somewhat noisy compared to stock cast pistons and bulit motors in some cases burn a small amount of oil, where a new stock factory engine doens't burn any oil at all.

 

[ITSME4G63]

Ross pistons are great quality and better than stock, there is no doubt. Eagle rods are better than stock rods as well but they are not high quality aftermakret rods, they are made in China if anybody wants to know...

One other thing...



Aftermarket parts are not balanced you need to pay for this additionally and many do not as it's fairly expensive to balance a motor properly. This means your balancing everything that is spinning in the motor, thats a lot of work and money/trouble for most people to go though. Many just bore the block drop in the new pistons rods with new main and rod bearings and walk away. That last step of balancing is never generally done on a 500whp or less engine...

As with any aftermarket product there are always tradeoffs compared to stock. Generally most aftermarket pistons are somewhat noisy compared to stock cast pistons and bulit motors in some cases burn a small amount of oil, where a new stock factory engine doens't burn any oil at all.

you saying all that, just shone a bright ass light at my forhead,thanks

 

[clownface]

Ross pistons are great quality and better than stock, there is no doubt. Eagle rods are better than stock rods as well but they are not high quality aftermakret rods, they are made in China if anybody wants to know...

One other thing...



Aftermarket parts are not balanced you need to pay for this additionally and many do not as it's fairly expensive to balance a motor properly. This means your balancing everything that is spinning in the motor, thats a lot of work and money/trouble for most people to go though. Many just bore the block drop in the new pistons rods with new main and rod bearings and walk away. That last step of balancing is never generally done on a 500whp or less engine...

As with any aftermarket product there are always tradeoffs compared to stock. Generally most aftermarket pistons are somewhat noisy compared to stock cast pistons and bulit motors in some cases burn a small amount of oil, where a new stock factory engine doens't burn any oil at all.

What if i was to just drop in brand new 1g big rods and 2g pistons into my engine i have now. Would that need to be balanced? or do you not have to get factory parts balanced?

 

[pianoman]

you don't HAVE to balance your motor. look if you already have the pistons and rods, go get some decent bearings, and might as well do some arp head studs. make sure the clearance on the crank is good, get the motor put together and be done with it. And in the future if you feel the need to crank up the boost then at least your motor can handle it. just make sure you let the engine warm up before you drive it. ross pistons are a tad noisy when there cold. oh yeah and since your gonna pull the motor you might as well take out the balance shafts. its your car, do what you want. but granted that combo should be good for some decent hp numbers. and yes 1g big rods and 2g pistons is a good cheap combo also. you can sell those rods and pistons, pick up a set of 1g/2g combo, and put the extra cash some where else. do you have a 6bolt or 7 bolt in your car?

 

[ITSME4G63]

you don't HAVE to balance your motor. look if you already have the pistons and rods, go get some decent bearings, and might as well do some arp head studs. make sure the clearance on the crank is good, get the motor put together and be done with it. And in the future if you feel the need to crank up the boost then at least your motor can handle it. just make sure you let the engine warm up before you drive it. ross pistons are a tad noisy when there cold. oh yeah and since your gonna pull the motor you might as well take out the balance shafts. its your car, do what you want. but granted that combo should be good for some decent hp numbers. and yes 1g big rods and 2g pistons is a good cheap combo also. you can sell those rods and pistons, pick up a set of 1g/2g combo, and put the extra cash some where else. do you have a 6bolt or 7 bolt in your car?

I have a 7bolt, but I bought me a 6 bolt block waiting for transplant

 

[pianoman]

well thats good, i was hoping you wern't rebuilding a 7bolt

 

[1fast97gsx]

well thats good, i was hoping you wern't rebuilding a 7bolt

:thumbdown That comment is just plain ridiculous.

I personally have ross pistons and eagle rods in my 7 bolt and haven't had a problem ( only 1600 miles ) ... I don't see how forged stuff would require more maintanance or would cause any problems. Just let the car full warm up and give it some time to cool down before you shut it off and you won't have any problems. Balancing is NOT necessary, although it will cause less stress on some parts. Ross pistons and eagle rods are overkill for a 16g no doubt, but having the built motor the potential is always there and all he has to do is slap on a bigger turbo down the road and turn up the boost. 16gs are a waste of time period imo, so maybe we should be discussing that more instead of saying forged internals are overkill. For that turbo yes they are, but for any decent sized turbo not in the least.

 

[4g64GST]

Eagle rods are better than stock rods as well but they are not high quality aftermakret rods, they are made in China if anybody wants to know...

IMO eagles are great you are getting a high quality rod without the price tag.

have you ever sat down and looked at an eagle rod you cant even see the seam between the cap and the rod.

and I have never heard of anyone breaking a eagle rod (to my knowledge)

just my .02 worth

 

[TSIfreek]

No me eather. I have a buddy that drags a champion renagade 306 built mustang that runs 9.00s at 800HP+ and he never had a problem ran them right out of the box. I seriously beleive that making sure everything is ballanced properly it increases reliabiliy 100%

 

[pianoman]

my buddy is on his 3rd motor in his car with the last one being a 6bolt swap with eagle rods and ross pistons, the second one was a jdm swap. he beats the crap out of his motors and this last one seemed to be holding up quite well untill he crashed head on into the back corner of a parked truck.

and as far as the comment, i personally don't see the point of rebuilding the 7 bolt motor. my other friend has been through two 2gen's on was a 95 and the other was a 96. but thats my opinon

 

[mistervr4]

The wear and tear on a forged engine compared to a stock engine are different. The forged pistons you have are harder than the engine block, so the pistons are going to wear out the block faster than the block is going to wear out the pistons. So, you will wear out faster than stock, but it will be the block wearing out, and causing higher piston ring to block clearances, not the other way around like a stock motor. How much faster, I don't know. But I would say to keep your setup because you have already spent the money on it, and selling it would just lose you money (you can't sell a set of pistons for the same price you bought them for). I wouldn't worry about engine wear. You'll probably sell the car before 70,000 more miles pass you by.

 

[pinknuggit]

16gs are a waste of time period imo, so maybe we should be discussing that more instead of saying forged internals are overkill.

strictly imo...



i guess i just wasted time buying mine...