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how much hp you have?

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good theory but not exactly. when the air compresses in the intake track it doesnt put more air in there. liek for example, take the zex air filter with the nitrous bung in it. it shoots nitrous in the air intake for the specific reason to do such idea, but when you add the nitrous and the air in the intake your gettin more cfm through the intake. but dotn forget when you spray the nitrous your adding n20 particles in the air intake alog with a few more aid molecules. it allows more room for air to enter in intake track by compressing it

now say if you have a intake for arguement sake that flows 300cfm well say. you spray nitrous in there you get an extra 40cfm ok, no that nitrous doesnt hit the motor at all when sprayed at end of intake track. its disapated by the time it hits motor. ok here example number on.

number 2, is if your runnign dirrect port nitrous oxide in your motor. its put in the intake track at the last second. dirrect port is at the very end of the intake manifold right before the head. you have no more tim eto add more air in there. the air in the intake track is allready there over and done with waiting to make its way into the head. when the nitrou s hits it say you have the same cfm of 300 then add nitrous on top. wont give you anymore cfm and will add nitrous to make the power. now say your running a 75 shot, you will not see 75 hp form this unless your motor is the most effecient it can be. but with different atmosperical pressures, elevation, and humidity it wont be. at any given time in a natural habitat your motor will not run 75hp form a 75 shot due to variations in the air.

number 3, say you run same 75 shot but in the intake track right before the throttle body. same hting you wont add any more air into the intalke track. the air in there is compressing to get the nitrous in there. its basically moving out of the way and adding the nitrous molucules in the air exsisting in the intake track. but same will go for number 2 i forgot to mention. nitrous disipates in the air while is travels to combustion chamber. dirrect port is the closest and you will see most gains form it as it has no time to really disipate. but some does. in the intake track it has time to dissipate so you will see less gains from it vs dirrect port nitrous.



ok i think im done. thats basically how it works on everythign ive read on nitrous and motors. it gets way in depth but that how i understood it in my words. :cool:




also i found that video link. linky no work but if you can get ti to work this is the dyno pull i was talking about. high hp and doesnt get the hpxshto size. sick video too :thumb:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34476&highlight=team+nabr
 
GSGoinFast said:
heres how i see it happening. when the air is compressed by a turbo charger, the natural reaction of air being compressed is it heats up. when it heats up it expands. now you can be running X amount of boost, but that is the pressure, not the air density. so the air density isnt as high as it could be because its hot, and its expansion causes the pressure. when the cold nitrous is injected into the hot expanded air the air is cooled and contracts. now your running the boost with higher then normal air density, plus the high oxygen density of nitrous after it breaks apart under high heat. those are some of the reasons why you get so much power. i think boost creep may also be apart of it. ill try and get dsmjim to get in here.


Thats a whole lot of science right there.

Ok here is what I'm talking about. I goto the dyno (this is real) with a car that is turbocharged with a single nossle nitrous kit from NX. The turbo alone the car makes 345whp and with a 50hp shot of nitrous the car makes 449whp. The 50hp shot made 100whp.

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The cooling effect of nitrous on a turbocharged car is where the extra power comes from.

On another car that was NA with an NX nitrous kit, a 100hp shot made exactly 104hp and 136ft/lbs of torque. This was my fathers VQ30DE motor in his 95 Nissan Maxima that went 12.1 @ 109mph. We sprayed it with 150hp shot to get to that time.

I have been on the dyno with direct port and single nossle. Direct port does not make any more power than single nossle does at the same jetting level. I have sprayed cars as high as 200hp with a single nossle kit and recorded dyno runs with 200+hp increases across the band.

I try to not get that scientific with CFM and air flow etc etc.. What I know is because I goto the dyno an tune cars, have been there done that kinda thing. 100whp gains from 50hp nitrous shot is very common on turbocharged applications. It's like making your intercooler 140% efficient instead of 70% more or less.
 
DSMJim said:
Thats a whole lot of science right there.

Ok here is what I'm talking about. I goto the dyno (this is real) with a car that is turbocharged with a single nossle nitrous kit from NX. The turbo alone the car makes 345whp and with a 50hp shot of nitrous the car makes 449whp. The 50hp shot made 100whp.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.


The cooling effect of nitrous on a turbocharged car is where the extra power comes from.

On another car that was NA with an NX nitrous kit, a 100hp shot made exactly 104hp and 136ft/lbs of torque. This was my fathers VQ30DE motor in his 95 Nissan Maxima that went 12.1 @ 109mph. We sprayed it with 150hp shot to get to that time.

I have been on the dyno with direct port and single nossle. Direct port does not make any more power than single nossle does at the same jetting level. I have sprayed cars as high as 200hp with a single nossle kit and recorded dyno runs with 200+hp increases across the band.

I try to not get that scientific with CFM and air flow etc etc.. What I know is because I goto the dyno an tune cars, have been there done that kinda thing. 100whp gains from 50hp nitrous shot is very common on turbocharged applications. It's like making your intercooler 140% efficient instead of 70% more or less.

the cooling effect is basically what i was talking about, i was just trying to explain how the cooling effect makes more power. but that was basically correct right?
 
GSGoinFast said:
the cooling effect is basically what i was talking about, i was just trying to explain how the cooling effect makes more power. but that was basically correct right?

NO YOUR WRONG :p , yup kinda makes sense altho dsmjim puts it more eloquently :laugh:
 
GSGoinFast said:
wah lah.

105whp stock? so your saying a 25% drivetrain loss? ok :rolleyes: then with the nitrous you say you go from 130whp to 170whp after drive train loss with a 75 shot? so now your saying a 46% drivetrain loss. manuals usually have 120hp to the wheels stock, or about 15% drivetrain loss. you say our cars make 105whp stock and you have 122whp with intake and 3" exauste? sooo almost 20hp from intake and exaust... come on...

so I'll adjust my figures a bit. come to think of it, a 2 horsepower gain from a way too big exhaust and intake is more resonable then 22, but no matter what I still have no torque and I already said my car is probably slower then a stock 2GNT (good thing I am getting rid of this car LOL... I think w/o cams 200whp on a 75 shot of nitrous is going to be very, very tough.
 
ok so on a turbo charged vehicle, the turbo setup will make that motor run warmer. how does it cool so good if everythign is run tht much hotter then a n/a motor.

dotn be afraid to get sceintific i can understand it. im tryign to get a better understanding of how it gets that effecient. i have seen proof so i do beleive you im just tryign to get a better understanding as i want to runa 150hp shot
 
na90dsm said:
ok so on a turbo charged vehicle, the turbo setup will make that motor run warmer. how does it cool so good if everythign is run tht much hotter then a n/a motor.

dotn be afraid to get sceintific i can understand it. im tryign to get a better understanding of how it gets that effecient. i have seen proof so i do beleive you im just tryign to get a better understanding as i want to runa 150hp shot

have you ever used one of those paintball guns with the 12 oz co2 canisters. even when there isnt enough left to power the gun, when you pop them out the remaining co2 comes out and the thing will frost over, and if you touch it it will be extremely cold and hurt. when a gas under emense pressure is released, it becomes incredibly cool. as to why that happens, well i dunno, but thats how it cools the hot turbo air and makes it more dense.
 
na90dsm said:
ok so on a turbo charged vehicle, the turbo setup will make that motor run warmer. how does it cool so good if everythign is run tht much hotter then a n/a motor.

dotn be afraid to get sceintific i can understand it. im tryign to get a better understanding of how it gets that effecient. i have seen proof so i do beleive you im just tryign to get a better understanding as i want to runa 150hp shot

It's not that the engine is hot, but that the air from the turbo is hot. When you have compressed air from a turbo it makes power, when it's super cold it makes even more power. Thats where the extra power comes from. The car is getting 20psi of boost and the air is -40* C instead of 170* C. It's sorta like a SUPER COLD air intake kinda thing except 10000x more effective. Same sort of thing as water injection but way better.
 
Dyno's mean nothing, your cars perform different under a load anyways. With the dyno the car isn't pulling it self on the road, it's on a rotating drum, with virtually no weight.
 
DSMJim said:
It's not that the engine is hot, but that the air from the turbo is hot. When you have compressed air from a turbo it makes power, when it's super cold it makes even more power. Thats where the extra power comes from. The car is getting 20psi of boost and the air is -40* C instead of 170* C. It's sorta like a SUPER COLD air intake kinda thing except 10000x more effective. Same sort of thing as water injection but way better.



also hense intercooler sprayer kits. i get ya now
 
i got 140hp according to stats :p and I have a CAI and I don't care what it does. I still see my car as 140hp (yes even with headers, exhaust all that bull shit) unless its turbo or any other type of forced induction.
 
ive been doing some math and with all the mods i plan on doing im estimating abotu 225hp. id like to get 200whp without nitrous or any forced induction but im gonan have to see about that. well see.
 
na90dsm said:
ive been doing some math and with all the mods i plan on doing im estimating abotu 225hp. id like to get 200whp without nitrous or any forced induction but im gonan have to see about that. well see.

its yet to be achieved, and unless your rich, and it isnt your daily driver it most likely wont be achieved. but if you wanna be the first then go for it. but i think he wants dyno numbers, and defiant just shut down another thread for bench racing so lets not get this closed.
 
dont know cant find my dyno sheet damn it...my dad did the dyno run...I was fishin....umm you tell me? because you guess is as good as mine..i would askhim but he has race's this week end in billings and is gone..never awnsers his damn cell eaither
 
na90dsm said:
ok so on a turbo charged vehicle, the turbo setup will make that motor run warmer. how does it cool so good if everythign is run tht much hotter then a n/a motor.

dotn be afraid to get sceintific i can understand it. im tryign to get a better understanding of how it gets that effecient. i have seen proof so i do beleive you im just tryign to get a better understanding as i want to runa 150hp shot


the science behind it comes frome the ideal gas law PV = nRT
P = pressure
V = volume
n = number of molecules
R = a constant
T = temperature in kelvin (degrees C + 273)

basically what is going on is, at a given pressure and volume, as temperature goes down, number of molecules goes up. ( more oxygen = more power capability) This is the whole point of having an intercooler and keeping the intake temps down.

Adam

p.s. this was my first post, hurray for me!!
 
fastcarfreak said:
the science behind it comes frome the ideal gas law PV = nRT
P = pressure
V = volume
n = number of molecules
R = a constant
T = temperature in kelvin (degrees C + 273)

basically what is going on is, at a given pressure and volume, as temperature goes down, number of molecules goes up. ( more oxygen = more power capability) This is the whole point of having an intercooler and keeping the intake temps down.

Adam

p.s. this was my first post, hurray for me!!

nice ressurection. the constant is .08062. or .08026. but i think its the first one.
 
I finally dynoed my car and i got 119 hp at 106 ftlbs of tourqe.It was 97 deegres in there and my car has 130 k miles. so go figure, got more moddin to do.sorry don't have a scanner or my cpu setup yet to show you guys but as soon as i can i will,however I do have a witness that in was there. ;)
 
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