50 trim turbo FWD DYNO SHEETS?

[na90dsm]

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50 trim, pump gas.

i see need for intake mani. power falls off up top a hair. what boost was that on.

 

[redrkt]

Whoever said it had to be a PTE 50 trim?

 

[redrkt]

He has a smim, it's the turbo that's falling off up top. I think it was done at ~28-30 psi.

 

[anconover]

You can actually order the dre spec 50trim through AGP now in a full garret setup... But remember, 90% of the people who might buy 1; will never be able to tune a car to put down that kind of power on pump gas.

 

[definitiveno]

He has a smim, it's the turbo that's falling off up top. I think it was done at ~28-30 psi.

-30psi on pump 93? WTF?

 

[Violater101]

Exactly. He is definately running on the bitter edge with pumpgas on that car. All the props in the world to him on that car, but one false move and BOOM Being that i'm FWD, 350'ish is plenty on street tires.

 

[EclipseOwner95]

That is not your standard off the shelf 50trim BTW.....

So dont expect anywhere near those numbers on a standard 50trim.

Most ppl honestly should not plan to see over 375whp on pump gas on a 50trim, even with cams etc.

How can you say that ? A friend of mine put down over 400 on pump gas, on a stock 2g motor, running 24lbs, smim, cams, and the rest of the supporting mods, maybe dsmlink was the key, but he went 11.7 @ 120 on pump gas, full weight, power leather, 95 gsx.

 

[anconover]

How can i not say it? Good for your friend and all. But out of all the 50trim owners, which is alot since its the new fad, how many do you think are making over 375whp on pump? Sure you hear of a few, but thats only a TINY percentage of those who own one.

So i can clearly say. MOST shouldnt expect to see over 375whp. An incredible amount of people have little to no tuning knowledge and expect to learn it quick once they build theyre setup, and it never runs like it should.

 

[EnticivEclipse]

How can i not say it? Good for your friend and all. But out of all the 50trim owners, which is alot since its the new fad, how many do you think are making over 375whp on pump? Sure you hear of a few, but thats only a TINY percentage of those who own one.

So i can clearly say. MOST shouldnt expect to see over 375whp. An incredible amount of people have little to no tuning knowledge and expect to learn it quick once they build theyre setup, and it never runs like it should.

Anconover - Good post man.

As for people posting numbers for 16G turbos please dont as I have seen the numbers from the other thread. Please read the Subject.


Im really looking at whats the best setup for a 50 trim turbo, and to see whats the overall average numbers people are getting with their setup and what they did to get there. I know tuning plays major roll as is everything that you do to our cars and I know everyones car is different, but I just want to see some numbers.

 

[Violater101]

I would agree with you on the high pumpgas #'s. You always hear about this guy whose friends' buddy is making x amount of power. For my car, I don't think its out of the realm of possibilities that I could make 375 on pump. If I could get anymore timing out of this thing (14 deg) and dyno on a cooler day, I might have better results. I'm not to the point where I want to add a sheet metal intake to the car (just yet). Here's the log from that pull.


RPM Knock Timing AirFlowLb (Lb/min) FJOWB Speed
4551 * 0 * 8.2 * 26.7 * 11.1 * 65
4613 * 0 * 8.2 * 27.2 * 10.9 * 65.9
4658 * 0 * 8.9 * 27.3 * 11.2 * 65.9
4688 * 0 * 8.9 * 27.5 * 11 * 66.3
4753 * 0.4 * 8.9 * 27.7 * 10.9 * 66.7
4783 * 0.4 * 8.6 * 28 * 10.9 * 67.5
4826 * 0.7 * 8.2 * 28.6 * 11 * 67.9
4876 * 0.7 * 8.2 * 29 * 11.1 * 68.8
4934 * 0.7 * 9.3 * 29.6 * 10.9 * 69.2
4954 * 0.4 * 9.6 * 29.9 * 10.8 * 70.4
5020 * 0.4 * 9.6 * 30.4 * 10.9 * 71.2
5061 * 0.4 * 9.6 * 30.5 * 11 * 72.1
5088 * 0.4 * 9.6 * 31.1 * 10.9 * 72.5
5144 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 31.3 * 10.9 * 72.9
5201 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 31.8 * 10.8 * 74.1
5223 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 32.2 * 11.1 * 75
5282 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 33 * 11 * 75.8
5319 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 33.3 * 11.1 * 75.8
5365 * 0.4 * 10.7 * 33.6 * 10.8 * 76.2
5411 * 0.4 * 11.7 * 34 * 10.8 * 76.6
5466 * 0.7 * 11.7 * 34 * 10.9 * 77.4
5499 * 0.7 * 11.4 * 34.2 * 10.9 * 77.9
5531 * 0.7 * 11.4 * 34.2 * 10.8 * 79.1
5589 * 0.4 * 11.7 * 34.6 * 11 * 79.9
5648 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 35.1 * 10.9 * 80.8
5673 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 35.1 * 10.9 * 80.8
5725 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 35.4 * 11.1 * 80.8
5760 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 35.6 * 11 * 81.2
5805 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 35.9 * 11.1 * 81.6
5841 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 36 * 11.1 * 82.8
5887 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 36.4 * 10.9 * 83.7
5934 * 0.4 * 12.8 * 36.5 * 10.9 * 84.9
5990 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 36.7 * 11 * 85.3
6029 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 36.7 * 10.8 * 85.7
6048 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 37 * 10.9 * 85.7
6107 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 37.2 * 10.9 * 86.6
6148 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 37.7 * 10.8 * 87.4
6198 * 0 * 14.2 * 37.9 * 10.9 * 88.6
6219 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 38.2 * 10.9 * 89
6271 * 0.7 * 13.1 * 38.6 * 10.9 * 89.5
6303 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 38.6 * 10.8 * 89.5
6345 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 38.7 * 10.7 * 89.5
6378 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 39 * 10.8 * 90.7
6421 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 39.3 * 10.8 * 91.9
6477 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 39.6 * 10.7 * 92.4
6488 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 39.7 * 10.6 * 91.5
6545 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 39.9 * 10.9 * 91.9
6579 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 40 * 10.7 * 93.2
6614 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 40.1 * 10.7 * 94.4
6637 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 40.1 * 10.7 * 94.4
6684 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 40.2 * 10.6 * 94.4
6720 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.2 * 10.7 * 94.4
6745 * 0.4 * 13.5 * 40.3 * 10.7 * 95.7
6806 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.4 * 10.8 * 96.9
6831 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.3 * 10.8 * 98.2
6868 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.3 * 10.9 * 98.2
6906 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.5 * 10.8 * 98.2
6932 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 40.5 * 11 * 99
6957 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 40.6 * 10.8 * 99.8
6996 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 40.8 * 11 * 100.6
7022 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 40.9 * 10.9 * 100.6
7062 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 40.9 * 10.8 * 100.6
7102 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 41.1 * 10.8 * 100.6
7129 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 41.2 * 10.9 * 101.1
7170 * 1.1 * 13.1 * 41.2 * 10.9 * 101.5
7184 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.1 * 10.8 * 103.1
7239 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.4 * 10.8 * 104.4
7267 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.3 * 10.8 * 104.4
7282 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.2 * 10.9 * 103.1
7324 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.1 * 10.8 * 103.1
7353 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.2 * 10.8 * 104.4
7396 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.3 * 10.8 * 105.6
7411 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.3 * 10.7 * 106
7426 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.3 * 10.8 * 106.4
7485 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.4 * 10.8 * 106.9
7515 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.4 * 10.9 * 106.9
7530 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.5 * 10.8 * 106.9
7545 * 0.7 * 13.5 * 41.3 * 10.7 * 106.9
7591 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.4 * 10.9 * 107.7
7606 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.3 * 10.8 * 108.5
7653 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.4 * 10.8 * 109.3
7669 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.2 * 10.8 * 109.3
7700 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.4 * 10.6 * 109.3
7716 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.2 * 10.8 * 109.3
7748 * 0.4 * 13.5 * 41.1 * 10.8 * 110.2
7764 * 0.4 * 13.9 * 41.3 * 10.9 * 111

 

[redrkt]

How can i not say it? Good for your friend and all. But out of all the 50trim owners, which is alot since its the new fad, how many do you think are making over 375whp on pump? Sure you hear of a few, but thats only a TINY percentage of those who own one.

So i can clearly say. MOST shouldnt expect to see over 375whp. An incredible amount of people have little to no tuning knowledge and expect to learn it quick once they build theyre setup, and it never runs like it should.

I'd agree, you can have all the parts in the world, but without knowledge to tune you aren't going to be able to get the most out of your setup. Often you will see people with big turbo setups not even running as fast as a well tuned 16g car.

However, i think people should expect to see what the turbo is capable of if they decide to buy it. The 50 trim turbo is very capable of making 400whp on pump gas and up to 500whp on race gas with cams and the rest of supporting mods even on a stock engine, for the knowledgeable people out there. If the person lacks the knowledge, they should pay someone to tune for them.

 

[Violater101]

Very well said. And the problem with not being able to tune is your car can be dead on at the dyno, then you go to the track and it's a totally different animal which require adjustments.

 

[definitiveno]

I'd agree, you can have all the parts in the world, but without knowledge to tune you aren't going to be able to get the most out of your setup. Often you will see people with big turbo setups not even running as fast as a well tuned 16g car.

However, i think people should expect to see what the turbo is capable of if they decide to buy it. The 50 trim turbo is very capable of making 400whp on pump gas and up to 500whp on race gas with cams and the rest of supporting mods even on a stock engine, for the knowledgeable people out there. If the person lacks the knowledge, they should pay someone to tune for them.

[voice from mxc] Right you are ken[/voice from mxc]

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[destruckeclipse]

Very well said. And the problem with not being able to tune is your car can be dead on at the dyno, then you go to the track and it's a totally different animal which require adjustments.

My thoughts too. Whats the point of it if you can only adjust it to one enviroment? I would rather pay someone to teach me or just practice on the stock turbo.

 

[yo2001]

I made 356fwhp at 19-20 psi on a dynojet last summer. Just bring up the old thread

 

[BGGSTin]

Quick question guys, I don't have a 50 but a Evo 3 but I have a HP question.
Okay, lets say you had somwhere around 320 horsepower and your boost was increased by 8 psi from what it's to be around 320. Do you guys have any guesses as to where I would be setting HP wise then?

 

[daren_p]

Quick question guys, I don't have a 50 but a Evo 3 but I have a HP question.
Okay, lets say you had somwhere around 320 horsepower and your boost was increased by 8 psi from what it's to be around 320. Do you guys have any guesses as to where I would be setting HP wise then?

Well they usually figure 1 psi is equal to about 10 hp, so that should be about 80 more hp. But thats not always the case, if you make 320 hp on the evoIII, you would probably be running atleast 20 psi to start with, so you have a bunch of other things to deal with, such as effiency range of the turbo, knock, blowing your stock motor apart, etc.

 

[vertGST]

friend of mine on here made 380 fwhp on pump with 22 psi i think on an agp 50 trim. stock internals, cams, etc. It's all in teh tuning.

He ran a 13.2 with 18" wheels and bobo tires

 

[GPTourer]

Okay, so it looks like a 25-50hp increase based on the few examples shown here over an EvoIII pump gas street car. Which is about what a good 20G setup will net you. I still don't see what all the hype is about.

 

[slowboy93]

well don't know horse power on my dre spec 50 trim
but i run race gas and last time at track it ran 6.99 and 6.97
in 1\8 mile at local track and that is on 26 psi
only tuning i had is a dsm chip from Jeff O
i had the super afc just zero out
didn't get to make many passes motor broke

i thought about selling it i want to go with t4 set up if any body
might be interested in it
i paid almost 1900 dollars with shipping(1850+shipping0

 

[BGGSTin]

Well they usually figure 1 psi is equal to about 10 hp, so that should be about 80 more hp. But thats not always the case, if you make 320 hp on the evoIII, you would probably be running atleast 20 psi to start with, so you have a bunch of other things to deal with, such as effiency range of the turbo, knock, blowing your stock motor apart, etc.

Yeah I'm trying to break the 400 barrier with the EVO on my GST and I'll be happy, your right about boost levels too. I ran ~320hp @ ~21psi and I've had it creep on the street up to 1.9bar (~28psi). I'm leary about this because like you said, stock internals and such + almost 30psi on pump I'll try to make a pull and post it on how bad the knock is when its creeping, but I never really intend on it going that high, it just happens; for some odd reason

 

[blcknspo0ln]

creeping to 28 is rediculous mildly ported my old evo would only creep to ~24 psi. extensive porting held her 20 to redline

 

[BGGSTin]

Yes and I have absolutely no clue why it's doing so.... I have an external gate and dump on the O2, the Evo is ported and I have a full 3" exhaust from the 2.5" stainless 02 housing back.

 

[GSTeclipse]

I had a completly stock 7 bolt motor (stock bottom end , stock head, stock cams , stock intake manifold , stock TB )

I had a AGP RS49 which is a 50 trim turbo Internal gated
at 20psi pump gas I made 329whp on my 1st and only pull never got a chance to do any more pulls becuase it was a dyno day for Darrell Cox (neon boy's) they had a mess up and where fixing there's and they let me on the dyno till they fixed the problem but I remeber I was lean on the wideband I think it was a 12.5 or so as soon as I left I gave the car 5% more fuel accross on the afc and the car did run a little better

other mods where
ported and polished 2g exhaust manifold
3 inch RNR 02 eliminator down pipe with atmosphere dump
3 inch Thermal cat back
RRE intercooler with custom intercooler piping 20x10.5x3
8.5mm magnecore wires with BPR7es plugs gapped at .26
PTE680 cc injectors
B&M FPR
Walboro 255 HP fuel pump
AFC 1
ACT 2600 clutch
Fadanza flywheel
Greddy type R bov
2g eprom ecu with tmo stage 3 chip

The best I could run in the 1/4 mile was a 13.0 @ 115.xx with street tires which where a 205/55/16 on rota slip streams

 

[speedy13]

friend of mine on here made 380 fwhp on pump with 22 psi i think on an agp 50 trim. stock internals, cams, etc. It's all in teh tuning.

He ran a 13.2 with 18" wheels and bobo tires

Don't forget the water alki injection too,that helped out.Ahh... the Dyno days in Florida,those were the good ol days.