ECMlink t28 tune, need advice

[99bluegst]

ok this is my first post of tuning, and im new to link, what i want to know is if im running save on my set up or do i need to bring boost down! anyways take a look at my log, thanks in advance.

mod list;

t28 turbo at 21 psi
wally 255 with fuel lap fpr
new bpr7 plugs and ngk wires
fic 850
plx wideband on rear o2

 

[99bluegst]

Anyone???

 

[T is for TURBO]

Can't see it at work. I'll take a look at it when I get home if I can remember

 

[99bluegst]

ok thanks man, really need some advice, thanks!!!

 

[WES_393]

Looks okay to me. You have a little knock up in the top end, so try pulling a degree of timing right where it knocks. Otherwise your AFR and everything look just fine.

 

[99bluegst]

Ok thanks! I'll try to on other pull after pulling some degre down

 

[Geier]

Your boostest is falling from 17psi to 12psi by the end of the run. You may have a boost leak somewhere. What BOV is on the car?

 

[Pipnorcali]

I cant see the file. But you shouldn't be droppin that much boost

 

[99bluegst]

im running 1g bov (dodge mode)

 

[Diamond Star Werks]

What mbc do you have? Sounds like your spring is too weak dropping boost like that.

 

[WFO-TSi]

Your boostest is falling from 17psi to 12psi by the end of the run. You may have a boost leak somewhere. What BOV is on the car?

I’d take “boostest” with a grain of salt…and some lime and tequila would probably be in order too. I’m at work and can’t view the file so I’ll ASSume that 99bluegst’s list of mods in his profile is accurate AND I’ll take his word for it when he said it’s at “21psi”. Instead of 17psi dropping to 12, I’m betting he’s peaking at 21psi and dropping to 17psi…which is what my FP28 w/17psi WGA did back in the day.

Also to clear something up…”boostest” wouldn’t show a boost leak, especially in this situation. That’s because the MAF which is reading airflow and kicking out the numbers utilized in the boostest calculation is (according to his mod list) the OE MAF and located pre-turbo.

 

[T is for TURBO]

I’d take “boostest” with a grain of salt…and some lime and tequila would probably be in order too. I’m at work and can’t view the file so I’ll ASSume that 99bluegst’s list of mods in his profile is accurate AND I’ll take his word for it when he said it’s at “21psi”. Instead of 17psi dropping to 12, I’m betting he’s peaking at 21psi and dropping to 17psi…which is what my FP28 w/17psi WGA did back in the day.

Also to clear something up…”boostest” wouldn’t show a boost leak, especially in this situation. That’s because the MAF which is reading airflow and kicking out the numbers utilized in the boostest calculation is (according to his mod list) the OE MAF and located pre-turbo.

Absolutely correct. Boostest is only accurate between 5000-5500RPM. And I for one SWEAR by running with map sensor. The ability to log boost makes life so much easier.

 

[99bluegst]

yes my mod list updated, my boost gauge read 17/18 at 5k 6k, i just order my gm 3bar sensor! one more think im only seen 27 lb/p at 6k that sucks

 

[c2ypt1c]

yes my mod list updated, my boost gauge read 17/18 at 5k 6k, i just order my gm 3bar sensor! one more think im only seen 27 lb/p at 6k that sucks

Are you absolutely sure it's a t28 and not a t25? I hit 28lb/min in my t25 at around 18 psi.

 

[Pipnorcali]

Did u pull a lil timing? And what octane gas u using? Its about the same setup as me ..i prob made 280hp on my 12 sec run. Save up for some slicks..

On a side note link has its own forum

 

[99bluegst]

Are you absolutely sure it's a t28 and not a t25? I hit 28lb/min in my t25 at around 18 psi.

wow that got me thinking, but im pretty sure it is a t28!just dont know why i cant seem to pass 27 lb/m even at higher boost! check iit out if is not a t28?

Did u pull a lil timing? And what octane gas u using? Its about the same setup as me ..i prob made 280hp on my 12 sec run. Save up for some slicks..

On a side note link has its own forum

no i did not pull timing, im running 93 octane, and i dont have access to the forum since im the original owner!

What mbc do you have? Sounds like your spring is too weak dropping boost like that.

i have and ebay one, and if i run wesgate pressure im only see boost 10 to 12 psi,

 

[Pipnorcali]

O 93 is fine we only get crappy 91 out here

 

[WFO-TSi]

99bluegst,

I recently sold my FP28 and looking at the pictures I took for my for-sale add and the ones you posted they look the same. That being said I am far from an expert on visually identifying turbo’s.

I’d bet your airflow and boost pressures are being limited by your WGA. You stated that running wastegate pressure nets you 10 – 12 psi which correlates with the factory rating for the WGA on a T28.

Below is a link to where Dennis Grant discuses finding the WGA on his FP28 being the limiting factor to running higher boost and how he fixed it.

Far North Racing - FP Upgraded Wastegate Actuator and Dyno Day

I’d contact JusMX141 on here directly and see if he still sells WGA’s with a higher rating. Otherwise you could try shimming the actuator that you already have.

Finally looking at the log you posted I would suggest zeroing out the sliders on your “Fuel Adjustment Table”, “Timing Adjustment Table”, and “Active MAF Compensation” tables. Since you are running the factory MAF there shouldn’t be any real reason to make changes to the compensation table. You’ve already made changes to the Direct Access tables for A/F ratio’s and timing…why take a step back and use sliders?

Back in early 2005 I dyno’d my FP28 setup and made 291.6 AWHP at an A/F of 11.3 I was also using the base factory timing table. I was running 92 octane premium and had a similar list of modifications. I’d recommend running the factory 2G timing tables and a 11:1 A/F ratio and work leaner from there. It worked well for me.

 

[99bluegst]

@WFO-TSI
thanks for the info man, ive switch to the stock 2g timing table and im still using the evo8 mod1 maxoctane tables, i cero out the fuel and mafcom tables and i turn down boost by 3 psi, i did a few pull tonight and seems i only knock when i pull timing, can some one help with this?,
im still dropping so much boost at 5/6k id upload some log just to give and idea!
by the way anyone have a o2 housing for sale for a tial external wasgate?.

 

[WFO-TSi]

99bluegst,

I’ve looked your logs over and it’s a good thing you posted up 4 different runs. All 4 logs have different levels of knock and at different places in the RPM band. Logs 1 & 2 are similar as are logs 2 & 4. The interesting thing when looking at 1 vs 2 is that log 2 has more knock than log 1 yet log 2 has a slightly cooler intake temp.

I’m stumped. I even went as far as to dig my old laptop out of storage to look at some of my ancient logs from my FP28 days. When comparing my dyno day logs to yours. I was definitely running leaner and with more timing. Being in the Seattle area my intake temps will be a bit lower on average and I did notice that I was running less that 70 degree’s for my intake temps on my dyno day.

That jogged my memory. A small turbo (any turbo) running at or past its max might as well be a flame thrower. I was having knock issues when running the FP28 until I built a cold air box for my open element air filter. I was logging in the 100’s due to the engine breathing in the hot underhood air. Fabbing a cold air box to shield the filter dropped my logged intake temps by 30+ degree’s thus enabling me to get more aggressive with my tune.

That’s my best guess…that or some sick jerk borrowed your car and filled it up with 85 octane gas

Oh btw, when viewing your MAP sensor its kicking out some crazy high boost levels

 

[Boost Demon]

On log#4 it seems that right as you hit 100% throttle you see some tip-in/phantom knock possibly. Go to the "ALS/Knck" tab and adjust the TPS percentage up to 15-25%.

edit: "WFO-TSi" is right, there are some odd things happening here that have me stumped as well. Under the MAF Comp tab, should the check box be checked for "Disable MAF Compensation w/ SD operation?"

 

[99bluegst]

@WFO-TSI
thanks for all the help man,its much appreciated! ill try built a cold air box for my air filter and see if that help a little, and i dont belief or wanna thing the turbo is running its max efficiency, i believe the t28 runs 37 lb/m out of the box!
and about the map sensor i was just curious and decided to test out a map sensor i got it from the junk yard, its a 2bar GM map sensor, but that clear everything that dint work, i order a 3bar map sensor hopefully i get tomorrow...

edit: "WFO-TSi" is right, there are some odd things happening here that have me stumped as well. Under the MAF Comp tab, should the check box be checked for "Disable MAF Compensation w/ SD operation?"[/QUOTE]


thats what im wondering too

 

[jrohner]

A better WGA can do wonders for holding boost, as long as you have any other issues sorted out first and have the supporting mods for more boost.

I run a Holset actuator on my 16G and can hold between 28-30psi all the way up. It runs around 20psi on wastegate pressure.

 

[WFO-TSi]

Here is what the DSMLink Wiki page has to say about the “Disable MAF Compensation w/ SD operation” check-box…

“Added checkbox option to automatically disable MAF compensation when running in SD mode. While technically possible, it's very unusual (and not really recommended) to use the MAF compensation dialog when running in SD mode. This change disables the MAF compensation tab by default when running in SD mode. This can be particularly useful when trying to dial in your SD VE table using a mass airflow sensor. When using this tool, you often find yourself swapping between the mass airflow sensor and SD mode. But when you swap into SD mode, you don't want all the same compensations in place that were used to dial the mass airflow sensor in. By disabling MAF compensation automatically while running in SD mode, you can freely swap between your mass airflow sensor and SD by simply selecting the appropriate Base MAF option.”

In other words don’t run it unless you are running Speed Density.

On to the comments posted by jrohner:

As I mentioned above, JusMX141 last I knew was fabricating WGA’s that could help a turbo in this position hold more boost to redline. Here is his post that goes into more detail.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tur...oking-strong-internal-wastegate-actuator.html

I’m just putting this in here for anyone else looking to hold more boost to redline. Based on the fact that 99bluegst asked if anyone had a O2 housing for sale to run an external Tial wastegate I’m betting he’s going that rout rather than a WGA upgrade.

 

[99bluegst]

ok heres what i was thinking to do since i have a spare t25 wesgate actuator!
take a look at the picture!! my idea is to make a new hole so bolt up tightly, please everyone comment if is a good idea, I'm on low budget right now and i can't afford for a holset actuator.