Advice on the Easytune and BM1650's

[little-razcal]

I need some people to share our experience with the FIC easytune, particularly with the BM 1650'S. I know this is a discontinued product probably due in part to the popularity in the 2150's. I have a big build going on and have a set of BM1650's to use with my dual 044 HTA3586 setup. I would like to know if the easytune is going to be needed with these injectors, and if you haven't used it, how do these behave at throttle/cruising. I would of got the 2150's but E85 may not always be accessible to me and I may need to run a oxgenated race fuel. Would the easytune really make a difference with these injectors, or are these doable by themselves. I know the are supposed to be better than say the Bosch 1600's. If I am going to need an easytune, I would like to start looking for one now before I start having issues and while I have my harness directed for wiring purposes. Anybody with the 1650's with or without easytune, please chime in with your experiences. Thanks

Forgot to mention this is a weekend 93/meth car with E85/Race gas on race days.

Nobody runs Bluemax 1650's??? Even if you give the behavior of these injectors that would be helpful.

 

[little-razcal]

All these members and nobody runs these?

 

[BrokenTsi]

Call R.C.I. and ask him about FIC injectors and easy tune boxes. He's the former owner of FIC. The information he'll tell you will blow your mind.

His name is Frank. Race Components - R.C.I. Performance Parts and Acessories

Trust me, you'll want to hear it.

 

[olmytsi]

I've had the BM1550's in my car since August 2009 and I haven't had a single issue with daily driving or tuning. I just have dsmlink v2.5, nothing else, and I run e85.

 

[blackhawkgsx]

I currently have the BM1650 and part throttle is terrible im looking into getting the easy tune right now . Idle is fine but its when i get to 2500-3000 rpms it studders while cruising making it hard to get past 3400rpms...

 

[phunny]

I run 2150s on pump and I have a slight stutter right at 2500rpm but it goes away quick and isnt really noticeable. I also have a map for e85

 

[-red97rum-]

I've been running the BM1650's for close to a year I'd say. I've only ever ran them with E85 so I can't comment on pump gas. It took me a while to get them dialed in for idle and cruise but they work fine now.

One thing I noticed is these injectors need a shit load of dead time and voltage to get rid of the leaning out issues at part throttle. Even then they still act a little weird at initial tip in but it's totally acceptable. In the process of getting these injectors to work right I also found that I was having charging issues. I ran a "jumper" wire from the alternator straight to the battery which eliminated the voltage drop I was seeing and made the injectors behave a lot better. Since then I've ordered an amplifier rewire kit and I plan to replace the whole cable from the alternator to the fuse box to the battery.

 

[olmytsi]

High deadtime for sure! I'd say put the car together as is without the box, see how it works and then decide.

Also, if you're going to run e85, it's alot easier since you don't have to take out as much fuel.

 

[blackhawkgsx]

I've been running the BM1650's for close to a year I'd say. I've only ever ran them with E85 so I can't comment on pump gas. It took me a while to get them dialed in for idle and cruise but they work fine now.

How high was your dead time and what did you use for global ? I set my global to 71 using the calculator and I have had the dead time as high as 1400 with not much change in part throttle...

 

[MY1GDSM]

Is everyone buying these injectors second hand?
I was under the impression that they came with Flow & Injector Latency Sheets?

I run 1450's(I know not 1650, an at the limit of not needing a EastTune)But, I didn't have issue getting them dialed in with-out a sheet...That was on Gas as well before switching back to E85...

I don't use a standard deadtime value either though like I see other people doing an adjust deadtime Vs voltage... Someone local to me I almost bought a set of 1650's from(they maxed them & an I was to slow to get them) before getting my 1450's was running these without a Easytune an As far as I know they only had a little bit of a off/on "hiccup" that almost all large injectors do...

Also this is the first I've heard of these being discontinued? Are you sure your not getting them confused with the old Bosch/Ford 1600's?

 

[Jon91TSi]

I should be firing my car up for the first time this weekend with the 1550's. I'm not running an easytune box either.

Is everyone buying these injectors second hand?
I was under the impression that they came with Flow & Injector Latency Sheets?

I run 1450's(I know not 1650, an at the limit of not needing a EastTune)But, I didn't have issue getting them dialed in with-out a sheet...That was on Gas as well before switching back to E85...

I don't use a standard deadtime value either an adjust deadtime Vs voltage... Someone local to me I almost bought a set of 1650's from(they maxed them & an I was to slow to get them) before getting my 1450's was running these without a Easytune an As far as I know they only had a little bit of a off/on "hiccup" that almost all large injectors do...

Also this is the first I've heard of these being discontinued? Are you sure your not getting them confused with the old Bosch/Ford 1600's?

I bought mine new from FIC and they didn't come with a deadtime sheet, only the flow match sheet.

 

[-red97rum-]

How high was your dead time and what did you use for global ? I set my global to 71 using the calculator and I have had the dead time as high as 1400 with not much change in part throttle...

I have the base injector size set at 1275cc and dead times are around 1900@14v. I don't have my laptop with me to double check but it's right around what I listed.

*Edit: I bought mine second-hand so I didn't have any kind of reference sheet to go off of.

 

[blackhawkgsx]

Today I worked on the Voltage/deadtime and I have a very smooth Idle but part throttle is terrible from 3000+ rpms this is with 93 tomorrow I will be using e85 and seeing what happens from there.. btw this is on Bluemaxx 1650 my global was -61.1% deadtime 415

 

[olmytsi]

You should be running at least twice that in deadtime...try it.

 

[gsexxx]

Sorry to bring this thread back from the dead but I am having a similar issue dialing in my bluemax 1650's on e85. Currently, I have my global at -59% and deadtime at 980. My fueltrims hover around 0% at idle, however the rpms bounce around 950-1150 and sometimes the car almost dies. Also, while cruising they are hesitant around 2500-3000 rpms. Over the two years since someone has posted in this thread, has anyone found "the sweet spot" for deadtime with this injectors? I know every car is different, I just thought I would ask. Thanks a lot guys!

Here is a link to some recent logs: http://www.dsmlink.com/forums/showthread.php?p=623355#post623355

 

[Jon91TSi]

Sorry to bring this thread back from the dead but I am having a similar issue dialing in my bluemax 1650's on e85. Currently, I have my global at -59% and deadtime at 980. My fueltrims hover around 0% at idle, however the rpms bounce around 950-1150 and sometimes the car almost dies. Also, while cruising they are hesitant around 2500-3000 rpms. Over the two years since someone has posted in this thread, has anyone found "the sweet spot" for deadtime with this injectors? I know every car is different, I just thought I would ask. Thanks a lot guys!

Here is a link to some recent logs: ECMTuning User Support Forums

The problem lies with the DSM injector driving having trouble controling them at low pulsewidths. The problem you describe around 2500-3000 is where the injector goes beyond the .3-.4ms range and the ECU is then able to control them. There really is no way around it since we can't run a different injector driver like AEM, Halltech, etc. with Link. The easytune is a bandaid, but from what I understand the problem is still there somewhat. I went to Hi-Z 2150's and have no problem at all controling them. I have better idle and cruise than a 680.

 

[gsexxx]

The problem lies with the DSM injector driving having trouble controling them at low pulsewidths. The problem you describe around 2500-3000 is where the injector goes beyond the .3-.4ms range and the ECU is then able to control them. There really is no way around it since we can't run a different injector driver like AEM, Halltech, etc. with Link. The easytune is a bandaid, but from what I understand the problem is still there somewhat. I went to Hi-Z 2150's and have no problem at all controling them. I have better idle and cruise than a 680.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback! I got a really good deal on the 1650's so I would like to rock them if I can dial them in a little better. I can deal with the hesitation at higher rpms, I would just like to fix the "rpm bouncing" problem I am having at idle. From what I have read, people tend to add a lot of deadtime to get these injectors dialed in correctly. My deadtime is currently at 980 so I will try bumping it up to 1100 or so and lower the maf comp sliders in order to keep my fueltrims around 0%. Also, I received a suggestion to add more timing in the idle cells in the max octane table. I will play around with it tonight and see what happens. I will keep an eye out for a good deal on injectors as well. Thanks again for your help!

 

[MY1GDSM]

Wow this is getting to be an older thread

Figured I toss this out as well...

Anyone running any type of Maf still is going to always have issues or at least the most difficulty dealing with the issues that come with them.

The ability to be able to adjust to compensate for some of these larger injector characteristics is just not there as there are parts of the Injectors pulse width that are not at all linear and with a maf based setup you are going to have areas of load that would put you at the same airflow reading but going to require a different amount of Fueling. In turn only way to adjust for it is something like SD where you can control the fueling at specific load points.

 

[gsexxx]

Thanks for the info! I will be switching to sd this weekend so I will just leave it alone till then.