OBX Throttle Body Spacer DSM Eclipse NT 420A 95-99

[clipsit]

Just wondering if anyone has seen this on eBay and know anything about it? I was searching around and came across it. I know Helix makes one advertised for the eclipse, but its for the neon, so just wondering if this is the same thing, or if the 420a finally got a bolt on TB spacer...?


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=016&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=260076930505&rd=1&rd=1

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[talon749]

IMO this isnt going to do too much I thought TB spacers were only good on TBI cars like old trucks; I think it swirled the air/fuel or something? I dono

 

[chris712vt]

i've always wondered what the point of a TB spacer like that is... is it just meant to redirect the air flow into a swirl or what? does make a difference?

 

[TalonESIT]

This Info is according to Powerdyne's TB spacers:

PowerPlates throttle body spacers from Powerdyne provide a cost effective aftermarket adjustment for immediate horsepower gains up to 14%. Powerdyne's powerful throttle body spacers force a higher air intake velocity by increasing the distance between the stock throttle body and the intake manifold. That increased air flow means substantial gains in horsepower, torque and gas efficiency.

Here is one more provided by automedia:

Most people know that colder weather makes things contract. The colder gas is when it enters the combustion chamber, the more air can be added to it to create a bigger explosion, which generates more power. In many cases, longer pathways permit greater heat dissipation. This is the theory behind aftermarket throttle-body spacers: increase the distance the fuel travels by spacing the injector farther away from the intake manifold.

Problem with spacers, which I am seeing a lot of honda people love::bleh::, is it makes a hissing noise (even with the gaskets). Im guessing the hissing noise is due to an air leak and not a bonus, please correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[4UH8ERS]

Problem with spacers, which I am seeing a lot of honda people love::bleh::, is it makes a hissing noise (even with the gaskets). Im guessing the hissing noise is due to an air leak and not a bonus, please correct me if i'm wrong.

No, not an air leak. The spacer accepts the same gasket as the Throttle body itself. The Noise it makes is because of the re-directed spiraling air, similar to the noise large capacity air intakes make. Like a brief supercharger or turbo whining sound when making boost its not very loud. I had one on my 99 mustang gt and power gains are unnoticeable the only thing i noticed immediatly was a little change in exhaust tone.

 

[TalonESIT]

No, not an air leak. The spacer accepts the same gasket as the Throttle body itself. The Noise it makes is because of the re-directed spiraling air, similar to the noise large capacity air intakes make. Like a brief supercharger or turbo whining sound when making boost its not very loud. I had one on my 99 mustang gt and power gains are unnoticeable the only thing i noticed immediatly was a little change in exhaust tone.

ahh, thanks for the insight 4UH8ERS. I didn't think that it would pose much of a gain in power, but the thing that really caught my eye was the claim for better gas mileage! Is this a myth as well, or very little of a difference, because this turbo loves that fuel.

 

[dr1665]

IMO, this is how I would upgrade the intake system on a 2GNT, in order of importance.

-K&N filter
-short "ram" intake
-bored TB to 56/57mm
-gasket match stock intake manifold
-machine down injector castings in lower intake manifold per Eddy Fierro
-build isolation (cold air) box around filter element
-wrap intake piping with heat reflection material
-wrap isolation box with heat reflection matieral
-fab duct to direct fresh air supply to isolation box
-have entire intake manifold Extrude Honed
-fab phenolic spacer to go between lower intake manifold and head (isolate from heat)
-consider TB spacer
-consider wrapping entire IM with heat reflective material to further reduce charge temps

So you can see how important I think something like this is.

 

[SleeperG]

I would speculate the only gains woudl be due to an increase in the effective size of the plenum by adding the spacer.

swirling however...

how much was it? i woudln't get one less it was under 25 bucks.
and it woudl be pretty shitty to have to have ANOTHER throttle body gasket.

 

[clipsit]

I'd say in turbo application 420a's it might yield a few ponies and maybe atomize the a/f mixture a little better...? But maybe someone can try it out and see, maybe Rand can or somone else who has turbo and someone who is NT? They arent that expensive and if i still had mine i would prob check it out.

 

[selmerguy]

IMO, this is how I would upgrade the intake system on a 2GNT, in order of importance.

-K&N filter
-short "ram" intake
-bored TB to 56/57mm
-gasket match stock intake manifold
-machine down injector castings in lower intake manifold per Eddy Fierro
-build isolation (cold air) box around filter element
-wrap intake piping with heat reflection material
-wrap isolation box with heat reflection matieral
-fab duct to direct fresh air supply to isolation box
-have entire intake manifold Extrude Honed
-fab phenolic spacer to go between lower intake manifold and head (isolate from heat)
-consider TB spacer
-consider wrapping entire IM with heat reflective material to further reduce charge temps

So you can see how important I think something like this is.

I think the TB spacer is a waste of money and effort. And DR I have been on this site for a long time and talked to you quite a bit on here but I am going to edit your list.
-Boost IT!
-K&N filter
-bored TB to 56/57mm
-gasket match stock intake manifold
-machine down injector castings in lower intake manifold per Eddy Fierro
-build isolation (cold air) box around filter element
-wrap intake piping with heat reflection material
-wrap isolation box with heat reflection matieral
-fab duct to direct fresh air supply to isolation box
-have entire intake manifold Extrude Honed
Na Preformance products are pointless on the 420a. It just does not respond well to NA.

 

[clipsit]

I still think that someone should get it and try it on a turbo 420a! It prob wont do anything, but you wont know until you try it though. Do a dyno pull w/ it off and then install it and see the gains and put it to rest. Just my 2 cents even though, this all may be true and they are crap.

 

[cimotorsports]

I dont see how it can make any gains personally, what are you swirling, plain air? Maybe on a tbi since the injector sits right there , i could see a better air/fuel mixture happening on that , id save your money and bore the throttle body or do another cheap mod

 

[clipsit]

I dont see how it can make any gains personally, what are you swirling, plain air? Maybe on a tbi since the injector sits right there , i could see a better air/fuel mixture happening on that , id save your money and bore the throttle body or do another cheap mod

True, but I just saw it so I thought I would stir some thoughts about it. It prob wont do anything, but prob wouldnt hurt to try it out and see...? Just was thinking maybe, just maybe... Like they say...don't knock it til you try it...! Or maybe you should...

 

[BigRand]

Ramses....just can't stay away from the 420a parts can ya.... I thought you moved on........

But hey if you buy it I might try it, and run it on the dyno down at macy's shop. But first donate to my megasquirt fund .

 

[clipsit]

Ramses....just can't stay away from the 420a parts can ya.... I thought you moved on........

But hey if you buy it I might try it, and run it on the dyno down at macy's shop. But first donate to my megasquirt fund .

You so funny......I was actually looking for a valve cover on eBay and came across it. I remember buying a helix one when i had my car, but it was for the neon, but i had to save it and ask on here, for all of the 420a guys.

 

[dr1665]

Na Preformance products are pointless on the 420a. It just does not respond well to NA.

Oh man. It just doesn't respond well to bolt on NA improvements. There is a distinct difference between how my NA car runs and how most others run... and I've got a blown HG and no tune. Look at Mark! He's got pretty much the same work done to his car and he's in the mid 14s with it. That's GST/TSi or better.

The only thing keeping me from going back to stock so I can raise money to put a cage into the Galant is that Daisy is f*cking awesome to drive. Between 3000 and 5000rpm, she's nothing like a 2GNT.

 

[selmerguy]

Oh man. It just doesn't respond well to bolt on NA improvements. There is a distinct difference between how my NA car runs and how most others run... and I've got a blown HG and no tune. Look at Mark! He's got pretty much the same work done to his car and he's in the mid 14s with it. That's GST/TSi or better.

The only thing keeping me from going back to stock so I can raise money to put a cage into the Galant is that Daisy is f*cking awesome to drive. Between 3000 and 5000rpm, she's nothing like a 2GNT.

I love you man. Really I do. You are a die-hard 2gnt'er. I dont miss my 420a at all. I do miss the 2g look though Sorry to go off topic but DR is the man.

 

[Focker420]

I have a throttle body spacer from air aid and i bought this a while ago and the install was fairly easy, Installed Spacers for the throttle cable and i needed an extra gasket for the TB spacer to the TB, And it came with one for the TB spacer to the intake manifold.The only problem i found with the install was the space between the intake piping and the battery hold down.
It took slight modification to the 90 deg elbow bend and my injen cold air piping was touching the bracket for the hold battery hold down. And started to wear through with the engine movement.

The gain was alright don't expect a new ride but i would say that the gain was anywere from 3 - 5 whp. This was on a 2gN/T, I choose the Air aid because of the deep threads cut into the spacer. The point of the spacer is to make the air coming into the intake manifold more compressable by swirling the air.

I really only noticed the gain from 4k - 6k rpm. And paid a total of 100 bucks for the peice and the extra gasket. Mine sounds pretty badass cause i whistles at 25% throttle and almost everyone asks if i got a turbo under their. I will this spring tho

If your looking for the easy bolt on. To get every last pony outta good old betsey than go for it. But if your looking for big incresses in hp then save up for that turbo.

Ill let you know the gain with the spacer when i dyno it with the new turbo.

 

[clipsit]

I have a throttle body spacer from air aid and i bought this a while ago and the install was fairly easy, Installed Spacers for the throttle cable and i needed an extra gasket for the TB spacer to the TB, And it came with one for the TB spacer to the intake manifold.The only problem i found with the install was the space between the intake piping and the battery hold down.
It took slight modification to the 90 deg elbow bend and my injen cold air piping was touching the bracket for the hold battery hold down. And started to wear through with the engine movement.

The gain was alright don't expect a new ride but i would say that the gain was anywere from 3 - 5 whp. This was on a 2gN/T, I choose the Air aid because of the deep threads cut into the spacer. The point of the spacer is to make the air coming into the intake manifold more compressable by swirling the air.

I really only noticed the gain from 4k - 6k rpm. And paid a total of 100 bucks for the peice and the extra gasket. Mine sounds pretty badass cause i whistles at 25% throttle and almost everyone asks if i got a turbo under their. I will this spring tho

If your looking for the easy bolt on. To get every last pony outta good old betsey than go for it. But if your looking for big incresses in hp then save up for that turbo.

Ill let you know the gain with the spacer when i dyno it with the new turbo.

Sounds good. Thats what I am talking about. Good luck on going turbo!

 

[rcjr9186]

i don't see how this would increase hp... i mean really if the only thing this does is create extra distance between the tb and intake manifold... all it does is create extra distance.... so if i extend my CAI in my eclipse by 3" will it give me the same effect??? no!

 

[dr1665]

i don't see how this would increase hp... i mean really if the only thing this does is create extra distance between the tb and intake manifold... all it does is create extra distance.... so if i extend my CAI in my eclipse by 3" will it give me the same effect??? no!

In order to understand how something like this would work, you have to think of things in terms of air velocity and fluid dynamics. Adding three inches to your CAI will nto have the same effect, because it's completely unrelated. Think about it. All the upgrades you do to your intake system are intended to increase flow. You get a K&N filter to increase flow.

Here's where you might be missing the bus. A large component of flow is turbulence. While we're talking about air, it's all a study in fluid dynamics (think of how water acts). In order for air to flow at high velocities, it needs a smooth path to follow. Your K&N filter flows more because it is is designed to reduce turbulence through the filter. This means more airflow to the intake. The intake pipe is free of sharp bends and rubber/plastic corrugation in order to provide a smooth, turbulence-free path for the air to the throttle body.

Theoretically, a TB spacer plate will move the throttle plate away from the plenum a bit so that the air has a chance to smooth out after tumbling past the butterfly. This inherent turbulence forces the air to slow down. When the air slows down, it reduces the velocity of the air charge directly behind it and the entire system becomes less efficient.

Are OEM TBs so inefficient that a spacer is needed? Not at all. In fact, the point I was trying to make a month ago when we first started talking about this subject, was that such a consideration to intake system design is best left for those individuals who are in the top 1% of the DSM community in terms of engine output. For anyone else, there are likely numerous other products or services which woudl provide a greater value.

Products like this are more intended to separate the uneducated tuner from his hard-earned money. Begin your mod path with proper maintenance. After that, install those mods which are proven to provide the greatest gains before your worry about the little ways to eek out those last couple ponies.

Hope this helps. If you're going to shoot something down, try to at least explain in a way that doesn't leave the rest of us remembering the last choad at Circle K who told us we needed a T-66 turbo, Spoon engine, and a MoTec system exhaust.

Thank you and good day, sir.

 

[4UH8ERS]

Products like this are more intended to separate the uneducated tuner from his hard-earned money. Begin your mod path with proper maintenance. After that, install those mods which are proven to provide the greatest gains before your worry about the little ways to eek out those last couple ponies.
.

+1 for this comment.

 

[adammethner05]

If you're going to shoot something down, try to at least explain in a way that doesn't leave the rest of us remembering the last choad at Circle K who told us we needed a T-66 turbo, Spoon engine, and a MoTec system exhaust.

Thank you and good day, sir.

...Not a bad way to spend ten thousand dollars

 

[clipsit]

Thanks for the explanation dr1665...It was just out of mere curiosity than anything else. When I had my NA I never bought one, and most TB spacers only have a bigger HP gain in bigger motors, such as V8's and what not, but def understood though...

 

[Blitzeclips]

I seriously wouldn't even put that on my car if you gave it to me for free.