what would I need to kill an STi?

[ECLIPSE95]

This summer I am looking into buying a 1G Eagle Talon TSI AWD..they have a couple up for sale now for about 1,300 which is totally cool because I have no problem working on cars anyways..I work on my 420a all the time and I am not too fimiliar with the 4G63 though...I'd like to learn more about it..but anyways if I were to buy this car..what mods would I need to start killing a WRX STi? is it possiable to beat them with a 1g Turbo DSM? I would like to smash this STi in the ground because this guy downtown talks alot of crap about DSMs and how they are so slow and they can never be as fast as his STi and he would bet anybody who has a DSM to race against his STi..so I am totally up for it this summer but I want to build up a 4G63..so what would I need so I could just smoke him? I know my 420a probably won't be up for the challenge because I'll be in the middle of swapping out my 2.0L with a 2.2L engine this summer and turboing it..and I'd like to fix up a 1G Turbo DSM or could I smoke him if I got my 420a built up and turboed with a super 20G turbo?..any suggestions are well appreciated..thankz and please don't bash...

 

[allturbo]

here you go...
http://www.dsmtuners.com/tuning-guide/1gturbo/stage1power.php

You probably have to do a lot of tuneup work first before you start modding. Most 1gs going for 1300 usually aren't in great condition.

is it possiable to beat them with a 1g Turbo DSM? I would like to smash this STi in the ground because this guy downtown talks alot of crap about DSMs and how they are so slow and they can never be as fast as his STi and he would bet anybody who has a DSM to race against his STi..

haha, that's kind of funny. He said any DSM right??? I dare him to visit North Lawerence Ohio and race a guy named John

BTW if you don't know who I am referring to visit this site. http://www.shepracing.com/index.html

 

[ECLIPSE95]

well I test drove this 92' one time and the tranny was toast and the rings were toast and it couldn't hold its idle...but this was before winter and I offered 450 bucks for it and they wanted 2,500..I laughed in their face and left...but anyways their is a couple more Talons that are in good shape and one is TSI and the other TSI AWD..I am thinking about test driving the AWD tomorrow and see how good it is..but thankz for the help...any suggestions on the turbo?

 

[ECLIPSE95]

oh ya..and this dude talks alot of crap..I think he watched the fast and the furious too much because he is willing to put up pink slips and stuff or some serious money...500+ bucks for a race (RICH KID) but this dude is a joke and I am totally serious..but I woundn't race him for pink slips though...but if i knew I could beat him I'd put up some cash...but not 500 dollars...

 

[98RedGs]

Originally posted by ECLIPSE95
oh ya..and this dude talks alot of crap..I think he watched the fast and the furious too much because he is willing to put up pink slips and stuff or some serious money...500+ bucks for a race (RICH KID) but this dude is a joke and I am totally serious..but I woundn't race him for pink slips though...but if i knew I could beat him I'd put up some cash...but not 500 dollars...

If he will race for pink slips someone thats close that runs 12's or high 11's please go see him! Go get this dam sti from the driver, I'm sure it wouldn't take much.

*calls John Shep to tell him where he can get an sti for real cheap*

Goodluck on your ask tho bro.

 

[SBstar]

Has this guy modded his Sti or is he running stock??? If he wants a piece of a DSM I'm sure there are plenty of guys who could whip his tail. YOu included if you mod your car right. Sounds like a good way to get a nice car too Overall though Go through the sites suggested mods and maybe a nitrous system.

 

[herostar]

missoula is 1/2 a days drive from here... give me 3 weeks and maybe I'll have an STi... :evilgrin:

 

[Eclipse96Ryder]

it shouldnt be too hard to beat an STI if he is stock...just do the stage 1 mods....then put injectors and a bigger turbo...and im sure you would smash him.

 

[paranoidTSi]

There is NOTHING I hate worse than a driver that thinks his car is all that and that he could NEVER lose. To beat this guys ass:
- Intake (Cone Filter)
- Exhaust 2.5 or 3"
- Manual Boost Controller
- Supra SMIC
- 2 1/4" IC Piping
- 16G turbo or greater

This guy would be owned...his $24K car would get stomped by a ~3.5K Talon Tsi AWD...but basing on this guys attitude even if you did win he'd find some sort of excuse as to why he lost, these types of people can't accept defeat.

 

[crazyboost]

Here ya go:
MBC $40
Boost gauge $45
K&N $35
Homemade intake pipe $15
3" turbo back $650
190 fuel pump with rewire $100
550 or 660 injectors $280
SAFC $250
16G turbo $500

Seeing the look on an ignorant STI owner in your rear view mirror: PRICELESS

 

[98spydert]

If this were really a no bull shit pink slip race, I'd go dump 5K into the engine, demolish the competition, and take home that STI. Cheapest STI you'll ever buy...

 

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Eclipse96Ryder
it shouldnt be too hard to beat an STI if he is stock...just do the stage 1 mods....then put injectors and a bigger turbo...and im sure you would smash him.

This wouldn't guarantee victory over an STi. The 2.5L engine in those cars is a better drag engine than even the EVO VIII. If the STi is modded, there is little chance for 95% of DSM owners to beat it.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Originally posted by heavyD
This wouldn't guarantee victory over an STi. The 2.5L engine in those cars is a better drag engine than even the EVO VIII. If the STi is modded, there is little chance for 95% of DSM owners to beat it.

Glad I'm part of that 5%.

There is more to an engine than just displacement. For that matter, there is more to a car than just displacement.

The STI ECU, for example is an over-complicated POS. DSMs are much easier to tune and have fewer engine computer road-blocks. Also, the STI's turbo doesn't have much headroom. A 16G can flow more air. DSM combustion chambers are more knock resistant than Subaru combustion chambers.

 

[sonicnofadz]

This wouldn't guarantee victory over an STi. The 2.5L engine in those cars is a better drag engine than even the EVO VIII. If the STi is modded, there is little chance for 95% of DSM owners to beat it.

Ummmmm...I'll have to disagree with you on that one. Stock, the 2.5 L STI engine (2004) only makes 300 hp stock. Considering that a stock turbo dsm comes with 200 hp stock, it is feasible for even a novice, to modify a stock DSM to output more horsepower than the STI's engine. Saying that a stock 2.5L 300 hp engine will stomp 95% of all DSM owners is probably not a very accurate figure when you take a look at the list of the people in this forum who are making 400 + HP at the wheels. But then again, there are a lot of people who (suprisingly) leave their DSMs stock! So who knows? =)

 

[ECLIPSE95]

thankz for all of the help...I am totally thinking about modding up a TSI AWD..I hope to smash his STi in the ground...he doesn't have barely any mods on his STi but on his other WRX he claims he has 50,000 dollars into the car..but everybody downtown thinks he is full of it anyways...ya probably 50,000 including the car..his turbo isn't upgraded..and he has a bigger FMIC instead of a Top mount IC...and a couple of other mods..like intake and exaust and the engine isn't upgraded eather..but thats just on his WRX..now his STi is just bone stock I believe...I guess he is totally serious about the pink slip thing..wouldn't know how to go about it though if I wanted to bet him pink slips...but I dunno I usually bet cash...instead of being stupid like beting pink slips...like what if I blow a tire or something or tranny goes out all of a sudden?...little risky....I just want to ruin his cocky attitude and I want everybody to see him cry when I kill his precious STi

 

[sonicnofadz]

Yeah gunning down an STI should be absolutely no problem for decently modified (and well tuned) DSM. I don't think those aluminum boxer engines in the wrx's can take too much power before breaking anyway (only light modification is possible before resorting to forged internals). Good luck on your project, keep us posted! If you need help with your modding, you know where to go for help.

 

[boostngst]

Here ya go:
MBC $40
Boost gauge $45
K&N $35
Homemade intake pipe $15
3" turbo back $650
190 fuel pump with rewire $100
550 or 660 injectors $280
SAFC $250
16G turbo $500

Seeing the look on an ignorant STI owner in your rear view mirror: PRICELESS

That was a good post. But I think if he had all of that money in his wrx then he would race that and not his sti. But I say go for it, with good mods you could take him.

 

[heavyD]

Originally posted by ShapeGSX
Glad I'm part of that 5%.

There is more to an engine than just displacement. For that matter, there is more to a car than just displacement.

The STI ECU, for example is an over-complicated POS. DSMs are much easier to tune and have fewer engine computer road-blocks. Also, the STI's turbo doesn't have much headroom. A 16G can flow more air. DSM combustion chambers are more knock resistant than Subaru combustion chambers.

For the record, Subaru engines are bulletproof, the only shortcoming is the 5-speed transmission with the regular WRX turbo's. I don't love Subarus or anything but I also don't have my head up my ass like some DSM'ers that think slapping a bigger turbo & exhaust on a car means 12 sec. 1/4 mile times which it doesn't. A stock STI will run a 13.1 1/4 mile time. I know that there are alot of DSM that can do under 13 sec 1/4 mile times but those cars have more than just bolt-ons and represent the minority.

 

[SBstar]

OK so call me crazy but if i knew i could beat his stock Sti I would definately go pink slips. Whoop his tail and have your friend drive his car away waving at him with a big grin or something. Think of it this way take his car sell it buy bigger better mods and whoop his wrx. Ok so maybe not so smart of a way to go but i would take his car and make him feel dumb at least. Whatever happens have fun with it/

 

[ECLIPSE95]

Originally posted by sonicnofadz
Yeah gunning down an STI should be absolutely no problem for decently modified (and well tuned) DSM. I don't think those aluminum boxer engines in the wrx's can take too much power before breaking anyway (only light modification is possible before resorting to forged internals). Good luck on your project, keep us posted! If you need help with your modding, you know where to go for help.

thankz..I'm sure I would need lots of help with the 4G63 engine since I really know nothing about them..but like I said I work on my 420a all the time and I am really getting into turbos...I guess the turbo bug bit me as well as the AWD bug...

 

[TSiGoesPsSsSst]

This guy sounds like a jackass.Definatly buy a TSi AWD and hand is ass to him while he hands you the keys to his STi.All this talk is making me want to go out and buy myself a 1G AWD.I wish I could find one cheap,and dump shitloads of money into it,rather than dumping it into a car that cant get any traction

 

[ShapeGSX]

Originally posted by heavyD
For the record, Subaru engines are bulletproof,

The piston in cylinder #3 would disagree with you. Perhaps it is engine management issues, or a problem with the intake manifold design on the standard WRX. But a lot of people with WRXs have destroyed that piston. Time will tell if the STI has the same affliction.

think slapping a bigger turbo & exhaust on a car means 12 sec.

I didn't have much more than that on my car when I ran a [email protected]. I had a 16G, test-pipe-back exhaust, air filter, upper IC pipe, an AFC, and a fuel pump upgrade. Must have had my head up my ***, too.

 

[sonicnofadz]

For the record, Subaru engines are bulletproof, the only shortcoming is the 5-speed transmission with the regular WRX turbo's.

Please check out this article:
http://www.autospeed.co.nz/cms/A_0213/article.html

Not only are subaru transmissions notorious for failure, but the pistons in most of their engines are HIGHLY prone to failure. HOWEVER, Subaru admittingly knows this fact, and for this reason has placed FORGED pistons (from the factory) into their 2.5 liter STI engine. The six speed gear box in the STI is also reinforced, so I wouldn't say all Subaru engines are bulletproof, but the STI's comes pretty damned close.

 

[heavyD]

Originally posted by ShapeGSX
The piston in cylinder #3 would disagree with you. Perhaps it is engine management issues, or a problem with the intake manifold design on the standard WRX. But a lot of people with WRXs have destroyed that piston. Time will tell if the STI has the same affliction.

I didn't have much more than that on my car when I ran a [email protected]. I had a 16G, test-pipe-back exhaust, air filter, upper IC pipe, an AFC, and a fuel pump upgrade. Must have had my head up my ***, too.

Actually the problem associated with the #3 cylinder is due to the turbocharger and downpipe being located right next to cylinder #3. The theory among people in the know is that cyl. #3 is endures higher temps. due to the heat of the turbo & downpipe which makes it the more prone to failure than the other three cylinders. It's not an engine problem as much as an engineering issue but it is the main weakpoint if you are modding the engine, much like crankwalk for a 2g.

ShapeGSX you think that the extra displacement doesn't matter? It makes for a much more responsive and linear powerband. Take a look at the SRT4 and its 2.4 L of displacement and what tuners are starting to make with that engine.

The WRX & WRX Sti are great cars. I get tired of people spouting off about cars that they really don't know anything about. The worst thing you can do is lack respect of your competition. The driver may be a jackass but he is driving a very capable car even in its stock incarnation.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Originally posted by heavyD

ShapeGSX you think that the extra displacement doesn't matter? It makes for a much more responsive and linear powerband. Take a look at the SRT4 and its 2.4 L of displacement and what tuners are starting to make with that engine.

I did not say that it didn't matter. I did say that there are other factors to take into account, OTHER than just displacement. And the 4G63T has the upper hand in those other areas. Engine management, detonation resistance, engine noise, piston strength, ovaling of cylinders, etc...

The WRX & WRX Sti are great cars. I get tired of people spouting off about cars that they really don't know anything about. The worst thing you can do is lack respect of your competition. The driver may be a jackass but he is driving a very capable car even in its stock incarnation.

I agree that they are great cars. They just have shortcomings in areas that I happen to feel are important to anyone that is looking to make more horsepower easily. For example, the stock WRX ECU doesn't actually pay any attention to the knock sensor output over 5500RPM because the engine is too noisy to get a good knock reading. So it ignores it. If you have a knock event up there, too bad. If you are drag racing, 90% of the time you are racing will be spent above 5500RPM!

The latest WRX ECUs also do not switch to closed loop quickly enough after you floor the throttle. If you floor the throttle, the ECU will spend 1 to 2 seconds in closed loop, trying to maintain a lean A/F ratio for good gas milage and emissions before switching to open loop. That is an absolutely horrible situation, which could definitely lead to engine failure on a modified car.

Mitsubishi ECUs are quite simple compared to Subaru ECUs. They don't try to do everything. And thus they are much easier to deal with when you start to modify the car.