Trying to decide 780cc or 680cc?

[Mr.Tao]

Ok, I'm trying to decide which injectors on a 60-1 turbo I'll be able to handle ok only using MAFT to tune? AFPR will be later. I see alot on the forums that on the stock ecu 780cc with MAFT will cause bad timing, but will the aid of an AFPR help stablelize things? And will the CAS help with timing? I dont have an eprom, yet. Also, how much power has anyone ever squeezed out of the stock fuel pump?

 

[Burnett03]

Ok, I'm trying to decide which injectors on a 60-1 turbo I'll be able to handle ok only using MAFT to tune? AFPR will be later. I see alot on the forums that on the stock ecu 780cc with MAFT will cause bad timing, but will the aid of an AFPR help stablelize things? And will the CAS help with timing? I dont have an eprom, yet. Also, how much power has anyone ever squeezed out of the stock fuel pump?

anything past 680cc are to much for the maft to handle... IMO anything past 550 is to much for the maft to handle because you get to much timing advance

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Well, you could also retard base timing a bit, but I'm not sure how much that'd help with something like 780's.

Might want to pick up an EPROM and a chip.

 

[sickgsx-316]

your gonna go with Denso's right?

 

[GPTourer]

Anything higher then 550s are going to be a pain IMO without and AFPR.
Also, I think 660/680 is the highest you should go on a MAF/SAFC even with an AFPR.
With DSMlink go with the biggest you want.

 

[Goodguy162000]

Um.... 780's??? Fuel injectors are not about pride dude. It seems that's what alot of people are thinking nowadays. Go with 550's and save yourself headache and cash. I'm at 300whp and still have a long way to go before mine reach 100% duty cycle. A long way. Oh, and I have RC's. I love 'em.

 

[Mr.Tao]

It's not about pride. It's about Pump Gas Power. I dont think I'll use race gas at all. Maybe just for some joy here and there. But mostly pump. I guess 660/680 will do. I was thinking about PTE Injectors. What about the stock fuel pump? How far has it been pushed and how much power? I've searched but search engine crashes on me.

 

[notractiongst]

...the stock nijectors can out flow the stock fuel pump..and just get a chip and do it right..go with 780s with an Eprom ECU and a chip I used to have a 60-1 on an AFC with 680s...Didnt work to great

 

[Mr.Tao]

Well I just went ahead and ordered Precision 680's from ExtremePSI.com I'm gonna see how far i can take the stock fuel pump.

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Yea, good luck with that one

 

[GPTourer]

I'm gonna see how far i can take the stock fuel pump.

Ummm, okay. Why would you want to find out how far is too far? WTF

 

[CatchMe]

Bad idea

BTW, PTE injectors dont flow what they are rated at

 

[1993eclipseGS]

Haha run the stock fuel pump... That should have been like a tune up as soon as you got the car, Put the walbro pump in.. I'll post in your next thread soon to help you out..

What thead you just asked? This one..

"Help, Ran stock fuel pump, Large injectors, Turbo etc etc.. Car went boom klank clunk BOOM, DSM'S are unreliableee!!!!!"

 

[sweet97]

I have a 60-1 and the same injectors, they flow 650cc's.
You WILL need a Walbro 255 & an AFPR along with an EPROM ECU with injector compensation. Don't even bother with the 60-1 until you have the pump and AFPR at least and your timing will be a bit too high. Mark

 

[snox135]

...the stock nijectors can out flow the stock fuel pump..

Untrue, the stock injectors can outflow the stock fuel system. With upgraded fuel lines you can get a lot more fuel from the stock pump.

http://www.stevetek.com/R-FuelSys.html

 

[98spydert]

But is it worth it NOT to upgrade to a $90 Walbro pump? Hell no, just buy the thing and get it over with. Upgrading the rest of the fuel system to get as much as possible out of the stock pump is going to cost a lot more than a cheap ass walbro.

 

[snox135]

That all depends on who you are and who you know. I upgraded my hole fuel line, filter and all for under thirty dollars. Yeah for most people it is probably just cheaper and/or easier to just do the fuel pump. I was just simply stating that it's not the fuel pump that is being over run it's the fuel system. If you read is article they went from 1.9 lpm @60psi to ~ 10 lpm @ 60 psi with the fuel system mod. Also with the fuel pressure raised to 75 psi he only received .1 lpm extra on the stock system. If you are short on money you can free up some of the resistance by doing the fuel filter and replace the line and fittings to the fuel rail.

 

[Mr.Tao]

Haha run the stock fuel pump... That should have been like a tune up as soon as you got the car, Put the walbro pump in.. I'll post in your next thread soon to help you out..

What thead you just asked? This one..

"Help, Ran stock fuel pump, Large injectors, Turbo etc etc.. Car went boom klank clunk BOOM, DSM'S are unreliableee!!!!!"

Yea i kinda knew PTE's werent flowing what they were rated. And I have a 6 Bolt so I have the Power Knob. Will the CAS or watever it is called have enough timing retard to compensate for an EPROM?

 

[sweet97]

HUH? You should go to www.dsmchips.com and check out what an EPROM chipcan do. The ECU will think your 650's are 450's and stay in the proper map. You cannot gofar with a stock block and a 60-1. I have a rebuilt 6 bolt and Buschur suggests staying at/under 20 PSI on pump, that's with a new Buschur stage 3 motor. Good luck with it though! Mark

 

[onegee]

Yea i kinda knew PTE's werent flowing what they were rated. And I have a 6 Bolt so I have the Power Knob. Will the CAS or watever it is called have enough timing retard to compensate for an EPROM?

You are very confused.

The purpose of the eprom is to make your 680s idle like stock along w/ getting your deadtime and global settings adjusted for them. This also makes sure you're not running crazy timing advance due to the piggyback tuning you're doing w/ an AFC or MAFT.

If you get an eprom, you will NOT need to play w/ the CAS (Cam Angle Sensor).

IMHO, Id just get a 1g DSMLink. You can run bigger injectors for "down the line" as well as compensate for them easily. Its well worth the money since you figure in the cost for getting several eprom chips and tuning devices along w/ logging tools (pocketlogger, palm, etc.) and the cost is close to a DSMlink setup.

www.dsmlink.com if you haven't read it before.

-R

 

[Mr.Tao]

Ok, I know what eprom and DSMLINK can do already. I have another question, With DSMLINK out for both the 1g and 2g, which ecu is better to play with? OBD1 or OBD2? But I was wishing someone outthere have ran big injectors without ecu mods successfully.

 

[onegee]

Ok, I know what eprom and DSMLINK can do already. I have another question, With DSMLINK out for both the 1g and 2g, which ecu is better to play with? OBD1 or OBD2? But I was wishing someone outthere have ran big injectors without ecu mods successfully.

WTF

Why are you going to put an OB2 ECU in your 1g? Makes no sense. People have done it a few times just to run DSMLink before a 1g version was out, other than that I dont see an advantage.

Define "successfully". People have done it but there is so many better options now than trying to tune around too much timing advance. Its been stated NUMEROUS times in this thread why people dont run big injectors on piggy back systems, too much timing advance. You can ask the question 100 different ways and you're going to get the same answer. Either do the eprom mods/dsmlink or live with too much timing.

 

[sweet97]

Mr. Tao you are also lacking at least a half dozen required mods to run that 60-1 besides the injector issue. Start building up the supporting mods. FMIC, Walbro/AFPR, injectors, EPROM ECU/chip, then hope your motor can stay together. 14b to 60-1 is a bigjump. Mark

 

[boostedinaz]

This thread hurts my head.

First off you don't want to run race gas but bought a turbo that wont be efficient at pump gas boost levels. You should have gone with something like a 50 trim that is know to be a pump gas monster.

You really need to get ALL of the CORRECT supporting mods to run this turbo before even thinking of putting it on.

I have never understood why so many people want to do so many half assed things to just get by. Why not do it right and have no worries or bandaids for fixes? Do it right do it once.


Get an EPROM ecu and have a chip made for your injectors. Buy a fuel pump and FPR and then tune away all day long. You car will run better and make more power than just tossing a bunch of crap at it.

 

[UPGRADED2G]

^^^^bingo, there it is!!!!