New Member From Uk With Fp Red / Black Questions?

[Luke Evo]

Ok so looking for a turbo to make 500+ BHP On Just high octane fuel i live in the U.K So Fuel here is around 97 upto 102 Ron, (Will not be running Meth/E85) i have a Evo 1-3 Rebuilt With Forged Internals with kelford 272 cams an uprated valvetrain etcetc... V.Long list but that's all that is important i guess pistons & rods Rated to 600+Hp Applications.
Currently Running a TD05 20g - Makes about 420 Bhp Max before blowing hot air
Plan is to run Os Giken Twin Plate & Buy Either FP RED Or BLACK

Looking for 500-600 BHP NOT WHP But is for a daily driven car & street racing so ideally not up for a lot of lag!
I want a nice powerband i can raise my RPM Limiter if i need to no problem i don't think also running a Evo5 Ecu

Have been told
On a 2 liter DSM / Evo 1-3 motor, full boost on an FP RED should be around 4500RPM and will pull through 9000RPM. The FP BLACK for DSM on a 2.0 liter motor should have full boost by 5000RPM and pull through 9500RPM.

All help massively appreciated, also anyone got any dyno graphs or more detailed info for me would be grand

 

[Luke Evo]

Main Interest Is What Is Best For A 600 BHP Not WHP Setup i would not want to rev past 9000 myself even with uprated head Seems a bit harsh

What do you run FP RED / BLACK & What do you get BHP @ What Boost On PUMP GAS ONLY as you guys say

 

[fastfred]

This is my car. I think you should look into the green/red not the black.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/fp-red-hta-421whp-on-pump-gas.483065/

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/updated-fp-red-hta-numbers-501awhp.485268/

 

[Luke Evo]

Thanks fastfred i'm so confused by the AWHP when the 1st 421 Dyno Graph states engine power not wheel power... Which i imagine 421BHP would be about 345WHP
V.Grateful for those links i think i will get the Black to be safe? But don't want to overkill it as 421WHP would be about 515BHP So confused

Also Regarding FP Turbo & Manifold What Gains Can Be Got From Getting Both Ported...Is It Really Worth It?

 

[GSLENK]

So Fuel here is around 97 upto 102 Ron,

if 102ron=~97oct US then I think you should be looking at the red or black, and stick with 102ron. 97ron =91-93oct US probably won't be good enough to see your goals.

500hp and "not a lot of lag" do NOT belong in the same sentence. Besides, you can extend your redline. Red starts whooping serious ass at 5k rpm. if you can last till 8500, that should be more than enough. You could even skip gears and stay in the power band the entire time.

 

[fastfred]

^ I agree with gslenk. I somehow missed the 600 part.

Its just how the graph is worded. The 421 was all wheel horsepower on 93 octane pump gas. The second link was on 110 octane race gas it was 501 awhp. I dont think you can really get base engine horsepower on a chassis dyno.

I would suggest porting them it will just make it easier to get to your goal. But it is not a must. My red hit 26psi(full boost on pump) @43-4500 since my smim install it hits 32/33psi (race gas) around 46-4700 and makes power as high is I have taken the engine (8500) easily.

 

[91_talon_tsi_awd]

Subbed

 

[Luke Evo]

Just to state again, Engine Trq & Power is NOT Wheel Power.... According those Dyno Graphs There Engine Power / Torque NOT Wheel is my point?.... By all means correct me if i'm wrong as i said if you can explain how that is actually Wheel Power Then That means the engine power would be significantly more?[DOUBLEPOST=1412769995][/DOUBLEPOST]Ok So i'll be happy to REV to 8500-9000 If needs be and am looking on getting 500-600 BHP / ENGINE FLYWHEEL POWER which i think would convert to about 410-490 at the wheels! Thanks for the help tho guys over here Dyno's say Engine Power Means At the flywheel Not Actual real wheels [DOUBLEPOST=1412771035][/DOUBLEPOST]Am i right in just you guys in america use whp an convert to fly an us in uk use flywheel an convert to whp?[DOUBLEPOST=1412815900][/DOUBLEPOST]Also interested in thoughts on
http://www.punishment-racing.com/punishment-racing-turbo-kit-for-eclipse-talon-1990-99/
Over the Fp Red / Black Turbo?

 

[fastfred]

Im trying to tell you man, dont worry about the words on the sheet. It was on a mustang awd CHASSIS dyno, that is MY car not a video i found on the internet or a link i copy and pasted. The words are just labels so you know the difference between the 2. Im not trying to be a dick but you are hung up on the wording on the paper when it doesnt matter.

No you are wrong, We dont convert power from flywheel to wheels in america its not accurate. You wanna know motor power you hook the motor up to a engine dyno. You wanna know Wheel power you take the car to a chassis dyno.

Yes engine power will be more than wheel power.

 

[Luke Evo]

Ok cool fastfred thanks for clearing that up is really quite impressive have you had any more rpm out of it since? as seems bit low Rpm range? Comes in nice an hard tho!!! looks like is from 4300RPM - 6400RPM BOOOOST any you tube vids of your car driving?

 

[fastfred]

I have been to 8500, the power doesn't feel to be dropping at all. That graph was from my pump gas tune. The rpm's in the dyno pull video in the second link were a little higher, that was with race gas and a JMF smim. I just haven't gotten around to getting the graph from that session up. This is also just a street car I drive in the summer, so I don't push the car to its limits. I did track the car 2 times this year though. I am determined to hit a certain 1/4 time, when it does it will go back to a street only car.
I don't have any videos as of now. I think I'm gonna take a few before I store the car for the year, it's starting to get cold and I always store after the first snowflake. I just got a go-pro and can't wait to get it out though.

 

[Luke Evo]

Cool man you on Facebook?... Add me
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100008109100284

Anyone with a fast car is welcome to add me we all have something in common

 

[fastfred]

I don't have facebook. I actually don't have any social media this site is about as social as I get. good luck with your car though.

 

[GSLENK]

Thanks for the help tho guys over here Dyno's say Engine Power Means At the flywheel Not Actual real wheels

Am i right in just you guys in america use whp an convert to fly an us in uk use flywheel an convert to whp?[DOUBLEPOST=1412815900][/DOUBLEPOST]Also interested in thoughts on
http://www.punishment-racing.com/punishment-racing-turbo-kit-for-eclipse-talon-1990-99/
Over the Fp Red / Black Turbo?

I am going to build off of what fastfred said, he is right.

All car manufacturers state their HP in Flywheel or Crank HP as they probably design their engines on an actual engine dyno. This is true in the US, and based on your comments, I presume it is standard in the UK.

ANYWHERE you take your CAR to get dyno'd will measure power at the WHEELS, unless they pull your engine. By nature that machine gets some data or raw numbers. Then the data is converted to some power level. Since power was measured at the wheels, it only makes sense that the power is stated as at the wheels.

Different dynos use different "conversion factors". Mustang-Dyno (the brand, not car model) typically read most accurately to the wheels. Dynojet typically have some drivetrain loss factor to inflate numbers and cannot possibly be accurate. Most places assume a .2 to .25 loss through the drivetrain and multiply by the inverse to obtain a "flywheel HP". You should now see why that is ridiculous to do. Besides, WHP is all that matters, since drivetrain varies so much car to car, make to make etc...

I also feel you are too hung up on numbers...

"how fast does your dyno-sheet trap?"