Back in the Scene 1g FWD TSI GOAL = 320WHP

[dirtysouthpinoy]

Back with a DSM! Got me a nice 1g fwd TSI. I'm trying to aim for a 320WHP on 91 CRAPIFORNIA GAS. My daily driver/weekend track warrior Here are my mods so far.....

1990 TSI FWD

Rebuilt 6Bolt
Block Bored .020 Over
2G Pistons with 1G Big Rods 8.5:1 Compression
Balance Shafts Removed
Evo III Multi-Layer Metal Head gasket
3 Angle Valve Job
Evo III BIG16G Turbo

2.5 Intercooler Piping with Modified Stock Side mount
3' GM MAF /w MAF-Translator
3000GT VR4 Fuel Pump 180LPH Rewired
550CC RC Injectors

2.5Inch Down Pipe
2.5 MagnaFlow HI-FLOW Catalytic Converter
3' MagnaFlow Catback

Now I am aiming for 320whp on pumpgas. I've been researching for hours, but I keep seeing different opinions on running my EVO III Big16G safely and efficiently I will be getting a SAFC II and AEM UEGO Wideband to start tuning. Now my questions are:

Currently Running on 14PSI wont be raising it until I get a wideband and tune.

My modified 2.5inch Stock Sidemount enough for my 320WHP Goal and BIG16g?

My VR4 Rewired 180LPH Fuel Pump with RC 550's Enough for that 16g?

 

[Aproductions]

Currently Running on 14PSI wont be raising it until I get a wideband and tune.

My modified 2.5inch Stock Sidemount enough for my 320WHP Goal and BIG16g?

My VR4 Rewired 180LPH Fuel Pump with RC 550's Enough for that 16g?

I think it would be wise to look into a FMIC....although I'm not exactly sure on where the stock sidemount starts heatsoaking.


as for the fuel....I would really get bigger than 550's for this.

after you get the wideband and tune you will find out right away if your need to upgrade this stuff.

goodluck

 

[laser90]

The VR-4 fuel pump will be enough for your goal. The sidemount on the other hand is the question. I've personally seen a car run mid 11's with a stock sidemount. But I personal would run a FMIC, I guess I like the idea of not having to worry about heat soaking the stocker.

 

[pboglio]

Back with a DSM! Got me a nice 1g fwd TSI. I'm trying to aim for a 320WHP on 91 CRAPIFORNIA GAS. My daily driver/weekend track warrior Here are my mods so far.....

1990 TSI FWD

Rebuilt 6Bolt
Block Bored .020 Over
2G Pistons with 1G Big Rods 8.5:1 Compression
Balance Shafts Removed
Evo III Multi-Layer Metal Head gasket
3 Angle Valve Job
Evo III BIG16G Turbo

2.5 Intercooler Piping with Modified Stock Side mount
3' GM MAF /w MAF-Translator
3000GT VR4 Fuel Pump 180LPH Rewired
550CC RC Injectors

2.5Inch Down Pipe
2.5 MagnaFlow HI-FLOW Catalytic Converter
3' MagnaFlow Catback

Now I am aiming for 320whp on pumpgas. I've been researching for hours, but I keep seeing different opinions on running my EVO III Big16G safely and efficiently I will be getting a SAFC II and AEM UEGO Wideband to start tuning. Now my questions are:

Currently Running on 14PSI wont be raising it until I get a wideband and tune.

My modified 2.5inch Stock Sidemount enough for my 320WHP Goal and BIG16g?

My VR4 Rewired 180LPH Fuel Pump with RC 550's Enough for that 16g?

Frankly, I don't like your parts combo for 91 octane. The 2g pistons on a stock 1g timing map is going to be your main problem. I'd run DSMLink lite with a 2g MAF or speed density, minimum 660 cc injectors, ditch the 2.5" cat and run a testpipe, and at a minimum an upgraded sidemount like the Supra or just go FMIC and be done with it. By my math with the parts list I listed, you'd still need 19-21 psi of boost. Actually, your lack of cams might help you avoid knock.

 

[Calan]

I'd run DSMLink lite with a 2g MAF or speed density, minimum 660 cc injectors, ditch the 2.5" cat and run a testpipe, and at a minimum an upgraded sidemount like the Supra or just go FMIC and be done with it. By my math with the parts list I listed, you'd still need 19-21 psi of boost.

I agree with pboglio 100%. You won't get there with the 550cc injectors, and the MAFT is old technology and usually more hassle than it's worth, now that SD is available. Not that the MAFT won't work (I still run one myself but tune with Link)...it's just not the best solution these days.

Contrary to what you may hear, getting to a true 320whp on a minimal setup with a 16G and straight 91 pump is pretty tough (especially on a higher compression motor), without some good tuning software and a bit of luck.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Evo III BIG16G Turbo

I do hope by that you means an MHI unit (not a chinabay turbo).

Also, upgrade you intercooler. No matter how much you "Modify" that core, it will still not cool as well as a supra sidemount or garrett core.

Fuel is not something to skimp on, ever. Get a walbro 255 (good for 400hp), and up the injectors to 1000's on dsmlink for overhead.

If you want to get even better flow, upgrade to a SMIM (intake manifold) for better flow. There was night and day difference after I swapped over from the OEM restrictive plenum to something that can breathe better.

The only thing you'll need after that to maximize the output of that 16g, is a set of good camshafts.

And if you're stuck with a low octane gasoline, you can always invest into a methanol injection kit. You might even get away with not needing to upgrade your side mount going that route.

 

[laser90]

You do not need 1000cc injectors and a 255. My car recently put down 330whp and 330 TQ on a mustang dyno. My A/F was perfect! I'm updating my profile soon. I run a rewired VR-4 pump and 650cc injectors. It's nice to have room to grow but it's not neccessary to hit your goal.

 

[ReYnd]

1000cc injectors are a tad big. I'd get 750s since they're the same price as 650s. Link would be a good idea no matter what. A 3S rewired fuel pump will probably do just fine, but if not, look into that Walbro 255HP and a good adjustable fuel pressure regulator. You may not need either of the last two parts, but still a good idea to keep them in mind so you don't wind up going over your budget and having a car that runs like crap because of the new parts that are supposed to be an upgrade.

The intercooler discussion interests me, as I'm slowly working toward a similar goal. Have been browsing here and there but haven't nailed down the point at which the stock side mount heatsoaks. I'd say it's on a per-setup basis and you'd just have to find out for yourself. Same for the others, Supra and front mounts. Just depends on which is the most efficient for you. Run the stocker until it consistently heatsoaks, then it's time to upgrade. By that time you will probably know how far you'll have to go to keep the intake air cool.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

1000cc injectors are a tad big. I'd get 750s since they're the same price as 650s. Link would be a good idea no matter what. A 3S rewired fuel pump will probably do just fine, but if not, look into that Walbro 255HP and a good adjustable fuel pressure regulator. You may not need either of the last two parts, but still a good idea to keep them in mind so you don't wind up going over your budget and having a car that runs like crap because of the new parts that are supposed to be an upgrade.

The intercooler discussion interests me, as I'm slowly working toward a similar goal. Have been browsing here and there but haven't nailed down the point at which the stock side mount heatsoaks. I'd say it's on a per-setup basis and you'd just have to find out for yourself. Same for the others, Supra and front mounts. Just depends on which is the most efficient for you. Run the stocker until it consistently heatsoaks, then it's time to upgrade. By that time you will probably know how far you'll have to go to keep the intake air cool.

Yes, I am aware 1000's are large for what he wants, but they give him room to go larger in the future if he wants to. That's the reasoning behind my advice.

"intercooler heatsoak" is a multivariable situation. It has to do with the compressor efficiency of the turbocharger and its flow rating at that efficiency. If you have a really poor efficiency (ie increasing pre choak pressure), but more flow, then the intercooler will heatsoak quickly. This is shown when a t-25 is made to run boost levels higher than 15psi. You simply don't get any more power (not to mention, you won't see more than 12 psi at redline anyway due to the flow rate of the engine).

There really is no point in arguing for or against the sidemount, and it should be very quickly swapped out to a more efficient unit after a turbo upgrade if you wish to make any kind of decent power.

 

[dirtysouthpinoy]

thnxs for the reply guys! and yes its a REAL Mitsu evo III turbo, also dont forget I am FWD soo i dont think 320whp is that FAR. I heard the highest injectors i can run with an AFC is 650. I'm going to see how much whp i can get running the 550's and stock sidemount and report back! AND HOLY CRAP CHECK OUT THIS GUY http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/dyno-talk/338802-456whp-evo-iii-16g.html my MODS are almost the same cept hes on e85

 

[rx7ttlm]

I would ditch the idea of SAFC. I had one on my 2g back in the day while I did the cali tuning thing. You need to have control over timing AND fuel. The biggest problem with safc is that you are very limited with injector sizing. You go to big and you end up putting the ecu in a higher timing section of the timing map and your more prone to detonation. Call Mike at Road Race and ask him about that. *I was there one day they were doing a dyno pull with a guy that insisted he run some big ass injectors on afc, it sounded so terrible I was just laughing*

Get DSM link Lite, its like 345. AND if you one day decide you want 600hp and drag slicks. You just update the firmware and go on with your bad self(one of the guys just made 1000hp on link this weekend) . I did the injector dance too. Started out with 550's, then 660's then 750's and now I am waiting on my check to come in so I can order 2150's. Can you tell I got tired of it? 1000 cc injectors aren't that big on link, I tuned my best friends 2g FWD on link with 1000's and it idles like a kitten. And with all the guys bailing on the sub 1000cc injectors in favor of 1250+ for e-85. I am sure you could get some injectors you can grow with AND use on E-85 if you chose later. Also, If you run link you can hook your wide band to it and it will log the values (when you plug the laptop in and hit record) Which will make tuning almost easy once you get the hang of it and I can almost guarantee you will make more power on link than safc. Boost maping is coming soon too, so being a fwd kid that should help you too.

and get a quality front mount.

Regarding the zac's car. That thing is ####in nutty, there is a LOT of work done to that engine. Its not just a throw togather. The O2 on his car has SILLY port work, its the size of my three inch stainless tubular o2, it comes as just under 2.5 if I recall....... Its ####ing huge . Its also on almost 100% ethanol (E98) which I am sure was from lucas's personal stash . His shop has a habit of turning out some high Hp cars . Note what he does have, an intercooler like mine (quality ets), link and a 400 dollar intake manifold port job (extrude hone). It does make me want to buy an FP exhaust manifold (I have ported evo III)

 

[dirtysouthpinoy]

Yeah i was looking at dsmlink, if i get dsmlink does it make my pocketlogger useless? i wont need any of the features of it anymore?

 

[rx7ttlm]

Yeah i was looking at dsmlink, if i get dsmlink does it make my pocketlogger useless? i wont need any of the features of it anymore?

well i don't know which one you have. But i think there is a palm compatible deal for link. That might have been v2. Its cool cause you can grow with it as you learn. The full version is like 500(I run full version in my 2g, should be around 500hp by the end of the summer) and I am getting lite for my 1g as soon as I have the cash, it just doesn't have fuel adjustment over 8k rpm and some other more advanced things. But for 95% of people lite is all they would need to tune to make good power. I got a little laptop from best buy for a couple hundred bucks and its only my tuning laptop. It all works out pretty well.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

For the amount of money you spend on an AFC / pocketlogger combo you can have v3 lite. Having timing tuning abilities will net you far more power than basic a/f control.

 

[2GRick]

1000cc injectors are a tad big. I'd get 750s since they're the same price as 650s. Link would be a good idea no matter what. A 3S rewired fuel pump will probably do just fine, but if not, look into that Walbro 255HP and a good adjustable fuel pressure regulator. You may not need either of the last two parts, but still a good idea to keep them in mind so you don't wind up going over your budget and having a car that runs like crap because of the new parts that are supposed to be an upgrade.

The intercooler discussion interests me, as I'm slowly working toward a similar goal. Have been browsing here and there but haven't nailed down the point at which the stock side mount heatsoaks. I'd say it's on a per-setup basis and you'd just have to find out for yourself. Same for the others, Supra and front mounts. Just depends on which is the most efficient for you. Run the stocker until it consistently heatsoaks, then it's time to upgrade. By that time you will probably know how far you'll have to go to keep the intake air cool.

Stock side mount is done at 300 hp. Less in hot weather. Lots of good info on above posts. U don't need 1000 cc injectors. 750s are perfect.

 

[aero_sallee]

For the amount of money you spend on an AFC / pocketlogger combo you can have v3 lite. Having timing tuning abilities will net you far more power than basic a/f control.

Some form of timing and fuel control like he said becomes even more critical with higher than stock compression and the already aggressive stock 1g timing map. Then you ad trying to tune larger injectors and the timing goes even higher, and on crap 91 octane. The recipe is NOT for fun or success.

Jackal(ds-map.net), link, or some form of standalone becomes a necessity.

 

[laser90]

You could go with a chip an AFC combo. That's what I run. On my baseline pulI the car dyno 324whp! Solid A/F 11.2 with afc we made some small changes and the car dyno'd 328whp it didn't do much for peak HP but it brought my power curve a little higher and held longer on the top end. Just another option you could go with.

 

[pboglio]

I'll break it down:

Cons: 1g timing curve, 8.5:1 pistons, 91 octane, SAFC lying to ECU about airflow altering your ignition timing curve further, stock sidemount intercooler,320 w.h.p., at least 20-21 psi boost level.

Suggestion: 2.5" testpipe, FMIC, ECMLink, reduce WOT ignition timing and/or richen A/F, prayer from a Catholic priest.

Biggest problem I see is knock. EVERYTHING you have or plan on having isn't helping and in some cases has made your engines knock resistance far WORSE (see Cons above).

 

[dirtysouthpinoy]

Little update guys for people that have this setup in the future 1g 16g builds. You guys were RIGHT!!!

On shitty 91 pump gas, THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL YOU CAN RUN 1g timing on 8.5:1 compression with only a SAFC/MAFT. All you get is KNOCK KNOCK! You absolutely need some kind of timing control IE Dsmlink. I can only run like 10-12 psi to control the knock at WOT. SOO DSMLINK HERE I COME!!