Timing belt went out - is what the shop charging me fair?

[dropped99gs]

So far I am considering myself extremely lucky. I was returning back to the Dallas Tx area from a trip visiting family. My g/f and I are cruising along and out of nowhere my car misses. My initial inclination is something with ignition/spark, or fuel delivery. I immediately exit and the car dies as I pull into the service station. I get out, pull my tools and everything, pop the hood. No fluids anywhere, no smoke or anything along those lines. So i pull the wired and take a couple of plugs out. It was overcast and raining so it was hard to judge, but initially i thought it was a spark plug or ignition coil problem. The plugs looked iffy and due to the hour it was not possible to get replacement. Thank goodness we have AAA and a 100 mile tow. It was 70 miles from where i was to home. The next day it would not stop raining, therefore I was forced to wait and make a determination. Yesterday the weather cleared and I was able to get under the hood. I checked for spark from the ignition coil and it was nonexistent. So I replaced the coil and plugs, turn her over and it was a no go. Scratched my head for a while, stood back, checked for spark again with new coil and nothing. Now the worry starts setting in. I have my g/f turn it over a few more times and i hear something around timing belt area. I pull the inspection cover and have her turn it over. Sure enough timing belt had worn down to wear it was just barely slipping. I live at an apartment complex and all of my family where i have access to shops and tools needed are about 2 hours away. So my only option was to tow to where I get work I cannot perform myself done. It was $50 flat rate in town tow, and the shop charged $92 for compression and leak down tests to ensure no valves were bent etc. That was were I received the first piece of good news, no bent valves and everything checked out with even compression across the board.

So far everything seems fair. Then I was given the estimate for the timing belt replacement.

Without parts, but including tow and labor performed and the labor costs for replacement work the bill is at $694. So minus the tow and comp/leak tests its around $550.

I was told that they are going to have to decharge and recharge my a/c. I know that service alone costs close to $200. From the forums and other research I have not seen anything involving the a/c.

I've located the parts myself and after calling around and internet research heres what I'm paying for parts.

$90 for hydraulic tensioner
$105 for timing belt kit w/ idle and adjustment pulleys

Initially the shop was going to charge me $189 for timing belt kit alone.

I'm picking the parts up tomorrow at CarQuest - they earned a new loyal customer with their price matching - they didn't just match the price either, they beat it.

I like this shop, its owner operated and all the work I've had performed there thus far has been A+. They have never tried to up-sale another repair and their hourly rate is competitive.

These guys know what they are doing and were chuckling about all the timing belts they've done when this engine was fresh on the market.

The only thing about the repair costs I'm having trouble understanding is the a/c work. Is that necessary to perform this job or not?

I would like to see that $550 in labor become more like $300.
My goal when all is said and done is be as close to $600 as I can.
I'm already at $350 with timing kit, tensioner, the tow and tests.
Am I being unreasonable and hoping for too much or should I be able to get the labor bill down to $300?


1999 GS Anniversary edition -

 

[tenn-gsx]

That seems a bit high to me. 300 for labor is more arround a reasonable price if ya ask me. And no way in hell does the A/C need to be screwed with.

Edit: You have a 420A. Disregard everything I said. I have no idea what needs to be done and the associated cost on your car.

 

[jaycemocapaldi]

You my friend should probably go buy a Loto ticket! you may very well win! then split half and half with me cause it was my idea

 

[brandonwh64]

If you have the time and tools, you could easily do it yourself. I read through my Haynes manual and it say nothing about discharging AC to do this task. The link below is a full guide to installing a new belt with pictures.

Timing Belt VFAQ

 

[phunny]

$500 is fair. As for the A/C, they shouldn't touch it at all. You have to realize if you bring your own parts labor is going to go up, that's business my friend.

 

[19BLACKGST98]

Dallas DSM get on there and ask ligo12 from mudpit performance what he charges. Hes saved me so much money over the years.
His shop is located in princeton though.

 

[dropped99gs]

If you have the time and tools, you could easily do it yourself. I read through my Haynes manual and it say nothing about discharging AC to do this task. The link below is a full guide to installing a new belt with pictures.

Timing Belt VFAQ

I'm about to read the link you posted with the guide and print it out and take it to the shop and show them if they argue the point. Thank you so much, this is exactly what i was looking for.

$500 is fair. As for the A/C, they shouldn't touch it at all. You have to realize if you bring your own parts labor is going to go up, that's business my friend.

Actually the labor costs are staying the same. I have brought my own parts to them before and the labor costs stayed the same.
I'm hoping that by eliminating the a/c work I can save $200 on the labor.

I should have done this all anyway when I purchased the car a few months ago. I looked at the timing belt when I got it and it looked fine. I'm assuming it dry rotted just as the tires did. They tires were brand new when I got it but the car had sat for about 2 years. I did everything else but the timing belt and pumps.

I'm electing not to do the water pump or any seals due to the fact including purchase of the car, overhaul, and all new stereo I've put out $4,000. I've kicked myself a few times for not just taking the extra money i used for the overhaul and not ordering a hahn kit or piecing together my own. I had the money, but instead i spent it all ensuring the car was solid and would remain so. Evidence of that paid off considering I was going down the highway when the timing belt wore just a little too much. Not a single bent valve or anything.

Edit: Just looked at water pump and gasket, only another $40 and it is time, car has 102,000 miles. Will be picking one of those up tomorrow as well. I'm also looking into everything else now that could be replaced while they already have everything off. Will save money in the long run to fork out another $100 in parts now, rather than something go out or break and go through this again if I can't access as shop and do the work myself. I'm mechanically inclined and I have patience when it comes to taking stuff apart and putting it back together.

We shall see.

Thanks for the feedback.

Dallas DSM get on there and ask ligo12 from mudpit performance what he charges. Hes saved me so much money over the years.
His shop is located in princeton though.

I'm a member of dallasdsm as well and I actually went through princeton in the town truck but I was optimistic it was something minor I could do at the apartments.

I will probably give them a shout and see what they charge and use that as a reference when I take the parts in tomorrow. Hopefully I will have my baby back by this weekend.

I'm in Denton as well.

 

[Shake_Zulla]

I'm electing not to do the water pump or any seals due to the fact including purchase of the car, overhaul, and all new stereo I've put out $4,000. I've kicked myself a few times for not just taking the extra money i used for the overhaul and not ordering a hahn kit or piecing together my own. I had the money, but instead i spent it all ensuring the car was solid and would remain so. Evidence of that paid off considering I was going down the highway when the timing belt wore just a little too much. Not a single bent valve or anything.

I am glad you threw that edit in before I could spout common sense to you .

Also what good is a killer turbo kit when your car is breaking down every week anyways. IMO maintenance comes before modification. Build a strong car before you build a fast one because after you turbo the little things can cause bigger and more damaging problems. With that said good luck man

 

[dropped99gs]

I am glad you threw that edit in before I could spout common sense to you .

Also what good is a killer turbo kit when your car is breaking down every week anyways. IMO maintenance comes before modification. Build a strong car before you build a fast one because after you turbo the little things can cause bigger and more damaging problems. With that said good luck man

I assumed the water pump would be higher than it is. Oil pump is going to be too much though, but i think that will be okay.
Going to take autozone's price and have carquest beat it.
Another future mod I will be doing shortly is a colder thermostat. Some crower stage 2's and a set of headers would complete and satisfy me until I go turbo.

I agree, I would much rather have a dd that i can thoroughly rely on.
Looks like I'm initiating the car savings fund again as well.
Was hoping to build the engine by the end of summer and go turbo by Christmas.
Internals may not be coming for a little while now . But after this is over and done with I firmly believe my car will be 100%.
Something I noticed I didn't catch before is that on the ignition coil, where the #2 wire connects it was a little rusted and signs of corrosion/wear. So I do not regret buying the ignition coil and new plugs before I realized the timing belt was the issue.
I'm actually excited to see how much better my car will perform with a new coil and iridium ix's. also have accel wires.

 

[phunny]

I would never put an autozone or any other water pump besides Mitsubishi on there.

 

[gearhead07]

Well in all data it calls for 4.7 hours to do the job and thats not including the pump. So i would say thats not bad at all. I have been doing this for 5 years and its just how it works, look at how much it cost at a returaunt.

What you payed isnt bad at all. They are in buisness to make money not to help you out. If you cant do it on your own then you realy cant complain

 

[dropped99gs]

Well in all data it calls for 4.7 hours to do the job and thats not including the pump. So i would say thats not bad at all. I have been doing this for 5 years and its just how it works, look at how much it cost at a returaunt.

What you payed isnt bad at all. They are in buisness to make money not to help you out. If you cant do it on your own then you realy cant complain

Well I also got the water pump and gasket, I'm actually about to walk out the door and go pick up the parts. Then it's to the shop to discuss everything. The reason for my inquiry was I was/am iffy about whether or not the a/c needed to be messed with. But not that I am doing the water pump they are going to have to drain and fill coolant.

The only thing holding me back from doing it myself is having somewhere to do it. As far as the puller and some other specialty tools I could rent from autozone.

Really wishing I knew it was the timing belt right off the bat and that I had already been in discussion with Mudpit performance. Would have just dropped my car off the town truck there.

Wish me luck.

 

[gearhead07]

On alldata it says add .5 hours for ac. So to me that means the lines or something just get in the way and have to be moved or worked around or sometrhing dumb. but also keep in mind that if the timing belt "went" and broke you are going to have to manualy reset the cam timing.

 

[burkgonzo]

Take it to Mudpit, end of story. He is fair and your call will drive again. He has alot of knowledge of Mitsus. Its mainly a DSM shop. Call up Brian and get it fixed.

 

[dropped99gs]

Well I dropped off all of the parts today. Turns out it was the tensioner and idler pulleys that went out. Preliminary tests show no bent valves or anythings.

Gates timing belt kit w/ pulleys
carquest water pump
carquest hydraulic tensioner
cam seals
crank seal
coolent
a/c work


Total came out to be $700 including tow and labor costs at the shop.
Parts costs $250. Plus $90 for coil and new plugs - turned out not necessary but I got em' so why not.
Comfort in knowing car is reliable - Pricless

Picking up my car tomorrow in the a.m. Can't wait.

 

[AK Maniak]

Well I dropped off all of the parts today. Turns out it was the tensioner and idler pulleys that went out. Preliminary tests show no bent valves or anythings.

Gates timing belt kit w/ pulleys
carquest water pump
carquest hydraulic tensioner
cam seals
crank seal
coolent
a/c work


Total came out to be $700 including tow and labor costs at the shop.
Parts costs $250. Plus $90 for coil and new plugs - turned out not necessary but I got em' so why not.
Comfort in knowing car is reliable - Pricless

Picking up my car tomorrow in the a.m. Can't wait.

Good luck with that carquest water pump. In all honesty you definitely should have gone OEM with that one but hopefully the carquest one doesn't shit out on you.

 

[shadow001dsm]

If you all look into motor all data online it will tell you what the flag time is. your flag time then you multiply it buy the labor rate. sounds high to me.

 

[brandonwh64]

I still don't understand why they have to discharge the AC. every tutorial i have looked at doesn't mention it anywhere! are they doing this to get more money?

 

[dropped99gs]

I still don't understand why they have to discharge the AC. every tutorial i have looked at doesn't mention it anywhere! are they doing this to get more money?

They said it made the job easier and saved some time.

He showed me all the labor times for each component and we discussed everything and why. I feel he is giving me a fair price, he even came down a couple hundred to help me out.

But after this I'm making a trip out to mudpit to take a look and get an impression.

The a/c work if I'm not mistaken he's only charging me a half hour of labor.

I just got the call and I'm on my was to pick her up.

 

[burkgonzo]

Live and learn.

 

[brandonwh64]

They said it made the job easier and saved some time.

He showed me all the labor times for each component and we discussed everything and why. I feel he is giving me a fair price, he even came down a couple hundred to help me out.

But after this I'm making a trip out to mudpit to take a look and get an impression.

The a/c work if I'm not mistaken he's only charging me a half hour of labor.

I just got the call and I'm on my was to pick her up.

So they are finished? That was quick! shops around here use your car as a lunch break area for a week before they finally fix it

 

[19BLACKGST98]

They said it made the job easier and saved some time.

He showed me all the labor times for each component and we discussed everything and why. I feel he is giving me a fair price, he even came down a couple hundred to help me out.

But after this I'm making a trip out to mudpit to take a look and get an impression.

The a/c work if I'm not mistaken he's only charging me a half hour of labor.

I just got the call and I'm on my was to pick her up.

What is the name of the shop you took it to? Is it in Denton? I made the mistake to take my car to a shop off of Fortworth drive and got ripped off.

 

[dropped99gs]

So they are finished? That was quick! shops around here use your car as a lunch break area for a week before they finally fix it

I've been there a few times before and have thrown down cash money, so they know as soon as my car is ready I'm there with the funds.

What is the name of the shop you took it to? Is it in Denton? I made the mistake to take my car to a shop off of Fortworth drive and got ripped off.

I took it too All Tune and Lube off of 35 by the mall, behind discount tire. The reason I went there initially was because when i had new tires put on Discount snapped my lug bolts and paid for me to have them replaced there. I spoke with Tim the owner and picked his brain. He immediately started talking about how the 420a was a chrysler engine and blah blah. After that I have taken my car there few things I could not do in the apartment parking lot without getting in trouble.

This last job though with the timing belt he hooked me up and knocked some labor costs down, even threw on new belts too with the job.
The only downside, and I'm calling him in the morning to see what they are going to do to fix it, somehow my bumper was damaged and it was not the tow truck. It wasnt perfect to begin with due to ride height, sometimes steep drives it scrapes. But the way it apears to me is someone either pulled up to a curb and when they backed off it snagged the bumber and basically from the brake vent on the drivers side, down around to the bottem heading toward the wheelwell it was torn.

I met with the owner of the tow truck company and Tim, we discussed the issue and how it could have happened. Tim doesn't seem like he wants to fork out the dough to make it right, I have the driver's statement that the tear was not there when he picked up or delivered the car. The tow company owner has been helpful by letting me know my rights and where I stand. I actually have pictures on my phone from a few days before the pulleys failing. One shows clearly there was no damage there.

Other than that, they do good honest work, and since he owns and operates he can help people out. I've never had to leave my car there overnight until this happened.

If you ever go tell them Billy with the eclipse sent you and they will know who you are refering to. Even after the bumper issue I would return there for work to be done.

 

[19BLACKGST98]

Oh ok. I know that place. I work out at Fitness Evolution and they tear ass across the parking lot all the time in customers cars to test out the job they did. I see all different cars come out of there and it always has customers so he must be fairly knowledgeable.

 

[dropped99gs]

I actually just spoke with Tim today and discussed the bumper issue again. Rather than attempt to get a new bumper, pain, blah blah, he says he can repair it to where you wouldnt even be able to see what happened. My delima now is I'm almost 2 hours away from denton. Not sure how long he would need my car for and I really dont want to camp out in a shop all day. I told him it's been long enough and that I need an answer by this weekend wether or not he himself or the tow company is going to take care or it.

On a different note, a few weeks ago I noticed driving one night that my amp and subs were dimming my lights. 2 alpine type r 10'a and rockford 800 watt. Was told that I should not need a capacitor but I'm running a 250A fuseblock beause Anything 150 or below I was blowing when I turned the bass up. I cruise with in dash subwoofer setting all the way down -15, and if I turned it up to -5 or more the fuse would go. I didnt think my system was large enough to worry about that. My last system was 2 12's and 1500w amp and I had no issues with dimming lights. Hoping my alternator or battery one isnt giving out.

Performance wise though car is a champion. Turned out to be a solid DD which is all I was really looking for.

Near future I will be replacing brake pads and I think that is about it.

As far as more mods, by the end of summer will have headers and full 2 1/5" exhaust. Really do not want to dump out bread when I want to go turbo.

Timing belt job killed the budget I had accumulated for interals. It will happen, just time and money, right?