What would be the easiest and a good fuel set up to support an evo316g?

[96gstdsm]

Ok i decided to pour some money into my car now. I think i am going to go ahead and upgrade to an evo316g turbo. My question here is what fuel setup would be best and easiest to do? I have zero experience with any turning. What fuel pump and injectors would be best? With all setups would it require tuning? Would i always need a afpr? It is only going to be a street car. No racing or anything like that so i am not going to try and be pushing like 400hp or anything crazy. Just want more pick up and top end from the t-25.
Let me know any ideas. Just pretty confused after reading everything here, so many different opinions.

--Ryan.

 

[HondaStylez]

You'll be fine with a 190lph, 650's, and an SAFC. I'd get 550's since you're only looking for 300bhp.

Rewiring the pump is definately a good idea but whether it is nessesary or not is debatable. Personally, I would recommend an AFPR regardless of what sized pump you get, but that's entirely up to you. Plenty of people run 190's without AFPRs.

 

[My91TalonTSi]

I agree with the two above posts. If you decide to go the afc route you should pick up a logger. Or, like I said earlier, if you have an eeprom ecu you can get it socketed and burned for 650's. Whatever you decide, i think a rewired 190 and 650's should be enough fuel for your goals.

 

[silver bullit]

If your on a budget or wanna get all the supporting mods first get the 14b cause you can push the 14b to 18psi- 20psi for race day and turn it down to 14 when your not, and many people have gotten into the 12's withthe 14b.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/timeslips.php?&do=14b

 

[96gstdsm]

Ok thanks alot guys. Yeah i would like to have it not running full duty cycle, thats why i want to go with the 650's i think. I have a boost gauge already, one of the first couple things i did.
So when i install it and put the boost up higher with all the fuel mods, will the safc monitor anything or just set it? In other words will i need to get a logger as well to make sure that nothing bad is going on in my engine? or will the safc be able to let me know that also?
One other thing is it hard to rewire the fuel pump? Or time consuming?

 

[HondaStylez]

Fuel pump rewiring is pretty easy. Check out www.vafq.com

A logger is far from nessesary, invest in a wideband instead. That's you're #1 pre-emptive means against blowing up. Using a logger alone amounts to guessing and hacking.

The SAFC is able to monitor the MAF reading (in Hz), RPM, TPS, and battery voltage. Nothing too special but they're all useful at times.

 

[Splitpi]

Price of 650cc's = $275, price of 850 cc's = $275. Why not go bick once and be done with it. And with DSMLink its not a problem, which is what I recommended to begin with. And it is a far better purchase than an SAFC especially for a mind for the future. I am of the oppinion do something right once.

 

[turbodsm18]

Ok thanks alot guys. Yeah i would like to have it not running full duty cycle, thats why i want to go with the 650's i think. I have a boost gauge already, one of the first couple things i did.
So when i install it and put the boost up higher with all the fuel mods, will the safc monitor anything or just set it? In other words will i need to get a logger as well to make sure that nothing bad is going on in my engine? or will the safc be able to let me know that also?
One other thing is it hard to rewire the fuel pump? Or time consuming?

Loggers are very helpful, except they dont detect knock But as far as the fuel pump rewire, When I did it, it took about 3 hours cause it was my first time soldering. But overall it is very easy, theres a write up on vfaq that helps alot.

http://vfaq.com

-Kevin-

 

[turbodsm18]

Price of 650cc's = $275, price of 850 cc's = $275. Why not go bick once and be done with it. And with DSMLink its not a problem, which is what I recommended to begin with. And it is a far better purchase than an SAFC especially for a mind for the future. I am of the oppinion do something right once.

Because not everybody has the $$$ for high dollar parts. Im sorry, but there are many things that come before my car, call me stupid, but thats how my life works.

 

[kmoore]

Because not everybody has the $$$ for high dollar parts. Im sorry, but there are many things that come before my car, call me stupid, but thats how my life works.

Absolutely right. Not everybody has the cash to fork out for DSMlink. Plus you have to get an eprom ecu wich the OP does not have unless he has already upgraded.

To the OP many people have had excellent success with a logger, S-AFC, 650's, 190 re-wired, and running 20+- psi. Including a wiseman.

Good luck

 

[HondaStylez]

Price of 650cc's = $275, price of 850 cc's = $275. Why not go bick once and be done with it. And with DSMLink its not a problem, which is what I recommended to begin with. And it is a far better purchase than an SAFC especially for a mind for the future. I am of the oppinion do something right once.

So if 2000cc's were the same price then you would suggest he get those? Fuel injectors should be sided to your application, not bought because they're on sale or cheap.

If I wanted one jar of peanut butter and it costs $2 for one jar or if I use my coupon I could get 9,000,000 jars for only $2.... wtf am I going to do with 9,000,000 jars of peanut butter?

I'll agree with everyone else, you'll be amazed what an SAFC can do. I know from experience.

 

[turbodsm18]

So if 2000cc's were the same price then you would suggest he get those? Fuel injectors should be sided to your application, not bought because they're on sale or cheap.

If I wanted one jar of peanut butter and it costs $2 for one jar or if I use my coupon I could get 9,000,000 jars for only $2.... wtf am I going to do with 9,000,000 jars of peanut butter?

I'll agree with everyone else, you'll be amazed what an SAFC can do. I know from experience.

I would buy the 9,000,000 so I would have to buy it for a long time.

Ok, seriously. If I had a nice method to tune my car, I would go with say 750's over 650's because not only would they be same price, I would also have room to grow in the future.

With that said, you should not run anything higher than 650 cc injectors if you are tuning on a SAFC.

I would look around a little a do some research before you purchase an SAFC. I know many people run it and its proven, but it just doesnt seem right to take incoming info to the ECU and manipulate it. I would rather get a chip than do that. Once again its just my opinion.

-Kevin-

 

[kmoore]

Ok, seriously. If I had a nice method to tune my car, I would go with say 750's over 650's because not only would they be same price, I would also have room to grow in the future.
-Kevin-

That's what we're saying, though, the OP does not have a nice method of tuning yet. That's why we're saying to go with 650's so that the injector duty cycle % is low, yet you can still control timing farely easy.

 

[My91TalonTSi]

I am a fan of oversized injectors. Take a look at my profile. If you can get them for a reasonable price and you have a means to compensate for them then get'em. This way you have room to grow if you decide to push your car more in the future. If you don't and the only thing you'll be using is an AFC you probably shouldn't go bigger then 650's.

 

[1997hciv]

I used to run an evo 16g and I had 550's and a re-wired 190 running 20psi. Tuned it using a datalogger and safc...put down 310. great set-up for the "power when you want it" on the street in my opinion.

 

[turbodsm18]

That's what we're saying, though, the OP does not have a nice method of tuning yet. That's why we're saying to go with 650's so that the injector duty cycle % is low, yet you can still control timing farely easy.

I wasnt disagreeing with you.

I would buy the 9,000,000 so I would have to buy it for a long time.

Ok, seriously. If I had a nice method to tune my car, I would go with say 750's over 650's because not only would they be same price, I would also have room to grow in the future.

With that said, you should not run anything higher than 650 cc injectors if you are tuning on a SAFC.

I would look around a little a do some research before you purchase an SAFC. I know many people run it and its proven, but it just doesnt seem right to take incoming info to the ECU and manipulate it. I would rather get a chip than do that. Once again its just my opinion.

-Kevin-

I mentioned this right in that same post.

 

[96gstdsm]

Are there problems i should be aware of with the 650cc injectors, 190 rewired and safc setup? Any problems that usually arise? I just want to give my car some extra power not a big headache for me. Is it hard to tune it correctly? Also once a good tune is done is that the end of it if i like the way it feels and it is a safe tune? Or would i have to constantly keep tuning it to keep it just right?

 

[HondaStylez]

SAFC tunes are very easy to do (especially smaller injectors) and they are set it and forget it. It's always good to monitor what's going on (hence the wideband), but any problems would most likely be mechanical, the ECU is still handling fuel and timing control even with an SAFC.

There shouldn't be any issues with that combo, it's tried and proven. About 239084329483290 people are using it currently, and yes, that is an exact count.

 

[DGajre777]

You could save some money by buying a used fuel pump and injectors from an EVO. Unless you plan on running high boost, you max out Evo injectors.

 

[evogst97]

You could save some money by buying a used fuel pump and injectors from an EVO. Unless you plan on running high boost, you max out Evo injectors.

I just bought a used evo IX fuel pump for 20 bucks. I think I'm gonna go with 650's though. I have an SAFCII ready to install and am running pretty much the same setup you (original poster) are except I might have a few more things done.

 

[kmoore]

You could save some money by buying a used fuel pump and injectors from an EVO. Unless you plan on running high boost, you max out Evo injectors.

I have heard great results from using Evo injectors. I hear that they are just enough to support an EvoIII and they are easy to control (timing in mind).

 

[evogst97]

I have heard great results from using Evo injectors. I hear that they are just enough to support an EvoIII and they are easy to control (timing in mind).

Well from what I know If you run 550's you can max them out pretty easily once you get in that higher boost area, and I believe evos are 560's so they probably wouldnt be much different. 650's seem like you'd have more room to breathe but a little harder to control timing. I'm sure there are tons of threads on this.

 

[Merkles]

I am running a 3000GT Twin Turbo Fuel Pump which flows which flows about the same as a Walbro 190 and got it for 20 Shipped off of 3si.org

Just a thought.

 

[HondaStylez]

Well from what I know If you run 550's you can max them out pretty easily once you get in that higher boost area, and I believe evos are 560's so they probably wouldnt be much different. 650's seem like you'd have more room to breathe but a little harder to control timing. I'm sure there are tons of threads on this.

550's support that much power...

<<<<<

at a low 11 AFR. They're good for more power than most people give them credit. He won't make near that power with an Evo3, so I wouldn't worry about maxing out the 550's. Plus, extremepsi.com has PTE 550's for extremely cheap (like $210).

 

[96gstdsm]

Ok thanks so much everyone for the info and suggestions. I think i will most likely go with a 190 rewired 650 and safcII.
If i were to decide to go with a dsm chip, what else would i need to accompany that? Would it work fine with my stock ecu? I heard i have to get it socketed, what is that? Would it be expensive to have it socketed? Also would i still need an afc or some other tuning device with the programmed chip? What places would do ecu socketing?

 

[92BoostedDSM]

I've already got my evo16g installed with a new ported exhaust manifold and i can already tell a huge difference except i cant really run it hard cause when it hits about 18-20psi i hit fuel cut, but just form the bolt on with no fuel mods theres a huge difference from the t-25. I should be receiving my fuel mods in the next day or so. I went with SAFCII, 190 lhp pump that I will re-wire (stocker already is)and I went with the Precision 580cc Ball-style. And I'm ordering my FMIC tomarrow. I'm looking to get 300hp with that and then add cams so I'm hoping for 320+ with cams.