prove a mustang wrong

[BrokenTsi]

Mustangs prove themselves wrong.

In any case, I'm pretty sure the vehicle in question here is a Ford, not an Audi. I've never seen a coil upgrade on a Mustang.

 

[dsm-onster]

A larger gap guarantees a larger current draw from the coil. Simple Ohm's Law here. Higher current draw at the same voltage (voltage NEVER changes in a closed coil system) means more wattage, or power. More power eats components (see welding). It also puts more heat in the coils. Which is why they break.

Increasing cylinder pressure at the spark moment (higher boost, higher compression, etc) means that the spark has to travel through more resistance to get from one electrode to the other. This automatically begs more current, thus more wattage. See above paragraph.

A colder plug helps reduce the resistance across the electrodes for various reasons. . . Search on google concerning this. It's boring to type this out; electrical engineering is not as dynamic as mechanical engineering and fluid dynamics frankly.

Closing the gap on a hotter plug helps reduce the duty on the coils as well. Less resistance. Ohm's Law.

 

[Benshooter]

A larger gap guarantees a larger current draw from the coil. Simple ohm's law here. Higher current draw at the same voltage (voltage NEVER changes in a closed coil system) means more wattage, or power. More power eats components (see welding). It also puts more heat in the coils. Which is why they break.

Increasing cylinder pressure at the spark moment (higher boost, higher compression, etc) means that the spark has to travel through more resistance to get from one electrode to the other. This automatically begs more current, thus more wattage. See above paragraph. A colder plug helps reduce the resistance across the electrodes.

I'm really starting to like this guy....

 

[Thomas91169]

Please re-read my original post. Nowhere in it do I say air pressure kills coils. As far as the gap, I'll let you prove it to yourself. Go pull the plugs on a VW/Audi 1.8t or 2.8 or 2.7t motor and add about .05 and see how long the coils last. I don't know if a larger than spec gap has an effect on any other COP's but with those, it will kill them.

Reread mine then, i wasnt just targeting you, and since my post was mostly boost-kill-coil related, dont get your panties in a wad.

A larger gap guarantees a larger current draw from the coil. Simple Ohm's Law here. Higher current draw at the same voltage (voltage NEVER changes in a closed coil system) means more wattage, or power. More power eats components (see welding). It also puts more heat in the coils. Which is why they break.

Increasing cylinder pressure at the spark moment (higher boost, higher compression, etc) means that the spark has to travel through more resistance to get from one electrode to the other. This automatically begs more current, thus more wattage. See above paragraph.

A colder plug helps reduce the resistance across the electrodes for various reasons. . . Search on google concerning this. It's boring to type this out; electrical engineering is not as dynamic as mechanical engineering and fluid dynamics frankly.

Closing the gap on a hotter plug helps reduce the duty on the coils as well. Less resistance. Ohm's Law.

Finally some actual info.

 

[crash89]

I know I dont know a ton on this subject but I know that the coil recieves a signal from the ecu which in turn will spark the plug at the predetemined time (tdc compression stroke) regaurdless if the gap is correct or not. The coil just does what its told, like stated above it doesnt have a mind it cant think for itself. It has no idea if it needs to "work harder" or not. Just does what its friggin told to!

The boost-a-spark thing to me just sounds like an aftermarket coil pack that produces a larger amperage or stronger signal to the plug?? Thats just me though.

 

[derrickeclipse]

when i had a crappy ford mustang 2003. tuned by Dallas mustang here in TX. i was wanting to get better coil packs for the car but they told me it would be a waste of money. the stock coils are well known to handle anything you throw at them. but only bad thing those coils go bad all the time just cause there worthless. ( they don't go bad due to performance upgrade, they go bad cause they suck. most off everything above it correct. so over all you are correct so rub it in his face, also tell him on behalf of the dsmers nation wide ford blows hard thanks

 

[joescool2008]

I love my ford truck, i drive it around to get the parts for my dsm D:.

 

[CHAR-FT]

Just because its a ford or any make but Mitsu it sucks right? haha you guys kill me. Do not speak for the entire DSM community for which you have been a part of for almost two months, I know plenty of people on here that love other cars and are completly die-hard DSM fans like myself.

Thanks

 

[dsm-onster]

They ALL blow... Henry Ford should have been drawn and quartered [with horses no less] for introducing an automobile into the middleclass. We all would be happier with buggies and bad gas from rye feed.

 

[SpawnedX]

This thread is made of so much fail and stupidity.

I'm not gonna name people, but over 50% of you need to stop working on cars immediately as you clearly have no understanding of something as simple as an ignition system. The rest of you are talking about boost like it is some magical juice coming out of your turbo.

Just take this Mustang owner out back, as well as most of the people in this thread, and stomp a hole in their heads. All they are gonna end up doing is blowing their own crap up.

 

[boostNmetal]

A larger gap guarantees a larger current draw from the coil. Simple Ohm's Law here. Higher current draw at the same voltage (voltage NEVER changes in a closed coil system) means more wattage, or power. More power eats components (see welding). It also puts more heat in the coils. Which is why they break.

Increasing cylinder pressure at the spark moment (higher boost, higher compression, etc) means that the spark has to travel through more resistance to get from one electrode to the other. This automatically begs more current, thus more wattage. See above paragraph.

A colder plug helps reduce the resistance across the electrodes for various reasons. . . Search on google concerning this. It's boring to type this out; electrical engineering is not as dynamic as mechanical engineering and fluid dynamics frankly.

Closing the gap on a hotter plug helps reduce the duty on the coils as well. Less resistance. Ohm's Law.

I agree with most of all of this, well said.

Keep in mind however, as per Ohm's law, as resistance increases, current decreases. The reason for the increased coil power output is because when the resistance to a spark jumping the gap on a spark plug increases, the ignition coil is allowed to build a higher voltage before the spark jumps the gap which almost instantly reduces the voltage back to zero.

Higher voltage = more current = more wattage = harder working coil.

How do you figure voltage can remain constant, dsm-onster?

 

[SpawnedX]

People need to understand what an ignition system does, the coil is basically a power amplifier in it's simplest terms, to keep the brightness of the spark consistent. Generally speaking the power of the spark is not stronger or weaker at any RPM or power level. There are slight variations, but it is outside the scope of this conversation. 12 volts is constantly supplied to your coils and the computer decides which coil to fire, because really that's all the system does is determine spark timing.

We use a waste-spark system, basically two cylinders fire spark at one time. The one on the end of the compression stroke is all that matters, the other spark is "wasted." Just for those interested.

Anyway back to my main point that spark is generally not noticeably stronger amongst the load and range of the engine. Therefore, no matter how much "boost" you introduce to the cylinder the spark is going to be the same strength. The extra air requires more fuel and the strength of that spark is simply a larger combustion.

Picture it this way take a piece of wood and then take a piece of wood doused in fuel. Take a standard match, O2 is unlimited, so all that matters is the fuel, the size of the spark from the match is the same as well. Which one burns hotter and faster?

The difference in a car is that the boost, more oxygen, is the air needed to let that combustion be as effective as possible. The spark never needs to change.

So if you are still following me, your coil is not working harder because of boost, therefore it's not boost that's burning out his coil. It's an electrical problem or a crappy coil. Either one is applicable with Fords.

---

To further expand on this, take those same pieces of wood, but pretend each time one ignites it is magically replaced with a new piece. If you throw the match at it, once a minute, you can probably do it for hours before your arm gets tired. Your arm is the coil for this example.

Now try to do it 200 times a minute, your arm gets tired quick. That's what kills a coil is how often it has to fire, which is based on engine speed and not the amount of boost you are introducing.

 

[boostNmetal]

There are slight variations, but it is outside the scope of this conversation.

Yeah, that's the stuff I was getting at

 

[Colt4G63 also]

It makes sense to me. I know that a coil will only produce as much secondary voltage as required to jump the gap, not more. A coil that's rated to produce 60,000 volts might only produce 15-20,000 to idle an engine. Denser fuel and air mean more resistance right? It stands to reason that if the coil sucks, more boost could kill it. Why would you bother arguing about it anyways?

Hook your ignition scope up and look at the results for yourself if you don't believe it. If you don't have an ignition scope you can come by my shop and I'll give you a demonstration for the low price of $73 per hour.

 

[natertater]

that dude is an idiot, and op, awesome name! btw, everyone on here is right. electricity doesnt care, it travels path of least resistance, and the coil just takes 12vdc and turns it into 35k vdc or whatever the crappy motor craft are rated at. the ONLY reason i can think of why you would need a boost a spark is because you are a moron and dont know how to buy colder plugs and run a smaller gap...tell him to grow some brain cells, sell his ford, and get colder plugs and run a slightly smaller gap...nuff said!

oh yeah, waste spark is waste totally. the other fires on the exhaust stroke before compression...kinda dumb eh? i thought so too. i guess it costs too much to engineer a system with separate coils than to do teh waste spark system with shared coils...

and ds-monster and the proven on here know a lot of automotive stuff. listen to them, and give "mustang man" their info and let them tell him he is a tard.